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The New Coffee Room

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  3. Gifts for Putin, Demands for Zelensky

Gifts for Putin, Demands for Zelensky

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  • HoraceH Horace

    @jon-nyc Great. Then it remains very odd how quiet the opposition was to the status quo under Biden, where Russia was slowly consuming Ukraine.

    jon-nycJ Offline
    jon-nycJ Offline
    jon-nyc
    wrote on last edited by
    #225

    @Horace said in Gifts for Putin, Demands for Zelensky:

    @jon-nyc Great. Then it remains very odd how quiet the opposition was to the status quo under Biden, where Russia was slowly consuming Ukraine.

    They control less Ukrainian land now than they did 3 years ago.

    But there were plenty of complaints about Biden’s strategy if you knew where to look. Kasparov was a rather loud and consistent voice.

    Only non-witches get due process.

    • Cotton Mather, Salem Massachusetts, 1692
    HoraceH 1 Reply Last reply
    • jon-nycJ jon-nyc

      @Horace said in Gifts for Putin, Demands for Zelensky:

      @jon-nyc Great. Then it remains very odd how quiet the opposition was to the status quo under Biden, where Russia was slowly consuming Ukraine.

      They control less Ukrainian land now than they did 3 years ago.

      But there were plenty of complaints about Biden’s strategy if you knew where to look. Kasparov was a rather loud and consistent voice.

      HoraceH Offline
      HoraceH Offline
      Horace
      wrote on last edited by
      #226

      @jon-nyc said in Gifts for Putin, Demands for Zelensky:

      @Horace said in Gifts for Putin, Demands for Zelensky:

      @jon-nyc Great. Then it remains very odd how quiet the opposition was to the status quo under Biden, where Russia was slowly consuming Ukraine.

      They control less Ukrainian land now than they did 3 years ago.

      Interesting. Cite? How do you square that with the commonly accepted notion that Ukraine is losing the war, and will ultimately lose unless something changes?

      But there were plenty of complaints about Biden’s strategy if you knew where to look. Kasparov was a rather loud and consistent voice.

      Obviously, I'm talking about the public discussion in America.

      Education is extremely important.

      jon-nycJ 1 Reply Last reply
      • jon-nycJ Offline
        jon-nycJ Offline
        jon-nyc
        wrote on last edited by
        #227

        He’s in America with a decent social media platform.

        Only non-witches get due process.

        • Cotton Mather, Salem Massachusetts, 1692
        HoraceH 1 Reply Last reply
        • HoraceH Horace

          @jon-nyc said in Gifts for Putin, Demands for Zelensky:

          @Horace said in Gifts for Putin, Demands for Zelensky:

          @jon-nyc Great. Then it remains very odd how quiet the opposition was to the status quo under Biden, where Russia was slowly consuming Ukraine.

          They control less Ukrainian land now than they did 3 years ago.

          Interesting. Cite? How do you square that with the commonly accepted notion that Ukraine is losing the war, and will ultimately lose unless something changes?

          But there were plenty of complaints about Biden’s strategy if you knew where to look. Kasparov was a rather loud and consistent voice.

          Obviously, I'm talking about the public discussion in America.

          jon-nycJ Offline
          jon-nycJ Offline
          jon-nyc
          wrote on last edited by
          #228

          @Horace said in Gifts for Putin, Demands for Zelensky:

          @jon-nyc said in Gifts for Putin, Demands for Zelensky:

          @Horace said in Gifts for Putin, Demands for Zelensky:

          @jon-nyc Great. Then it remains very odd how quiet the opposition was to the status quo under Biden, where Russia was slowly consuming Ukraine.

          They control less Ukrainian land now than they did 3 years ago.

          Interesting. Cite?

          Russia controlled the most Ukrainian territory in the current war around March 2022, shortly after the full-scale invasion began on February 24, 2022. At its peak, Russian forces occupied approximately 22% of Ukraine, including:
          • Nearly all of Luhansk and Donetsk (beyond pre-2022 positions).
          • Kherson and Zaporizhzhia regions, including Kherson city.
          • Northern Ukraine, including areas near Kyiv, Chernihiv, and Sumy (which they withdrew from in April 2022).

