The Iran War (was Nuclear Program) thread

[Mik]

As I said, this should have been done while W was in office. I supported it then and i support it now.

[Renauda]

In principle, I support the stated objective to put an end to Iran’s nuclear ambitions and reduce its overall military threat to the region. What I don’t support is how it is being presented and executed.

[jon-nyc]

I think there’s much more of a case for regime change in Iran than there was for Iraq in 2003. And it comes down to its jihadist nature and ambitions. I don’t think we (the civilized world) can coexist long term with that regime.

So yeah, regime change must be the goal.

My fear is that Trump will leave them intact but wounded and very pissed off and all the more determined, in the fullness of time, to take over the world for Shia Islam in which case it would have been better to not have attempted it at all.

I was cautiously hopeful on March 1st. Now I’m more pessimistic.

[jon-nyc]

That’s not to say I think they’d ever be successful in taking over the world, but their strategy of creating armed proxies in many neighboring states can be globalized, and there’s evidence they are trying or have tried to do it in Europe and Latin America.

[Renauda]

@jon-nyc

Agree. Unless there is regime change in Iran, I do not see any of the stated objectives being realized in the long term. As I have already stated back in March, the Israelis understand that regime change is fundamental to achieving any of the short term military and long term political objectives. Likewise, I would think, in the US but that realisation is subordinated to other factors related to personalities and limited competencies at the very top of its civilian chain of command.

[Axtremus]

In the US, the general population also does not support regime change as the ultimate goal, regardless of who sits in the White House or which party controls Congress.

I suspect that is true also for most EU and NATO countries.

[bachophile]

the fear is that may come bcak to bite them in the ass, and then there will be breast beating saying how did we not see it

[Renauda]

@Axtremus said:

In the US, the general population also does not support regime change as the ultimate goal, regardless of who sits in the White House or which party controls Congress.

I suspect that is true also for most EU and NATO countries.

Don’t get me wrong, the ultimate goal is to stop Iran from building nuclear weapons and wage war abroad through proxies. Regime change is fundamental to achieving both those objectives. If the general population of Western democracies can’t wrap their head around that, their respective governments aren’t doing their job effectively.

[Mik]

I cannot help but wonder what would have happened had we attacked Iran's nuclear and military facilities in 2003 instead of invading Iraq. Hussein was a bad actor but was governed by self-interest. Not so the Iranian regime.

[taiwan_girl]

The United States will launch an effort on Monday to “guide” stranded ships from the Iran-gripped Strait of Hormuz , President Donald Trump said, giving few details about what could be a sweeping effort to help hundreds of vessels and some 20,000 seafarers.

Trump said in a social media post on Sunday that “neutral and innocent” countries have been affected by the Iran war , and “we have told these Countries that we will guide their Ships safely out of these restricted Waterways, so that they can freely and ably get on with their business.”

“Project Freedom” would begin on Monday morning in the Middle East, Trump said, adding that his representatives are having discussions with Iran that could lead to something “very positive for all.”

U.S. Central Command said the initiative would involve guided-missile destroyers, more than 100 aircraft and 15,000 service members. The Pentagon did not immediately answer questions about how they would be deployed.

https://apnews.com/article/iran-us-war-ceasefire-negotiations-strait-454006a0a9bb19a45a2f299c0869cefb