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The New Coffee Room

  1. TNCR
  2. General Discussion
  3. The Ukraine war thread

The Ukraine war thread

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  • M Away
    M Away
    Mik
    wrote on 16 Dec 2022, 14:27 last edited by
    #1293

    This is all well and good. I just wish we'd stop announcing it and giving the location.

    https://www.msn.com/en-us/news/world/us-to-expand-combat-training-for-ukrainian-troops/ar-AA15kxQO?ocid=msedgntp&cvid=f60ce41f3f3e43d9ab5441a4c4184571

    “I am fond of pigs. Dogs look up to us. Cats look down on us. Pigs treat us as equals.” ~Winston S. Churchill

    R 1 Reply Last reply 16 Dec 2022, 16:47
    • M Mik
      16 Dec 2022, 14:27

      This is all well and good. I just wish we'd stop announcing it and giving the location.

      https://www.msn.com/en-us/news/world/us-to-expand-combat-training-for-ukrainian-troops/ar-AA15kxQO?ocid=msedgntp&cvid=f60ce41f3f3e43d9ab5441a4c4184571

      R Offline
      R Offline
      Renauda
      wrote on 16 Dec 2022, 16:47 last edited by
      #1294

      @Mik

      I see another side to announcing it. It is an open declaration of defiance to Putin’s intimidation tactics against NATO. It also counters Kremlin disinformation regarding covert NATO support to Ukraine. I trust that the Pentagon knows what it is doing.

      Elbows up!

      1 Reply Last reply
      • M Away
        M Away
        Mik
        wrote on 16 Dec 2022, 17:19 last edited by
        #1295

        Could be.

        For all his nuclear saber rattling, I can't imagine Putin has too much confidence in his nuclear forces after the performance of his conventional ones.

        “I am fond of pigs. Dogs look up to us. Cats look down on us. Pigs treat us as equals.” ~Winston S. Churchill

        1 Reply Last reply
        • G Offline
          G Offline
          George K
          wrote on 16 Dec 2022, 18:16 last edited by
          #1296

          It's interesting (for lack of a better word) to see Putin's objection to the US delivery of Patriot missiles to Ukraine. This is 100% a defensive weapon.

          "Now look here, you Baltic gas passer... " - Mik, 6/14/08

          The saying, "Lite is just one damn thing after another," is a gross understatement. The damn things overlap.

          1 Reply Last reply
          • C Offline
            C Offline
            Copper
            wrote on 16 Dec 2022, 18:21 last edited by
            #1297

            Maybe the US troops aren't operating the equipment, but it sounds like they are standing there watching it operate. And they are training the guys operating it.

            That is pretty close to fighting in the war.

            1 Reply Last reply
            • M Away
              M Away
              Mik
              wrote on 16 Dec 2022, 23:34 last edited by
              #1298

              Kissinger says we should not crush Russia but should negotiate. He thinks Ukraine should cede territory to Russia. I will consider what he says, but it is near impossible to think Russia should be rewarded for aggression.

              https://www.msn.com/en-us/news/world/russia-suffering-crippling-loss-in-ukraine-threatens-world-order-kissinger/ar-AA15mZZ1?ocid=msedgntp&cvid=312ff191994d47eca422f68f09b2ec94

              “I am fond of pigs. Dogs look up to us. Cats look down on us. Pigs treat us as equals.” ~Winston S. Churchill

              C R 2 Replies Last reply 17 Dec 2022, 00:26
              • M Mik
                16 Dec 2022, 23:34

                Kissinger says we should not crush Russia but should negotiate. He thinks Ukraine should cede territory to Russia. I will consider what he says, but it is near impossible to think Russia should be rewarded for aggression.

                https://www.msn.com/en-us/news/world/russia-suffering-crippling-loss-in-ukraine-threatens-world-order-kissinger/ar-AA15mZZ1?ocid=msedgntp&cvid=312ff191994d47eca422f68f09b2ec94

                C Offline
                C Offline
                Copper
                wrote on 17 Dec 2022, 00:26 last edited by
                #1299

                @Mik said in The Ukraine war thread:

                t is near impossible to think Russia should be rewarded for aggression.

                The reward isn't for the aggression, it's for winning.

