The Bitcoin/Crypto Thread
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@xenon said in The Bitcoin/Crypto Thread:
Another one seems to be collapsing today. Celsius has $12B under management. They've halted all withdrawls.
https://www.cnbc.com/2022/06/13/crypto-lender-celsius-pauses-withdrawals-bitcoin-slides.html
Trying to imagine what a “bank run” would look like when all the “money” is digital. Maybe someday some movie making genius can figure out out to depict a digital “bank run” in motion picture form.
@Axtremus said in The Bitcoin/Crypto Thread:
@xenon said in The Bitcoin/Crypto Thread:
Another one seems to be collapsing today. Celsius has $12B under management. They've halted all withdrawls.
https://www.cnbc.com/2022/06/13/crypto-lender-celsius-pauses-withdrawals-bitcoin-slides.html
Trying to imagine what a “bank run” would look like when all the “money” is digital. Maybe someday some movie making genius can figure out out to depict a digital “bank run” in motion picture form.
Fiat currencies are only slightly less digital than crypto. In order for a "run" to occur, something physical - fiat currency for instance - has to be in demand. There would be no such thing as a crypto run, only a crash in its value, as the hordes attempt to sell their crypto for fiat currency. Even when they sold it, it wouldn't be for anything physical. Just digital fiat currency.
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@Axtremus said in The Bitcoin/Crypto Thread:
@xenon said in The Bitcoin/Crypto Thread:
Another one seems to be collapsing today. Celsius has $12B under management. They've halted all withdrawls.
https://www.cnbc.com/2022/06/13/crypto-lender-celsius-pauses-withdrawals-bitcoin-slides.html
Trying to imagine what a “bank run” would look like when all the “money” is digital. Maybe someday some movie making genius can figure out out to depict a digital “bank run” in motion picture form.
Fiat currencies are only slightly less digital than crypto. In order for a "run" to occur, something physical - fiat currency for instance - has to be in demand. There would be no such thing as a crypto run, only a crash in its value, as the hordes attempt to sell their crypto for fiat currency. Even when they sold it, it wouldn't be for anything physical. Just digital fiat currency.
@Horace said in The Bitcoin/Crypto Thread:
@Axtremus said in The Bitcoin/Crypto Thread:
@xenon said in The Bitcoin/Crypto Thread:
Another one seems to be collapsing today. Celsius has $12B under management. They've halted all withdrawls.
https://www.cnbc.com/2022/06/13/crypto-lender-celsius-pauses-withdrawals-bitcoin-slides.html
Trying to imagine what a “bank run” would look like when all the “money” is digital. Maybe someday some movie making genius can figure out out to depict a digital “bank run” in motion picture form.
Fiat currencies are only slightly less digital than crypto. In order for a "run" to occur, something physical - fiat currency for instance - has to be in demand. There would be no such thing as a crypto run, only a crash in its value, as the hordes attempt to sell their crypto for fiat currency. Even when they sold it, it wouldn't be for anything physical. Just digital fiat currency.
Would make it a good time to buy some of the more stable and larger coins.
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@xenon said in The Bitcoin/Crypto Thread:
Another one seems to be collapsing today. Celsius has $12B under management. They've halted all withdrawls.
https://www.cnbc.com/2022/06/13/crypto-lender-celsius-pauses-withdrawals-bitcoin-slides.html
Trying to imagine what a “bank run” would look like when all the “money” is digital. Maybe someday some movie making genius can figure out out to depict a digital “bank run” in motion picture form.
@Axtremus said in The Bitcoin/Crypto Thread:
@xenon said in The Bitcoin/Crypto Thread:
Another one seems to be collapsing today. Celsius has $12B under management. They've halted all withdrawls.
https://www.cnbc.com/2022/06/13/crypto-lender-celsius-pauses-withdrawals-bitcoin-slides.html
Trying to imagine what a “bank run” would look like when all the “money” is digital. Maybe someday some movie making genius can figure out out to depict a digital “bank run” in motion picture form.
The salient fact is "decentral" not "digital". But much of the crypto market isn't decentralized - crypto exchanges (coinbase, tether, etc.) are traditional bank-like centralized entities that take possession of entitlements to coins then loan out the capital. We're having plain old runs on these types of entities that don't have the money in the bank.
