Texas shooting.

[Jolly]

@Doctor-Phibes said in Texas shooting.:

@Jolly said in Texas shooting.:

@Doctor-Phibes said in Texas shooting.:

@Horace said in Texas shooting.:

@Jolly said in Texas shooting.:

There's been some talk of Red Flag laws being an area of compromise.

All right, Dems. Make you a deal...This last shooter was transgendered. Let's go back to the future and label transgendered people as mentally ill and red flag their 4473.

I haven’t seen anything about the shooter’s self identification. Where are you seeing that?

Apparently, a rumour started on 4Chan. According to this article, it's bogus.

https://www.nbcnews.com/nbc-out/out-news/trans-womans-photo-used-spread-baseless-online-theory-texas-shooter-rcna30511

Ok, if it's bogus, it's bogus.

Now, I still consider transgendered teenagers to be mentally ill. Mentally ill people should not be allowed to purchase firearms.

How's that?

I'd be perfectly OK with teenagers of any persuasion not being allowed to purchase firearms period.

They're not allowed to buy a beer - why stop there?

Actually, the law usually runs 18 for long arms, 21 for handguns.

You avoided the mentally ill question, which is a hard question to answer...

[AndyD]

The continuing gulf in opinion is astounding. "No common ground, no compromise"

[Copper]

No compromise?

Compare the laws and school security between today and 20 years ago.

It is a story of cooperation.

And a story of screaming media louts.

[Doctor Phibes]

@Jolly said in Texas shooting.:

@Doctor-Phibes said in Texas shooting.:

@Jolly said in Texas shooting.:

@Doctor-Phibes said in Texas shooting.:

@Horace said in Texas shooting.:

@Jolly said in Texas shooting.:

There's been some talk of Red Flag laws being an area of compromise.

All right, Dems. Make you a deal...This last shooter was transgendered. Let's go back to the future and label transgendered people as mentally ill and red flag their 4473.

I haven’t seen anything about the shooter’s self identification. Where are you seeing that?

Apparently, a rumour started on 4Chan. According to this article, it's bogus.

https://www.nbcnews.com/nbc-out/out-news/trans-womans-photo-used-spread-baseless-online-theory-texas-shooter-rcna30511

Ok, if it's bogus, it's bogus.

Now, I still consider transgendered teenagers to be mentally ill. Mentally ill people should not be allowed to purchase firearms.

How's that?

I'd be perfectly OK with teenagers of any persuasion not being allowed to purchase firearms period.

They're not allowed to buy a beer - why stop there?

Actually, the law usually runs 18 for long arms, 21 for handguns.

You avoided the mentally ill question, which is a hard question to answer...

I don't really see the point of picking on that particular minority as such. Have they been shown to be more likely to kill people than other gun owners?

I do know that people use the term 'mentally ill' to cover a wide variety of conditions, but like the woman said, I'm not a psychiatrist.

[89th]

@Mik said in Texas shooting.:

@Doctor-Phibes said in Texas shooting.:

@Mik said in Texas shooting.:

My question is how did he get in? We have gone to two local schools this week. Both of them required we be buzzed in.

If you were a former pupil, it probably wouldn't be that difficult to beat most school security. When I go, it's not exactly Fort Knox.

Not buying that. Why would a shady looking 18 year old have any business in an elementary school? His backpack alone would have set off my alarms, not to mention he just shot his grandmother and wrecked a truck. He’s not going to be normal acting.

From a clip I saw, he ran into the building quickly. Not sure if he drove there or what. Sounds like it was an unlocked emergency exit door of a vacant classroom, that was adjacent to the 4th grade classroom where he did all the damage.

[89th]

There is an NRA Convention in Houston this weekend. Odds of speakers like Abbott, Cruz, and Trump canceling? Odds of there being violence outside with clashing protesters?

[Jolly]

@Doctor-Phibes said in Texas shooting.:

@Jolly said in Texas shooting.:

@Doctor-Phibes said in Texas shooting.:

@Jolly said in Texas shooting.:

@Doctor-Phibes said in Texas shooting.:

@Horace said in Texas shooting.:

@Jolly said in Texas shooting.:

There's been some talk of Red Flag laws being an area of compromise.

All right, Dems. Make you a deal...This last shooter was transgendered. Let's go back to the future and label transgendered people as mentally ill and red flag their 4473.

I haven’t seen anything about the shooter’s self identification. Where are you seeing that?

Apparently, a rumour started on 4Chan. According to this article, it's bogus.

https://www.nbcnews.com/nbc-out/out-news/trans-womans-photo-used-spread-baseless-online-theory-texas-shooter-rcna30511

Ok, if it's bogus, it's bogus.

Now, I still consider transgendered teenagers to be mentally ill. Mentally ill people should not be allowed to purchase firearms.

How's that?

I'd be perfectly OK with teenagers of any persuasion not being allowed to purchase firearms period.

They're not allowed to buy a beer - why stop there?

Actually, the law usually runs 18 for long arms, 21 for handguns.

You avoided the mentally ill question, which is a hard question to answer...

I don't really see the point of picking on that particular minority as such. Have they been shown to be more likely to kill people than other gun owners?

I do know that people use the term 'mentally ill' to cover a wide variety of conditions, but like the woman said, I'm not a psychiatrist.

Pick another minority. It doesn't matter. The essential question boils down to who is mentally ill and at what point do we take their Constitutional rights away from them?

[Catseye3]

@Copper said in Texas shooting.:

I assume she has a well-armed bodyguard who would actually do the punching

"And I swear to God, if I see another Republican senator talk about their heart being broken I'ma go punch somebody!" she declared. "I can't take thoughts and prayers. If your thoughts and prayers were really with everybody, you'da done something by now."

