Trump's reaction to losing
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wrote on 7 Nov 2020, 04:52 last edited by
Access means nothing, if nobody trusts the results.
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@Jolly you put a lot of emphasis on "security" but virtually none on "access".
Faith in the electoral system will also crumble if a large enough swath of the population cannot cast their votes.
The logistical challenges of running an election with 76MM voters (1932), 120MM voters (1968), 182MM voters (1988), and 239MM voters (2020) are not the same. Transit technologies and infrastructure change over time and access to transportation change over time. War, natural disasters, and pandemics will necessitate changes from time to time.
Want to get rid of mail-in voting? Fine, only when easy access to polling stations of sufficient vote processing capacities are available. Commit to guaranteeing that no one has to travel more than X miles to get to a polling station or wait more than Y minutes in line to cast a vote at a polling station, then we can talk about eliminating mail-in voting.
Otherwise, let's say we allow only in-person voting and put only one polling station in each state, logically located where the population is most dense such that it is "shortest distance" for the most people to get there in person, and see how the country/rural folks like it.
wrote on 7 Nov 2020, 04:55 last edited by@Axtremus said in Trump's reaction to losing:
@Jolly you put a lot of emphasis on "security" but virtually none on "access".
Faith in the electoral system will also crumble if a large enough swath of the population cannot cast their votes.
The logistical challenges of running an election with 76MM voters (1932), 120MM voters (1968), 182MM voters (1988), and 239MM voters (2020) are not the same. Transit technologies and infrastructure change over time and access to transportation change over time. War, natural disasters, and pandemics will necessitate changes from time to time.
Want to get rid of mail-in voting? Fine, only when easy access to polling stations of sufficient vote processing capacities are available. Commit to guaranteeing that no one has to travel more than X miles to get to a polling station or wait more than Y minutes in line to cast a vote at a polling station, then we can talk about eliminating mail-in voting.
Otherwise, let's say we allow only in-person voting and put only one polling station in each state, logically located where the population is most dense such that it is "shortest distance" for the most people to get there in person, and see how the country/rural folks like it.
Oh for Pete's sake. Have you EVER had an original thought? You just repeat the democrat bull shit propaganda all the time. There is no problem with access.
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wrote on 7 Nov 2020, 17:45 last edited by
@Jolly This Presidency is ending the same way as it started - accusations of voter fraud.
He had 4 years and all the resources of the federal government to run that one down.
He didn't. Without evidence, he has zero credibility here.
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@Jolly This Presidency is ending the same way as it started - accusations of voter fraud.
He had 4 years and all the resources of the federal government to run that one down.
He didn't. Without evidence, he has zero credibility here.
wrote on 7 Nov 2020, 17:49 last edited by@xenon said in Trump's reaction to losing:
resources of the federal government
They were busy investigating RUSSIA!!
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wrote on 7 Nov 2020, 23:26 last edited by
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@Jolly said in Trump's reaction to losing:
It's broken. There are millions of people who no longer trust the ballot box.
You cannot put the genie back in the box.
As I said Perhaps Trump’s biggest legacy.
wrote on 7 Nov 2020, 23:28 last edited by@jon-nyc said in Trump's reaction to losing:
@Jolly said in Trump's reaction to losing:
It's broken. There are millions of people who no longer trust the ballot box.
You cannot put the genie back in the box.
As I said Perhaps Trump’s biggest legacy.
So convenient. But your hatred really was the first one.
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wrote on 8 Nov 2020, 00:53 last edited by
@Jolly said in Trump's reaction to losing:
Access means nothing, if nobody trusts the results.
Democracy means nothing of there is no access.
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@Jolly said in Trump's reaction to losing:
Access means nothing, if nobody trusts the results.
Democracy means nothing of there is no access.
wrote on 8 Nov 2020, 01:07 last edited by Jolly 11 Aug 2020, 01:08@Axtremus said in Trump's reaction to losing:
@Jolly said in Trump's reaction to losing:
Access means nothing, if nobody trusts the results.
Democracy means nothing of there is no access.
It has been my observation, that the folks in the Soviet Union had an awful lot of access. Routine turnout was greater than 90%, wasn't it?
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@Axtremus said in Trump's reaction to losing:
@Jolly said in Trump's reaction to losing:
Access means nothing, if nobody trusts the results.
Democracy means nothing of there is no access.
It has been my observation, that the folks in the Soviet Union had an awful lot of access. Routine turnout was greater than 90%, wasn't it?
wrote on 8 Nov 2020, 01:24 last edited by@Jolly said in Trump's reaction to losing:
@Axtremus said in Trump's reaction to losing:
@Jolly said in Trump's reaction to losing:
Access means nothing, if nobody trusts the results.
Democracy means nothing of there is no access.
It has been my observation, that the folks in the Soviet Union had an awful lot of access. Routine turnout was greater than 90%, wasn't it?
Which tells you the importance of access. Even authoritarian regime has to go to great lengths to manufacture the appearance of high turnout to fake legitimacy.
Russia has a different access problem: viable oppositions have no access to the ballot itself — they cannot get their names onto the ballot.
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wrote on 8 Nov 2020, 01:33 last edited by
In other words, ballot security should take precedence over ballot access.
People who feel cheated out of their votes , eventually rectify that problem. It tends to be a messy affair when they do.
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In other words, ballot security should take precedence over ballot access.
People who feel cheated out of their votes , eventually rectify that problem. It tends to be a messy affair when they do.
wrote on 8 Nov 2020, 01:35 last edited by Axtremus 11 Aug 2020, 01:36@Jolly said in Trump's reaction to losing:
In other words, ballot security should take precedence over ballot access.
Not at all.
People who feel cheated out of their votes , eventually rectify that problem. It tends to be a messy affair when they do.
You feel cheated more immediately if you do not even get to cast a vote.
Or, for that matter, when you are prohibited from voting for the person you want to vote for.
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wrote on 8 Nov 2020, 01:38 last edited by
Wrong.
If the ballot is secure, it means something.
You can have access all day long, but if your ballot gets no further than the dumpster, it means nothing.
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Wrong.
If the ballot is secure, it means something.
You can have access all day long, but if your ballot gets no further than the dumpster, it means nothing.
wrote on 8 Nov 2020, 01:41 last edited by@Jolly said in Trump's reaction to losing:
Wrong.
If the ballot is secure, it means something.
You can have access all day long, but if your ballot gets no further than the dumpster, it means nothing.
Wrong. You have to be able to vote first before there is even such a thing as “your vote” to go anywhere.
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wrote on 8 Nov 2020, 01:45 last edited by
If you know your ballot doesn't count, you don't care about access.
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wrote on 8 Nov 2020, 01:49 last edited by
@Jolly said in Trump's reaction to losing:
If you know your ballot doesn't count, you don't care about access.
There is no “security” for your vote to speak of if you cannot cast a vote in the first place.
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wrote on 8 Nov 2020, 01:50 last edited by
There is no security with fascists, anyway.
See "Trump List Project".
Those are your buddies, not mine...
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wrote on 8 Nov 2020, 02:28 last edited by
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wrote on 8 Nov 2020, 03:37 last edited by
Jolly, he's a fool. You can't win an argument with a fool. All you can do with a fool is treat him like the fool he is.
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wrote on 8 Nov 2020, 10:59 last edited by Jolly 11 Aug 2020, 10:59
Kind of like a drunk in a bar?
You either walk away or beat the hell out of him?
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wrote on 8 Nov 2020, 12:22 last edited by
@jon-nyc said in Trump's reaction to losing:
I wasn't on this forum in 2000, but that could be a picture of Al Gore, couldn't it?