          Since then, Ukraine has regained significant territory, especially through counteroffensives in Kharkiv (September 2022) and Kherson (November 2022). Today, Russia still occupies parts of eastern and southern Ukraine, but its territorial control is significantly reduced from its early-war peak.

          Only non-witches get due process.

          • Cotton Mather, Salem Massachusetts, 1692
          LuFins DadL 1 Reply Last reply
          • HoraceH Offline
            HoraceH Offline
            Horace
            wrote on last edited by
            #229

            So there is no squaring with the commonly accepted notion that Ukraine is losing the war, and the claim, while technically true, is a rhetorical cheap trick. Russia happened to occupy a bunch of territory in an undefended blitz at the start, from which they were pushed back, and into which they continue to encroach slowly.

            Education is extremely important.

            1 Reply Last reply
            • jon-nycJ jon-nyc

              He’s in America with a decent social media platform.

              HoraceH Offline
              HoraceH Offline
              Horace
              wrote on last edited by
              #230

              @jon-nyc said in Gifts for Putin, Demands for Zelensky:

              He’s in America with a decent social media platform.

              Sigh. You are completely shameless. I guess that's a gift.

              Education is extremely important.

              jon-nycJ 1 Reply Last reply
              • jon-nycJ Offline
                jon-nycJ Offline
                jon-nyc
                wrote on last edited by
                #231

                IMG_3418.jpeg
                IMG_3417.jpeg

                Only non-witches get due process.

                • Cotton Mather, Salem Massachusetts, 1692
                1 Reply Last reply
                • HoraceH Horace

                  @jon-nyc said in Gifts for Putin, Demands for Zelensky:

                  He’s in America with a decent social media platform.

                  Sigh. You are completely shameless. I guess that's a gift.

                  jon-nycJ Offline
                  jon-nycJ Offline
                  jon-nyc
                  wrote on last edited by
                  #232

                  @Horace said in Gifts for Putin, Demands for Zelensky:

                  @jon-nyc said in Gifts for Putin, Demands for Zelensky:

                  He’s in America with a decent social media platform.

                  Sigh. You are completely shameless. I guess that's a gift.

                  He’s a public intellectual and gets interviewed a lot. Just because he hasn’t been on Rogan or Petersons podcast doesn’t mean he’s not part of the conversation. Maybe you need to add some non-magats to your twitter feed or some non-wokes to your Bluesky.

                  Only non-witches get due process.

                  • Cotton Mather, Salem Massachusetts, 1692
                  HoraceH 1 Reply Last reply
                  • jon-nycJ jon-nyc

                    @Horace said in Gifts for Putin, Demands for Zelensky:

                    @jon-nyc said in Gifts for Putin, Demands for Zelensky:

                    He’s in America with a decent social media platform.

                    Sigh. You are completely shameless. I guess that's a gift.

                    He’s a public intellectual and gets interviewed a lot. Just because he hasn’t been on Rogan or Petersons podcast doesn’t mean he’s not part of the conversation. Maybe you need to add some non-magats to your twitter feed or some non-wokes to your Bluesky.

                    HoraceH Offline
                    HoraceH Offline
                    Horace
                    wrote on last edited by
                    #233

                    @jon-nyc said in Gifts for Putin, Demands for Zelensky:

                    @Horace said in Gifts for Putin, Demands for Zelensky:

                    @jon-nyc said in Gifts for Putin, Demands for Zelensky:

                    He’s in America with a decent social media platform.

                    Sigh. You are completely shameless. I guess that's a gift.

                    He’s a public intellectual and gets interviewed a lot. Just because he hasn’t been on Rogan or Petersons podcast doesn’t mean he’s not part of the conversation. Maybe you need to add some non-magats to your twitter feed or some non-wokes to your Bluesky.

