Griner
-
wrote on 8 Dec 2022, 16:48 last edited by
I can only imagine the despair of Whelan and his family. How horrible...
-
wrote on 8 Dec 2022, 17:05 last edited by
In the meantime nobody is even mentioning Mark Fogel.
-
In the meantime nobody is even mentioning Mark Fogel.
wrote on 8 Dec 2022, 17:07 last edited by@LuFins-Dad said in Griner:
In the meantime nobody is even mentioning Mark Fogel.
He and Whelan don't check the "correct" boxes.
-
wrote on 8 Dec 2022, 17:17 last edited by
Great, another drug addict on the streets.
-
wrote on 8 Dec 2022, 17:26 last edited by George K 12 Aug 2022, 17:27
A Terrible Concession to Putin’s Russia
Today you’re going to hear a lot of people defending the Biden administration’s deal to secure the release of Brittney Griner by giving Viktor Bout, the world’s most notorious arms dealer with a metaphorical ocean of blood on his hands, back to Russia. (I called the then-potential deal a “moral abomination” back in August.) Not securing the release of Paul Whelan makes this bad deal even worse.
A lot of defenders of the deal will contend that critics are indifferent to the suffering of Griner, which is a dodge and a smear. The question is not, “is it in the interest of the U.S. government to secure the release of Brittney Griner?” That’s a silly question; the U.S. never wants to see its citizens unfairly detained under brutal conditions on trumped-up charges. The question is, what is an appropriate concession to secure the release of those citizens, and does the payment of the ransom make future problems like this more likely?
It is hard to overstate the crimes of Bout; if any human being deserved to rot in prison for the rest of his days, it’s him. Longtime State Department official Witney Schneidman, who tracked Bout delivering arms to both sides of the Angola civil war, called Bout “the personification of evil.” From the end of the Cold War until his arrest in 2008, if there was an arms embargo, Bout flouted it — Liberia, Afghanistan, Sierra Leone, Congo, Libya. Whenever there was a dictator or warlord who needed weapons to mow down his enemies or suppress a suffering population, Bout was there to make a profit off of bloodshed. He earned his nickname, “the Merchant of Death.”)
After all, if the U.S. government is willing to release Viktor Bout — at one point, the second-most-wanted man after Osama bin Laden! — under enough pressure, then the U.S. government will release anyone under enough pressure: terrorists like Khalid Sheikh Mohammed and Dzhokhar A. Tsarnaev, spies like Robert Hanssen.
It is likely that one of the reasons the Biden administration went ahead with this deal was their confidence that enough allies would choose to characterize it as a major diplomatic victory, not an epic concession to a hostile state that is likely to try to use the same strongarm tactics again in the future.
-
wrote on 8 Dec 2022, 17:53 last edited by
Exactly what I mean by what did it cost us. Bout is just the beginning.
-
wrote on 8 Dec 2022, 18:05 last edited by
-
wrote on 8 Dec 2022, 19:59 last edited by
Written (or signed-off on) by Menendez (D-NJ)
-
Well to be fair I have no idea whether the Russians were really against releasing Paul Whelan or if they only had one and chose Griner.
The comments from Whelan’s family suggest the former, they said Biden did the right thing trading for Griner rather than hold out for a deal that can’t be done.
wrote on 8 Dec 2022, 21:26 last edited byThe comments from Whelan’s family suggest the former, they said Biden did the right thing trading for Griner rather than hold out for a deal that can’t be done.
Just came across this: https://people.com/sports/paul-whelans-family-devastated-hes-in-russia-but-happy-for-brittney-griner/
-
The comments from Whelan’s family suggest the former, they said Biden did the right thing trading for Griner rather than hold out for a deal that can’t be done.
Just came across this: https://people.com/sports/paul-whelans-family-devastated-hes-in-russia-but-happy-for-brittney-griner/
wrote on 8 Dec 2022, 21:34 last edited byThe comments from Whelan’s family suggest the former, they said Biden did the right thing trading for Griner rather than hold out for a deal that can’t be done.
Just came across this: https://people.com/sports/paul-whelans-family-devastated-hes-in-russia-but-happy-for-brittney-griner/
Great… What about Fogel?
Whalen, there is something to the story. Too many weird actions and a shaky history on his part. Fogel, though? Why aren’t people upset about him?
-
wrote on 8 Dec 2022, 21:37 last edited by
Nice to know the government places equivalent value on a stoner, lesbian, professional athlete of color and an arms dealer that has been called the definition of evil…
-
The comments from Whelan’s family suggest the former, they said Biden did the right thing trading for Griner rather than hold out for a deal that can’t be done.
Just came across this: https://people.com/sports/paul-whelans-family-devastated-hes-in-russia-but-happy-for-brittney-griner/
Great… What about Fogel?
Whalen, there is something to the story. Too many weird actions and a shaky history on his part. Fogel, though? Why aren’t people upset about him?
wrote on 8 Dec 2022, 22:02 last edited by@LuFins-Dad said in Griner:
Whalen, there is something to the story. Too many weird actions and a shaky history on his part.
I looked up the Wikipedia story on him.
$80K in cash in Moscow? OK, then.
-
wrote on 8 Dec 2022, 22:09 last edited by
Is it appropriate to refer to those dishonorably discharged as vets?
-
wrote on 8 Dec 2022, 22:18 last edited by
Pretty damning description and story.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Paul_Whelan_(security_director)
-
wrote on 8 Dec 2022, 23:19 last edited by Renauda 12 Sept 2022, 03:37
Truth be known the US probably wanted or was negotiating to barter Bout for Snowden, but Putin conveniently granted Snowden Russian citizenship in order to preempt any chance of that deal to succeed. Putin thus turned the tables so it would be an extradition case. In the absence of a bilateral extradition treaty, the Russians would never extradite one of their own to the US.
It then became a choice of take Griner or nothing.
-
wrote on 9 Dec 2022, 00:32 last edited by
Seen on Twitter:
“This is the first WNBA trade I’ve ever paid attention to”
-
wrote on 9 Dec 2022, 01:06 last edited by
-
wrote on 9 Dec 2022, 01:21 last edited by
How long before she gets a book deal and a Netflix miniseries?
-
wrote on 9 Dec 2022, 01:47 last edited by
Less than 90 days on the book deal.
