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The New Coffee Room

  1. TNCR
  2. General Discussion
  3. The Ukraine war thread

The Ukraine war thread

Scheduled Pinned Locked Moved General Discussion
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  • W Offline
    W Offline
    Wim
    wrote on last edited by
    #2986

    Lavrov losing Putin's support?

    Https://www.google.com/amp/s/telegrafi.com/en/amp/Lavrov-loses-Putin%2527s-support-after-failed-meeting-with-Trump-2674272039

    AxtremusA 1 Reply Last reply
    • W Wim

      Lavrov losing Putin's support?

      Https://www.google.com/amp/s/telegrafi.com/en/amp/Lavrov-loses-Putin%2527s-support-after-failed-meeting-with-Trump-2674272039

      AxtremusA Offline
      AxtremusA Offline
      Axtremus
      wrote on last edited by
      #2987

      @Wim said in The Ukraine war thread:

      Lavrov losing Putin's support?

      What's the significance?

      1 Reply Last reply
      • RenaudaR Offline
        RenaudaR Offline
        Renauda
        wrote on last edited by
        #2988

        Substantial, if true. I however remain sceptical that Lavrov is on Putin’s naughty list.

        Elbows up!

        1 Reply Last reply
        • MikM Offline
          MikM Offline
          Mik
          wrote on last edited by
          #2989

          Not being privy to internal Kremlin politics, it would seem unwise to alienate Lavrov who clearly has his own following. I doubt his absence means any more than was said.

          "You cannot subsidize irresponsibility and expect people to become more responsible." — Thomas Sowell

          1 Reply Last reply
          • RenaudaR Offline
            RenaudaR Offline
            Renauda
            wrote on last edited by
            #2990

            Not likely that Lavrov would be entirely sidelined, his expertise in security and foreign affairs is too valuable. A very uncompromising person.

            Elbows up!

            1 Reply Last reply
            • RenaudaR Offline
              RenaudaR Offline
              Renauda
              wrote on last edited by
              #2991

              I should add however, that he should henceforth avoid all windows located above the ground floor. After all, one can’t be too careful in these troubled times.

              Elbows up!

              1 Reply Last reply
              • MikM Offline
                MikM Offline
                Mik
                wrote on last edited by
                #2992

                Ah, yes. The gravity of the situation.

                "You cannot subsidize irresponsibility and expect people to become more responsible." — Thomas Sowell

                1 Reply Last reply
                • jon-nycJ Offline
                  jon-nycJ Offline
                  jon-nyc
                  wrote on last edited by
                  #2993

                  I was heartened by this.

                  The whole reason we call them illegal aliens is because they’re subject to our laws.

                  1 Reply Last reply
                  • MikM Offline
                    MikM Offline
                    Mik
                    wrote on last edited by Mik
                    #2994

                    The comments are interesting too. It's perhaps not apples to apples but it's a good development, nonetheless.

                    "You cannot subsidize irresponsibility and expect people to become more responsible." — Thomas Sowell

                    1 Reply Last reply
                    • MikM Offline
                      MikM Offline
                      Mik
                      wrote last edited by
                      #2995

                      Not a good development, but probably to be expected given the environment Ukraine endured under Soviet rule.

                      https://www.msn.com/en-us/news/world/ukraine-s-top-ministers-resign-amid-100m-corruption-scandal/ar-AA1Qjy5u

                      "You cannot subsidize irresponsibility and expect people to become more responsible." — Thomas Sowell

                      1 Reply Last reply
                      • W Offline
                        W Offline
                        Wim
                        wrote last edited by
                        #2996

                        Putin's power bloc cracking?

                        https://www.kyivpost.com/videos/64394

                        RenaudaR 1 Reply Last reply
                        • MikM Offline
                          MikM Offline
                          Mik
                          wrote last edited by
                          #2997

                          Interesting.

                          "You cannot subsidize irresponsibility and expect people to become more responsible." — Thomas Sowell

                          1 Reply Last reply
                          • W Wim

                            Putin's power bloc cracking?

