The Ukraine war thread
-
There is some Deus Ex Machina that everyone expects from Trump - I actually really want to see this through now. What is the special deal that Trump can do to make Putin change his nature and start playing by the rules.
Playing this forward. Let’s say we get a deal and Putin now goes into Baltics or Poland. Is it the same stance again? Let him take some land and then go make a deal?
@xenon said in The Ukraine war thread:
There is some Deus Ex Machina that everyone expects from Trump - I actually really want to see this through now. What is the special deal that Trump can do to make Putin change his nature and start playing by the rules.
Playing this forward. Let’s say we get a deal and Putin now goes into Baltics or Poland. Is it the same stance again? Let him take some land and then go make a deal?
I’m curious too. Unfortunately we’ve seen this a thousand times. If it fails, it’s someone else’s fault. Before Trump if any US president ever gave Putin a deal (land etc) after he invaded and caused 1.5 million deaths, it would’ve been conservative top shelf blasphemy.
-
@jon-nyc said in The Ukraine war thread:
Magats don’t like him anymore either. Like Zelensky, he started the war.
Because one guy Tucker Calrson talked to once, said that, while being intentionally provocative.
Because one guy Tucker Calrson talked to once, said that, while being intentionally provocative.
Okay, so I forgot earlier….your one fault is sometimes relying on and defending that yellow journalist and Walter Winchell wannabe, “ FuCa” for your information. You really ought to be more circumspect with regard to that muckraking wag. Now buck up or you’ll lose your respectable Libertarian status
Elbows up!
-
There is some Deus Ex Machina that everyone expects from Trump - I actually really want to see this through now. What is the special deal that Trump can do to make Putin change his nature and start playing by the rules.
Playing this forward. Let’s say we get a deal and Putin now goes into Baltics or Poland. Is it the same stance again? Let him take some land and then go make a deal?
@xenon said in The Ukraine war thread:
There is some Deus Ex Machina that everyone expects from Trump - I actually really want to see this through now. What is the special deal that Trump can do to make Putin change his nature and start playing by the rules.
People are hoping, but "expecting" is probably a strong word.
Playing this forward. Let’s say we get a deal and Putin now goes into Baltics or Poland. Is it the same stance again? Let him take some land and then go make a deal?
Who knows? There's no pat playbook, as much as everybody would like to hand-wave from their armchair the existence of such a playbook that we're so obviously violating. Maybe we can argue about this specific situation rather than worrying about the precedent, while for some reason not worrying about the precedent of letting Russia slowly consume Ukraine.
-
Because one guy Tucker Calrson talked to once, said that, while being intentionally provocative.
Okay, so I forgot earlier….your one fault is sometimes relying on and defending that yellow journalist and Walter Winchell wannabe, “ FuCa” for your information. You really ought to be more circumspect with regard to that muckraking wag. Now buck up or you’ll lose your respectable Libertarian status
@Renauda said in The Ukraine war thread:
Okay, so I forgot earlier….your one fault is sometimes relying on and defending that yellow journalist and Walter Winchell wannabe, “ FuCa” for your information. You really ought to be more circumspect with regard to that muckraking wag. Now buck up or you’ll lose your respectable Libertarian status
I am sure you will be consistently uneasy with any respect you may have for me, as I continue to post my opinions. But I doubt you'll find any blanket endorsements from me of anybody, including Carlson.
-
@Horace said in The Ukraine war thread:
SecState's take:
Link to videoInteresting interview. The lady is asking what everyone is thinking, including Zelenskyy. “Marco Rubio, even you’ve said Putin is a butcher and absolutely can’t be trusted in negotiations” and his response keeps coming back to “yeah but Trump is a deal maker”, what does that meeaannnnnn?? That’s the whole point.
@89th said in The Ukraine war thread:
@Horace said in The Ukraine war thread:
SecState's take:
Link to videoInteresting interview. The lady is asking what everyone is thinking, including Zelenskyy. “Marco Rubio, even you’ve said Putin is a butcher and absolutely can’t be trusted in negotiations” and his response keeps coming back to “yeah but Trump is a deal maker”, what does that meeaannnnnn?? That’s the whole point.
So you don't grant the point - at all - that Trump doesn't necessarily want to go full-bore on the anti-Russia rhetoric, while his goal is to facilitate negotiations between them and Ukraine? There's no practical point there? Biden was free to say whatever because he never talked to Russia, and never intended to.
Education is extremely important.