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Can anyone tell me what produced commodities or services support or sustain the market value of Bitcoin/cryptocurrency?
Elbows up!
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Can anyone tell me what produced commodities or services support or sustain the market value of Bitcoin/cryptocurrency?
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@Renauda said in The Bitcoin/Crypto Thread:
Can anyone tell me what produced commodities or services support or sustain the market value of Bitcoin/cryptocurrency?
Same answer for gold
@89th said in The Bitcoin/Crypto Thread:
@Renauda said in The Bitcoin/Crypto Thread:
Can anyone tell me what produced commodities or services support or sustain the market value of Bitcoin/cryptocurrency?
Same answer for gold
Or any collectible.
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That's right, Bitcoin is the most gold-like (there's no consortium or founding group pushing it, power is too disperse to change the protocol, etc.). To the extent that there's demand for "digital gold", Bitcoin should fill that niche.
Now - the covid stimulus really pumped up the price of Bitcoin. I don't think we'll have anything like that soon. Will mainstream investors lose interest if this thing doesn't show signs of going back to the moon in the next 1-3 years? TBD.
The rest of the crypto space? I see no practical use cases.
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@jon-nyc said in The Bitcoin/Crypto Thread:
Rarely more obvious the precarious extrapolation of “most recent transaction price” to “trade value of all of them”.
@Horace said in The Bitcoin/Crypto Thread:
@jon-nyc said in The Bitcoin/Crypto Thread:
Rarely more obvious the precarious extrapolation of “most recent transaction price” to “trade value of all of them”.
Fair - if the market had to liquidate by tomorrow, it would liquidate for a lot less than $1T. But the trading price is still the best signal of value.
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@Horace said in The Bitcoin/Crypto Thread:
@jon-nyc said in The Bitcoin/Crypto Thread:
Rarely more obvious the precarious extrapolation of “most recent transaction price” to “trade value of all of them”.
Fair - if the market had to liquidate by tomorrow, it would liquidate for a lot less than $1T. But the trading price is still the best signal of value.
@xenon said in The Bitcoin/Crypto Thread:
@Horace said in The Bitcoin/Crypto Thread:
@jon-nyc said in The Bitcoin/Crypto Thread:
Rarely more obvious the precarious extrapolation of “most recent transaction price” to “trade value of all of them”.
Fair - if the market had to liquidate by tomorrow, it would liquidate for a lot less than $1T. But the trading price is still the best signal of value.
Right but the signal is stronger or weaker depending on how many dollars are lined up behind the most recent transaction, waiting for the market price to nudge just a little. If you have a only a handful of buyers and sellers dictating the most recent transactions, and no intrinsic value to back anything up, the most recent transaction price is built on sand.
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I have zero money in crypto but I agree that Bitcoin is going to be a thing forever. Not so much the rest of them.
@Horace said in The Bitcoin/Crypto Thread:
I have zero money in crypto but I agree that Bitcoin is going to be a thing forever. Not so much the rest of them.
Ethereum will also stay around, IMO. Where Bitcoin is mainly a decentralized financial tool, Ethereum is more of a network, can be used for apps, transactions, NFTs, and uses less energy than Bitcoin. Besides those 2 coins... who knows.
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There was an interesting article recently on the "search" to find who was the guy that invented BitCoin.
Nobody really knows.
I did not realize that there is a maximum number of bitcoins that will be made. I think the number is 21 million. They believe that the inventor holds about 1 million of these.
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Can anyone tell me what produced commodities or services support or sustain the market value of Bitcoin/cryptocurrency?
@Renauda said in The Bitcoin/Crypto Thread:
Can anyone tell me what produced commodities or services support or sustain the market value of Bitcoin/cryptocurrency?
Helium is working to create a decentralized telecom network of transmitters which are also cryptominers.
The owner puts the unit in their window, links with others in the neighborhood, create a network of cellular communications, earn crypto and create crypto, and then profit when the network is used in replacement of cell towers. So the game plan is to replace Verizon TMob ATT etc cell towers with a completely decentralized operator owned network for internet, streaming, voip, etc.
That to me makes sense as it produces real and marketable value.