                Or in the case of a negotiated settlement, the reward is negotiated. Stopping the aggression is worth something.

                1 Reply Last reply
                • G Offline
                  G Offline
                  George K
                  wrote on 17 Dec 2022, 13:19 last edited by
                  #1300

                  image.jpeg

                  "Now look here, you Baltic gas passer... " - Mik, 6/14/08

                  The saying, "Lite is just one damn thing after another," is a gross understatement. The damn things overlap.

                  1 Reply Last reply
                  • M Mik
                    16 Dec 2022, 23:34

                    Kissinger says we should not crush Russia but should negotiate. He thinks Ukraine should cede territory to Russia. I will consider what he says, but it is near impossible to think Russia should be rewarded for aggression.

                    https://www.msn.com/en-us/news/world/russia-suffering-crippling-loss-in-ukraine-threatens-world-order-kissinger/ar-AA15mZZ1?ocid=msedgntp&cvid=312ff191994d47eca422f68f09b2ec94

                    R Offline
                    R Offline
                    Renauda
                    wrote on 17 Dec 2022, 14:55 last edited by
                    #1301

                    @Mik

                    At the this point, Russia is only prepared to dictate terms of surrender to Ukraine that amount to nothing less than the unconditional surrender of its territory and sovereignty.

                    So no, in the foreseeable future it is folly to even consider the Kremlin could sit down and negotiate in good faith a stop to its aggression against Ukraine and, by extension, NATO.

                    Elbows up!

                    1 Reply Last reply
                    • J Offline
                      J Offline
                      Jolly
                      wrote on 17 Dec 2022, 15:02 last edited by
                      #1302

                      Somebody has to run out of will, money or bodies at some point.

                      “Cry havoc and let slip the DOGE of war!”

                      Those who cheered as J-6 American prisoners were locked in solitary for 18 months without trial, now suddenly fight tooth and nail for foreign terrorists’ "due process". — Buck Sexton

                      R 1 Reply Last reply 17 Dec 2022, 15:37
                      • J Jolly
                        17 Dec 2022, 15:02

                        Somebody has to run out of will, money or bodies at some point.

                        R Offline
                        R Offline
                        Renauda
                        wrote on 17 Dec 2022, 15:37 last edited by Renauda
                        #1303

                        @Jolly

                        Although it has an abundance of will to defend itself, Ukraine is out of money and running out of bodies.

                        Russia is flush with cash, has plenty of bodies in reserve and is sufficiently deluded to believe in its own infallibility to fight NATO indefinitely.

                        Elbows up!

                        G 1 Reply Last reply 17 Dec 2022, 15:40
                        • R Renauda
                          17 Dec 2022, 15:37

                          @Jolly

                          Although it has an abundance of will to defend itself, Ukraine is out of money and running out of bodies.

                          Russia is flush with cash, has plenty of bodies in reserve and is sufficiently deluded to believe in its own infallibility to fight NATO indefinitely.

                          G Offline
                          G Offline
                          George K
                          wrote on 17 Dec 2022, 15:40 last edited by
                          #1304

                          @Renauda said in The Ukraine war thread:

                          Ukraine is out of money and running out of bodies.

                          Several sources claim > 90K Russian dead. If the ⅓ ratio holds, that adds up to 270K casualties.

                          I've not seen anything about Ukranian casualties. I imagine it's probably similar.

                          "Now look here, you Baltic gas passer... " - Mik, 6/14/08

                          The saying, "Lite is just one damn thing after another," is a gross understatement. The damn things overlap.

                          R 1 Reply Last reply 17 Dec 2022, 15:52
                          • G George K
                            17 Dec 2022, 15:40

                            @Renauda said in The Ukraine war thread:

                            Ukraine is out of money and running out of bodies.

                            Several sources claim > 90K Russian dead. If the ⅓ ratio holds, that adds up to 270K casualties.

                            I've not seen anything about Ukranian casualties. I imagine it's probably similar.

                            R Offline
                            R Offline
                            Renauda
                            wrote on 17 Dec 2022, 15:52 last edited by Renauda
                            #1305

                            @George-K

                            I can’t imagine Ukrainian casualties being much different.