                    No, this is not a failure of the breadth of my info feeds. This is a failure of your good faith reading of my point. You are eager to dunk as always, so you took my claims about how relatively quiet the opposition was to the Biden status quo, as a claim that there was no opposition at all. Because jon's gotta dunk. It's bad faith, and more tedious than you'll ever know.

                    Education is extremely important.

                    1 Reply Last reply
                    • jon-nycJ jon-nyc

                      @Horace said in Gifts for Putin, Demands for Zelensky:

                      @jon-nyc said in Gifts for Putin, Demands for Zelensky:

                      @Horace said in Gifts for Putin, Demands for Zelensky:

                      @jon-nyc Great. Then it remains very odd how quiet the opposition was to the status quo under Biden, where Russia was slowly consuming Ukraine.

                      They control less Ukrainian land now than they did 3 years ago.

                      Interesting. Cite?

                      Russia controlled the most Ukrainian territory in the current war around March 2022, shortly after the full-scale invasion began on February 24, 2022. At its peak, Russian forces occupied approximately 22% of Ukraine, including:
                      • Nearly all of Luhansk and Donetsk (beyond pre-2022 positions).
                      • Kherson and Zaporizhzhia regions, including Kherson city.
                      • Northern Ukraine, including areas near Kyiv, Chernihiv, and Sumy (which they withdrew from in April 2022).

                      Since then, Ukraine has regained significant territory, especially through counteroffensives in Kharkiv (September 2022) and Kherson (November 2022). Today, Russia still occupies parts of eastern and southern Ukraine, but its territorial control is significantly reduced from its early-war peak.

                      LuFins DadL Offline
                      LuFins DadL Offline
                      LuFins Dad
                      wrote on last edited by
                      #234

                      @jon-nyc said in Gifts for Putin, Demands for Zelensky:

                      @Horace said in Gifts for Putin, Demands for Zelensky:

                      @jon-nyc said in Gifts for Putin, Demands for Zelensky:

                      @Horace said in Gifts for Putin, Demands for Zelensky:

                      @jon-nyc Great. Then it remains very odd how quiet the opposition was to the status quo under Biden, where Russia was slowly consuming Ukraine.

                      They control less Ukrainian land now than they did 3 years ago.

                      Interesting. Cite?

                      Russia controlled the most Ukrainian territory in the current war around March 2022, shortly after the full-scale invasion began on February 24, 2022. At its peak, Russian forces occupied approximately 22% of Ukraine, including:
                      • Nearly all of Luhansk and Donetsk (beyond pre-2022 positions).
                      • Kherson and Zaporizhzhia regions, including Kherson city.
                      • Northern Ukraine, including areas near Kyiv, Chernihiv, and Sumy (which they withdrew from in April 2022).

                      Since then, Ukraine has regained significant territory, especially through counteroffensives in Kharkiv (September 2022) and Kherson (November 2022). Today, Russia still occupies parts of eastern and southern Ukraine, but its territorial control is significantly reduced from its early-war peak.

                      How do the battle lines compare with the 2015/16 borders?

                      The Brad

                      taiwan_girlT 1 Reply Last reply
                      • LuFins DadL LuFins Dad

                        @jon-nyc said in Gifts for Putin, Demands for Zelensky:

                        @Horace said in Gifts for Putin, Demands for Zelensky:

                        @jon-nyc said in Gifts for Putin, Demands for Zelensky:

                        @Horace said in Gifts for Putin, Demands for Zelensky:

                        @jon-nyc Great. Then it remains very odd how quiet the opposition was to the status quo under Biden, where Russia was slowly consuming Ukraine.

                        They control less Ukrainian land now than they did 3 years ago.

                        Interesting. Cite?

                        Russia controlled the most Ukrainian territory in the current war around March 2022, shortly after the full-scale invasion began on February 24, 2022. At its peak, Russian forces occupied approximately 22% of Ukraine, including:
                        • Nearly all of Luhansk and Donetsk (beyond pre-2022 positions).
                        • Kherson and Zaporizhzhia regions, including Kherson city.
                        • Northern Ukraine, including areas near Kyiv, Chernihiv, and Sumy (which they withdrew from in April 2022).