Later in the show, co-host Ana Navarro suggested Republicans redirect their "thoughts and prayers" elsewhere.

"I hope they roll up their little thoughts and prayers into a suppository and find what to do with it," she said.

Thus do we advance another small step toward a flawless state of perfect partisanship as never before seen.

Congratulations, ladies.

[mark]

Have we even considered locking down the schools with armed guards? As much as that idea sickens me, dead school children, sickens me more.

Back in the 1970s we bitched and protested because they installed a chain link fence around our high school. It was meant to stop students from leaving school and crossing the road during the lunch hour to go to their cars and smoke. We were livid! We called it a prison, police state, etc.

So, I don't take putting armed guards in the school lightly. Like I said the idea sickens me, but how else can we protect the schools?

We know that trying to take the guns out of circulation is just not possible. Access to anything is possible to anyone willing to do whatever it takes to get something.

It's like we have no other choice at this time to really protect the schools.

It does nothing for workplaces, or public events and attractions.

[Mik]

@89th said in Texas shooting.:

@Mik said in Texas shooting.:

@Doctor-Phibes said in Texas shooting.:

@Mik said in Texas shooting.:

My question is how did he get in? We have gone to two local schools this week. Both of them required we be buzzed in.

If you were a former pupil, it probably wouldn't be that difficult to beat most school security. When I go, it's not exactly Fort Knox.

Not buying that. Why would a shady looking 18 year old have any business in an elementary school? His backpack alone would have set off my alarms, not to mention he just shot his grandmother and wrecked a truck. He’s not going to be normal acting.

From a clip I saw, he ran into the building quickly. Not sure if he drove there or what. Sounds like it was an unlocked emergency exit door of a vacant classroom, that was adjacent to the 4th grade classroom where he did all the damage.

There's your problem then.

[Axtremus]

I have been paying more attention to local school funding and bond proposal discussions in recent years. There are no lack of proposals to beef up school security, bringing in updated security-conscious design concepts and such, along with the architects’ estimates telling you how much each element of these school building updates will cost. (Spoiler alert: they are not cheap.) Still, even if you secure all the building, kids still have to “come to school” in the morning, “leave the school” after the school day is done, go to the outdoor field for sports and physical education classes … still lots of outdoor, near-the-school concentrations of school children being exposed multiple times every day. Building a security bubble around the school is a tough problem to solve.

[Mik]

True enough, but that does not mean we should not do what we can. Gun control is far more difficult with less chance of success.

[Doctor Phibes]

@mark said in Texas shooting.:

Have we even considered locking down the schools with armed guards? As much as that idea sickens me, dead school children, sickens me more.

Back in the 1970s we bitched and protested because they installed a chain link fence around our high school. It was meant to stop students from leaving school and crossing the road during the lunch hour to go to their cars and smoke. We were livid! We called it a prison, police state, etc.

So, I don't take putting armed guards in the school lightly. Like I said the idea sickens me, but how else can we protect the schools?

We know that trying to take the guns out of circulation is just not possible. Access to anything is possible to anyone willing to do whatever it takes to get something.

It's like we have no other choice at this time to really protect the schools.

It does nothing for workplaces, or public events and attractions.

It's a depressing thought, and I hate to think what it's going to do to children's view of the world.

It seems to me that something is fundamentally broken, in the US particularly, with regard to people's views of firearms.

[Mik]

It's the willingness to use them to take life that's the problem.

[Catseye3]

Yeah, speaking as a pro-Second bun, I am coming ever closer to accepting that at the least we must amend the Second Amendment to address this. We sure as hell can't rely on the People to do anything. They're good at hand wringing and sending their thoughts n' prayers; that's about it.

As others have said, this can't go on. We can't continue to pretend there's not a problem. Someone spoke of Constitutional rights; what about the Constitutional rights of the formerly alive, who had every reason to anticipate living out their lives, who are now dead by gunshot? Continuing to not address this terrible issue is immoral -- severely so.

And every proposed solution has problems.

Maybe a bipartisan Congressional committee to bat this around, see if they can work up a compromise -- something that both extreme positions can contemplate without losing their shit.

I don't see any other solution.

[Horace]

Too many examples that people can see and understand. It's an achievable thing, it moves the country, and that is a heck of a lot of power to salivate over, if you're a hopeless, angry, and mentally ill young man. It only takes one out of tens of millions.

[Horace]

I'm not clear on what gun regulations we're arguing over when the Dems come out and say we have to do something about this.

[Aqua Letifer]

@Horace said in Texas shooting.:

I'm not clear on what gun regulations we're arguing over when the Dems come out and say we have to do something about this.

Since our answer has been fuck-all nothing, many of them are explicitly saying to do anything but that.

[Catseye3]

@Horace said in Texas shooting.:

I'm not clear on what gun regulations we're arguing over when the Dems come out and say we have to do something about this.

Yeah, that's the thing. Both positions must stop with the line-in-the-sand bullshit and start thinking more cooperatively.

[Horace]

@Aqua-Letifer said in Texas shooting.:

@Horace said in Texas shooting.:

I'm not clear on what gun regulations we're arguing over when the Dems come out and say we have to do something about this.

Since our answer has been fuck-all nothing, many of them are explicitly saying to do anything but that.

Ok then, I'm not clear on the gun legislation introduced by the Dems and blocked by the GOP. I understand that such legislation exists, but I'm not clear on it. Probably a hundred things in a hundred different locations. I'm sure it's complicated. But I'm clear that those sorts of public debates are not very tenable politically for those opposing gun control, and become less tenable every time another one of these things happens. This is one of those things that could even trump the economy, at the voting booth, if someone was convinced their vote would contribute to more gun control to help end this stuff.