                            Casualty estimates for both sides is a cloudy issue that’s for sure. I came across the following this morning breaking down confirmed Russian KIAs:

                            https://www.themoscowtimes.com/2022/12/16/5-graphs-analyzing-10000-russian-soldiers-confirmed-killed-in-ukraine-a79699

                            Elbows up!

                            1 Reply Last reply
                            • G Offline
                              G Offline
                              George K
                              wrote on 18 Dec 2022, 01:04 last edited by
                              #1306

                              I saw this in the New York Times earlier today, and it's a long, LONG, article.

                              This Twitter thread hits the highlights (lowlights?).

                              https://threadreaderapp.com/thread/1604142037770575872.html

                              "Now look here, you Baltic gas passer... " - Mik, 6/14/08

                              The saying, "Lite is just one damn thing after another," is a gross understatement. The damn things overlap.

                              1 Reply Last reply
                              • L Offline
                                L Offline
                                LuFins Dad
                                wrote on 18 Dec 2022, 03:54 last edited by
                                #1307

                                Why do Russians have so much trouble with stairs?

                                The Brad

                                1 Reply Last reply
                                • M Away
                                  M Away
                                  Mik
                                  wrote on 18 Dec 2022, 16:47 last edited by
                                  #1308

                                  One Russian tank unit attacks another over argument. Love this. Maakes you wonder if one day the Russian occupiers may desert and turn Ukrainian. Wouldn't that be something.

                                  https://www.msn.com/en-us/news/world/a-russian-tank-unit-deliberately-attacked-another-russian-position-in-ukraine-report-says-illustrating-vicious-rivalries-within-putin-s-army/ar-AA15q1Kf?ocid=msedgntp&cvid=85f3fc7219314acdbb1130fc1b59a9aa

                                  “I am fond of pigs. Dogs look up to us. Cats look down on us. Pigs treat us as equals.” ~Winston S. Churchill

                                  1 Reply Last reply
                                  • J Online
                                    J Online
                                    jon-nyc
                                    wrote on 19 Dec 2022, 11:47 last edited by
                                    #1309

                                    Wow.

                                    "You never know what worse luck your bad luck has saved you from."
                                    -Cormac McCarthy

                                    G 1 Reply Last reply 19 Dec 2022, 12:07
                                    • J jon-nyc
                                      19 Dec 2022, 11:47

                                      Wow.

                                      G Offline
                                      G Offline
                                      George K
                                      wrote on 19 Dec 2022, 12:07 last edited by
                                      #1310

                                      @jon-nyc they'll have to leave the country to buy them, I assume.

                                      Perhaps they'll also be encouraged by the musicians and circus performers at the front.

                                      "Now look here, you Baltic gas passer... " - Mik, 6/14/08

                                      The saying, "Lite is just one damn thing after another," is a gross understatement. The damn things overlap.

                                      1 Reply Last reply
                                      • G Offline
                                        G Offline
                                        George K
                                        wrote on 19 Dec 2022, 12:38 last edited by
                                        #1311

                                        More mobilizations coming?

                                        2/ This follows earlier indications that the Russian authorities are preparing to mobilise government and emergency service workers, including police officers and firefighters, as well as more civilians.

                                        3/ According to the Baza Telegram channel, Moscow police officers have been given a list of items that they must immediately acquire for themselves, as early as today. They have reportedly been told their bags will be checked for compliance.

                                        4/ The list includes items such as clothes, towels, a compass, a torch, an combat mission plotter, a day's worth of food, a one-litre flask of water and a first-aid kit. The officers were additionally ordered to pack a sleeping bag and a camping mat.

                                        5/ The purpose of the order isn't stated, but as the Military Ombudsman Telegram channel notes, "for those involved in the army, the purpose of such a duffel bag is quite recognisable." /end

                                        "Now look here, you Baltic gas passer... " - Mik, 6/14/08

                                        The saying, "Lite is just one damn thing after another," is a gross understatement. The damn things overlap.

                                        1 Reply Last reply
                                        • R Offline
                                          R Offline
                                          Renauda
                                          wrote on 21 Dec 2022, 04:25 last edited by Renauda
                                          #1312

                                          Zelensky in Washington tomorrow?

                                          https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-europe-64047058

                                          Am seeing this on other sites as well.

                                          Elbows up!

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