                        Since then, Ukraine has regained significant territory, especially through counteroffensives in Kharkiv (September 2022) and Kherson (November 2022). Today, Russia still occupies parts of eastern and southern Ukraine, but its territorial control is significantly reduced from its early-war peak.

                        How do the battle lines compare with the 2015/16 borders?

                        taiwan_girlT Offline
                        taiwan_girlT Offline
                        taiwan_girl
                        wrote on last edited by
                        #235

                        @LuFins-Dad said in Gifts for Putin, Demands for Zelensky:

                        How do the battle lines compare with the 2015/16 borders?

                        As always, you got me thinking. So, did some checking and found a pretty good map from the BBC

                        alt text

                        1 Reply Last reply
                        • jon-nycJ Offline
                          jon-nycJ Offline
                          jon-nyc
                          wrote on last edited by
                          #236

                          He may have lost Farage and LePen:

                          But he still has Medvedev.

                          Only non-witches get due process.

                          • Cotton Mather, Salem Massachusetts, 1692
                          1 Reply Last reply
                          • jon-nycJ Offline
                            jon-nycJ Offline
                            jon-nyc
                            wrote on last edited by
                            #237

                            Only non-witches get due process.

                            • Cotton Mather, Salem Massachusetts, 1692
                            taiwan_girlT 1 Reply Last reply
                            • jon-nycJ jon-nyc

                              taiwan_girlT Offline
                              taiwan_girlT Offline
                              taiwan_girl
                              wrote on last edited by
                              #238

                              @jon-nyc Yeah, Sec Rubio has to be cringing with some of the policies he has to follow. I think he will be one of the first ministers to leave - either voluntary or otherwise.

                              AxtremusA 1 Reply Last reply
                              • taiwan_girlT taiwan_girl

                                @jon-nyc Yeah, Sec Rubio has to be cringing with some of the policies he has to follow. I think he will be one of the first ministers to leave - either voluntary or otherwise.

                                AxtremusA Offline
                                AxtremusA Offline
                                Axtremus
                                wrote on last edited by
                                #239

                                @taiwan_girl said in Gifts for Putin, Demands for Zelensky:

                                @jon-nyc Yeah, Sec Rubio has to be cringing with some of the policies he has to follow. I think he will be one of the first ministers to leave - either voluntary or otherwise.

                                No, Trump is already a known quantity by his second election. Rubio knew exactly when he was getting into and he got in there anyway. He will continue to toe Trump’s line, whatever that is.

                                RenaudaR 1 Reply Last reply
                                • AxtremusA Axtremus

                                  @taiwan_girl said in Gifts for Putin, Demands for Zelensky:

                                  @jon-nyc Yeah, Sec Rubio has to be cringing with some of the policies he has to follow. I think he will be one of the first ministers to leave - either voluntary or otherwise.

                                  No, Trump is already a known quantity by his second election. Rubio knew exactly when he was getting into and he got in there anyway. He will continue to toe Trump’s line, whatever that is.

                                  RenaudaR Offline
                                  RenaudaR Offline
                                  Renauda
                                  wrote on last edited by
                                  #240

                                  @Axtremus

                                  Not sure, Ax. I think Rubio will either bail or risk being mercilessly thrown under the bus, when it becomes evident Putin has no intention to negotiate in good faith.

                                  Elbows up!

                                  1 Reply Last reply
                                  • jon-nycJ Offline
                                    jon-nycJ Offline
                                    jon-nyc
                                    wrote on last edited by
                                    #241

                                    The administration has reached the point where this had to be said.

                                    IMG_3528.jpeg

                                    Only non-witches get due process.

                                    • Cotton Mather, Salem Massachusetts, 1692
                                    1 Reply Last reply
                                    • 89th8 Offline
                                      89th8 Offline
                                      89th
                                      wrote on last edited by
                                      #242

                                      I thought nothing was off the table to appease negotiate with Putin?

                                      1 Reply Last reply
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