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@Renauda said in The Bitcoin/Crypto Thread:
Can anyone tell me what produced commodities or services support or sustain the market value of Bitcoin/cryptocurrency?
Helium is working to create a decentralized telecom network of transmitters which are also cryptominers.
The owner puts the unit in their window, links with others in the neighborhood, create a network of cellular communications, earn crypto and create crypto, and then profit when the network is used in replacement of cell towers. So the game plan is to replace Verizon TMob ATT etc cell towers with a completely decentralized operator owned network for internet, streaming, voip, etc.
That to me makes sense as it produces real and marketable value.
@Ivorythumper said in The Bitcoin/Crypto Thread:
@Renauda said in The Bitcoin/Crypto Thread:
Can anyone tell me what produced commodities or services support or sustain the market value of Bitcoin/cryptocurrency?
Helium is working to create a decentralized telecom network of transmitters which are also cryptominers.
The owner puts the unit in their window, links with others in the neighborhood, create a network of cellular communications, earn crypto and create crypto, and then profit when the network is used in replacement of cell towers. So the game plan is to replace Verizon TMob ATT etc cell towers with a completely decentralized operator owned network for internet, streaming, voip, etc.
That to me makes sense as it produces real and marketable value.
The most valuable asset a telco has is wireless spectrum. There’s nothing stopping people from setting up nodes on public frequencies today. I’m not sure what value the crypto angle brings.
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There was an interesting article recently on the "search" to find who was the guy that invented BitCoin.
Nobody really knows.
I did not realize that there is a maximum number of bitcoins that will be made. I think the number is 21 million. They believe that the inventor holds about 1 million of these.
@taiwan_girl said in The Bitcoin/Crypto Thread:
There was an interesting article recently on the "search" to find who was the guy that invented BitCoin.
Nobody really knows.
I did not realize that there is a maximum number of bitcoins that will be made. I think the number is 21 million. They believe that the inventor holds about 1 million of these.
Adam Back, according to a convincing documentary I saw.
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@Ivorythumper said in The Bitcoin/Crypto Thread:
@Renauda said in The Bitcoin/Crypto Thread:
Can anyone tell me what produced commodities or services support or sustain the market value of Bitcoin/cryptocurrency?
Helium is working to create a decentralized telecom network of transmitters which are also cryptominers.
The owner puts the unit in their window, links with others in the neighborhood, create a network of cellular communications, earn crypto and create crypto, and then profit when the network is used in replacement of cell towers. So the game plan is to replace Verizon TMob ATT etc cell towers with a completely decentralized operator owned network for internet, streaming, voip, etc.
That to me makes sense as it produces real and marketable value.
The most valuable asset a telco has is wireless spectrum. There’s nothing stopping people from setting up nodes on public frequencies today. I’m not sure what value the crypto angle brings.
@xenon said in The Bitcoin/Crypto Thread:
@Ivorythumper said in The Bitcoin/Crypto Thread:
@Renauda said in The Bitcoin/Crypto Thread:
Can anyone tell me what produced commodities or services support or sustain the market value of Bitcoin/cryptocurrency?
Helium is working to create a decentralized telecom network of transmitters which are also cryptominers.
The owner puts the unit in their window, links with others in the neighborhood, create a network of cellular communications, earn crypto and create crypto, and then profit when the network is used in replacement of cell towers. So the game plan is to replace Verizon TMob ATT etc cell towers with a completely decentralized operator owned network for internet, streaming, voip, etc.
That to me makes sense as it produces real and marketable value.
The most valuable asset a telco has is wireless spectrum. There’s nothing stopping people from setting up nodes on public frequencies today. I’m not sure what value the crypto angle brings.
As I understand it, the crypto part simultaneously sets up a network of communication devices to replace cell towers and computers to solve for and generate crypto, which are earned by the owners of the devices.
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I looked into it a bit more. It's a pretty great idea. The value and interest here though seems to come from wanting to get access to a specific token that people hope will be worth more in the future than it is today.
Helium has very tight control on the production of that token - they won't release private keys unless you pay a certain amount of money and buy their own proprietary hardware. There is actually no decentralization here - you must go through Helium Co. to participate in this idea. (Unlike truly decentralized crypto projects like Bitcoin).