                            https://www.kyivpost.com/videos/64394

                            RenaudaR Offline
                            RenaudaR Offline
                            Renauda
                            wrote last edited by Renauda
                            #2998

                            @Wim

                            Makes sense in so far as Russia is not and never has been a monolith state. It also explains the internal struggle since the dissolution of the USSR between the siloviki (strongmen - security services, military) and the financial/industrial business elites. He correctly identifies Rosneft’s Igor Sechin as more than just associated with the FSB. Back in the 90’s Rosneft was the poor boy in the oil patch a badly managed state owned oil company that could not compete with its privatized competition like LUKOil or Surgutneftegaz. That all changed with the arrival of Putin in the Kremlin and during the course of his first two terms Rosneft came to be among the top three Russian oil companies. By now it is probably the most powerful in the country as in terms of production, refining capacity and lucrative financial assets outside of the oil business internally and abroad.

                            Elbows up!

                            1 Reply Last reply
                            • MikM Offline
                              MikM Offline
                              Mik
                              wrote last edited by Mik
                              #2999

                              Not a cheery article. I can't help but wonder where we would be if the west had supported Ukraine more whole-heartedly. All for using the frozen Russian assets.

                              https://www.msn.com/en-us/news/world/zelensky-is-losing-touch-with-reality/ar-AA1QGvyu

                              "You cannot subsidize irresponsibility and expect people to become more responsible." — Thomas Sowell

                              RenaudaR 1 Reply Last reply
                              • MikM Mik

                                Not a cheery article. I can't help but wonder where we would be if the west had supported Ukraine more whole-heartedly. All for using the frozen Russian assets.

                                https://www.msn.com/en-us/news/world/zelensky-is-losing-touch-with-reality/ar-AA1QGvyu

                                RenaudaR Offline
                                RenaudaR Offline
                                Renauda
                                wrote last edited by
                                #3000

                                @Mik

                                Not cheery but as one observer I read pointed out:

                                To be clear, the fact Ukraine’s investigators — and its raucous free press — are absolutely going to town on elites is itself evidence of a living, breathing (if coughing) democracy worth defending. One need only glance over the border to recall the alternative.

                                Can anyone send us the link to Russia’s credible investigation after the Panama Papers exposed Putin’s billions? Or how his best friend (Roldugin) earned billions playing a cello? (dude must be awesome). Or why the guy who made a two-hour documentary on Putin’s $1.4 billion Black Sea mega-palace ended up dead in a Putin prison?

                                The absence of scandal in an autocracy is often just a symptom of its silent, dehumanising condition. And inversely (if uncomfortably), the presence of scandal in a democracy often just reflects the messy but sacred human agency underneath. And that’s worth fighting for, everywhere, every time.

                                Elbows up!

                                1 Reply Last reply
                                • MikM Offline
                                  MikM Offline
                                  Mik
                                  wrote last edited by
                                  #3001

                                  Good observation.

                                  "You cannot subsidize irresponsibility and expect people to become more responsible." — Thomas Sowell

                                  RenaudaR 1 Reply Last reply
                                  • MikM Mik

                                    Good observation.

                                    RenaudaR Offline
                                    RenaudaR Offline
                                    Renauda
                                    wrote last edited by
                                    #3002

                                    @Mik

                                    I thought so as well.

                                    I’m the meantime, I have nothing to say about the past 24 hrs of hearsay surrounding Moscow’s and Dim Philby’s (Witkoff the dummkopf) latest terms of unconditional surrender being laid out before the embattled Ukrainian nation.

                                    Elbows up!

                                    1 Reply Last reply
                                    • MikM Offline
                                      MikM Offline
                                      Mik
                                      wrote last edited by
                                      #3003

                                      Oh, the cash for land, but you really still own it? Absurd to the point of surreal.

                                      "You cannot subsidize irresponsibility and expect people to become more responsible." — Thomas Sowell

                                      1 Reply Last reply
                                      • RenaudaR Offline
                                        RenaudaR Offline
                                        Renauda
                                        wrote last edited by Renauda
                                        #3004

                                        Surreal is right. I really cannot comprehend how the US could even table the alleged terms for the Ukranians’ consideration.

                                        Elbows up!

                                        1 Reply Last reply
                                        • MikM Offline
                                          MikM Offline
                                          Mik
                                          wrote last edited by
                                          #3005

                                          He's just throwing shit against the wall to see if anything sticks.

                                          "You cannot subsidize irresponsibility and expect people to become more responsible." — Thomas Sowell

                                          1 Reply Last reply
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