-
I get it. I guess my stance on this stems from my opinion on Trump. A lot of his criticisms and sales pitch for what’s wrong is fine.
I think he’s an empty suit beyond that. I haven’t seen any substantive policy or operational thought come from him in the last 10 years. I guess I’m skeptical that he has any competence for governance.
I think the guy is witty, funny, loves his country and can read people really well…. That doesn’t mean he knows anything about governance.
-
I get it. I guess my stance on this stems from my opinion on Trump. A lot of his criticisms and sales pitch for what’s wrong is fine.
I think he’s an empty suit beyond that. I haven’t seen any substantive policy or operational thought come from him in the last 10 years. I guess I’m skeptical that he has any competence for governance.
I think the guy is witty, funny, loves his country and can read people really well…. That doesn’t mean he knows anything about governance.
@xenon said in The Ukraine war thread:
I get it. I guess my stance on this stems from my opinion on Trump. A lot of his criticisms and sales pitch for what’s wrong is fine.
I think he’s an empty suit beyond that. I haven’t seen any substantive policy or operational thought come from him in the last 10 years. I guess I’m skeptical that he has any competence for governance.
I think the guy is witty, funny, loves his country and can read people really well…. That doesn’t mean he knows anything about governance.
The Ukraine situation was doing a swell job of defeating the west, revealing its self-righteous rhetoric to be powerless and empty, well before Trump came back into power.
-
I get it. I guess my stance on this stems from my opinion on Trump. A lot of his criticisms and sales pitch for what’s wrong is fine.
I think he’s an empty suit beyond that. I haven’t seen any substantive policy or operational thought come from him in the last 10 years. I guess I’m skeptical that he has any competence for governance.
I think the guy is witty, funny, loves his country and can read people really well…. That doesn’t mean he knows anything about governance.
@xenon said in The Ukraine war thread:
I get it. I guess my stance on this stems from my opinion on Trump. A lot of his criticisms and sales pitch for what’s wrong is fine.
I think he’s an empty suit beyond that. I haven’t seen any substantive policy or operational thought come from him in the last 10 years. I guess I’m skeptical that he has any competence for governance.
I think the guy is witty, funny, loves his country and can read people really well…. That doesn’t mean he knows anything about governance.
That’s the thing. Even when the lady was discussing taking guns away from people with mental breakdowns, he kept asking “so is that how it works now?” He doesn’t have a clue BUT in his defense sometimes you can lead by knowing the macro picture without the details. That being said, if you asked Trump when did Ukraine become a country? He’d probably be like “not sure, the late 80s?”
-
@89th said in The Ukraine war thread:
@Horace said in The Ukraine war thread:
SecState's take:
Link to videoInteresting interview. The lady is asking what everyone is thinking, including Zelenskyy. “Marco Rubio, even you’ve said Putin is a butcher and absolutely can’t be trusted in negotiations” and his response keeps coming back to “yeah but Trump is a deal maker”, what does that meeaannnnnn?? That’s the whole point.
So you don't grant the point - at all - that Trump doesn't necessarily want to go full-bore on the anti-Russia rhetoric, while his goal is to facilitate negotiations between them and Ukraine? There's no practical point there? Biden was free to say whatever because he never talked to Russia, and never intended to.
@Horace said in The Ukraine war thread:
@89th said in The Ukraine war thread:
@Horace said in The Ukraine war thread:
SecState's take:
Link to videoInteresting interview. The lady is asking what everyone is thinking, including Zelenskyy. “Marco Rubio, even you’ve said Putin is a butcher and absolutely can’t be trusted in negotiations” and his response keeps coming back to “yeah but Trump is a deal maker”, what does that meeaannnnnn?? That’s the whole point.
So you don't grant the point - at all - that Trump doesn't necessarily want to go full-bore on the anti-Russia rhetoric, while his goal is to facilitate negotiations between them and Ukraine? There's no practical point there? Biden was free to say whatever because he never talked to Russia, and never intended to.
Oh I totally grant that point. It’s not what Trump is saying about Russia, it’s what Trump is saying about Ukraine that is horrendous.
-
For example. Trump could’ve said “I understand your view of Putin and he sure has negotiated in bad faith before but I’m good at making deals and will work with him to bring this war to an end with security guarantees for Ukraine and no loss of land.”
-
Mr. Trump is a producer, actor and writer. How does that get forgotten?
His IMDB credits go on for pages.
That talk with Zelenskyy was rehearsed for weeks before the cameras turned on.
