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The New Coffee Room

  1. TNCR
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  3. The Ukraine war thread

The Ukraine war thread

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  • MikM Mik

    In 91 I was saying the celebrations of the USSR demise were premature, that the world was in fact less stable, more dangerous than before. That has proven true.

    It had greater potential promise as well, but that did not materialize. At least not yet.

    I’ll look for that interview. We will never get that kind of nuance from the White House.

    RenaudaR Offline
    RenaudaR Offline
    Renauda
    wrote on last edited by Renauda
    #2412

    @Mik

    Not the same interview with Sikorski that I heard on the sat. radio, but very similar in tone and scope.

    This from yesterday, 15 February:

    Link to video

    Elbows up!

    1 Reply Last reply
    • MikM Offline
      MikM Offline
      Mik
      wrote on last edited by
      #2413

      Thanks!

      “I am fond of pigs. Dogs look up to us. Cats look down on us. Pigs treat us as equals.” ~Winston S. Churchill

      1 Reply Last reply
      • MikM Offline
        MikM Offline
        Mik
        wrote on last edited by
        #2414

        Just watched it. Rational and clear eyed.

        The question in my mind is how badly does Putin want out of his own tar baby. That more than anything will drive how all this turns out.

        The other factor is the Ukrainian population’s ability to continue mustering personnel. That I have no feel for.

        “I am fond of pigs. Dogs look up to us. Cats look down on us. Pigs treat us as equals.” ~Winston S. Churchill

        JollyJ 1 Reply Last reply
        • MikM Offline
          MikM Offline
          Mik
          wrote on last edited by
          #2415

          https://www.msn.com/en-us/news/world/fox-news-us-and-russia-propose-three-stage-peace-plan/ar-AA1zi12J

          Not liking this.

          “I am fond of pigs. Dogs look up to us. Cats look down on us. Pigs treat us as equals.” ~Winston S. Churchill

          1 Reply Last reply
          • RenaudaR Offline
            RenaudaR Offline
            Renauda
            wrote on last edited by Renauda
            #2416

            As long as Ukraine is in a state of martial law there will no presidential election. That much is written into Ukraine’s constitution. Any talk of it by either Moscow or Washington is unwarranted grandstanding at this time.

            All today’s meeting accomplished was an agreement to reestablish diplomatic channels to facilitate the negotiation process. Along with the standard Kremlin line of bald face lies and distortions, I really didn’t get much out of Lavrov’s presser other than Russia’s demands of all parties remain unmitigated and every bit as harsh and punitive as they were three years ago. Perhaps even harsher. Russia continues to insist that it is the sole victim in this war.

            Rubio is right, this is going to be a long and hard negotiation. It could break down at any point.

            https://www.themoscowtimes.com/2025/02/18/russias-lavrov-says-hes-unaware-of-reported-3-stage-ukraine-peace-plan-a88064

            Elbows up!

            1 Reply Last reply
            • taiwan_girlT Offline
              taiwan_girlT Offline
              taiwan_girl
              wrote on last edited by
              #2417

              I dont understand why at least Ukraine would not be involved in the initial negotiations. Maybe not face to face with Russia at the start, but they should be there.

              Also think that Europe should be also. From a money standpoint, I believe that they have contributed both more money and materials to Ukraine.

              RenaudaR 1 Reply Last reply
              • taiwan_girlT taiwan_girl

                I dont understand why at least Ukraine would not be involved in the initial negotiations. Maybe not face to face with Russia at the start, but they should be there.

                Also think that Europe should be also. From a money standpoint, I believe that they have contributed both more money and materials to Ukraine.

                RenaudaR Offline
                RenaudaR Offline
                Renauda
                wrote on last edited by Renauda
                #2418

                @taiwan_girl

                At this point neither the US or Russia have ambassadors or a full working compliment in their respective embassies. Normal diplomatic channels between the two have been pretty much severed for the last three years. The US and Russia are therefore just trying to set up a diplomatic framework then to proceed towards a negotiation process. Once that process has been determined then I should think Ukraine will become a party to the negotiations.

                Russia remains determined to receive Ukraine’s total capitulation. It stop at nothing to get Washington to agree to Russia’s absolute terms throughout the process.

                Elbows up!

                1 Reply Last reply
                • MikM Mik

                  Just watched it. Rational and clear eyed.

                  The question in my mind is how badly does Putin want out of his own tar baby. That more than anything will drive how all this turns out.

                  The other factor is the Ukrainian population’s ability to continue mustering personnel. That I have no feel for.

                  JollyJ Offline
                  JollyJ Offline
                  Jolly
                  wrote on last edited by
                  #2419

                  @Mik said in The Ukraine war thread:

                  Just watched it. Rational and clear eyed.

                  The question in my mind is how badly does Putin want out of his own tar baby. That more than anything will drive how all this turns out.

                  The other factor is the Ukrainian population’s ability to continue mustering personnel. That I have no feel for.

                  Ukraine is staggering. They lowered their draft age from 27 to 25 about a year ago and stepped up recruitment efforts in the 18-24 range. They had around 8.7M draft age men when Russia invaded, now they have less than 5M ( due both to combat injuries and males who have fled the country). Ukraine has around 65K women volunteers in their armed services.

                  Russia has a larger population from which to draw. In the last twelve months, some sources state they've drafted about 280,000 men. They are also recruiting soldiers in occupied Ukraine. Ukraine claims Russia has lost 833,000 soldiers in the war.

                  Currently, it's February and conditions are not good for big offensive maneuvers, but when it dries up in the spring, I'm predicting a sizeable Russian push.

                  “Cry havoc and let slip the DOGE of war!”

                  Those who cheered as J-6 American prisoners were locked in solitary for 18 months without trial, now suddenly fight tooth and nail for foreign terrorists’ "due process". — Buck Sexton

                  1 Reply Last reply
                  • taiwan_girlT Offline
                    taiwan_girlT Offline
                    taiwan_girl
                    wrote on last edited by
                    #2420

                    Confidently rolling toward Ukrainian lines in western Russia’s Kursk Oblast in up-armored vehicles brazenly flying the flag of the defunct Soviet Union, an assault group from the Russian 155th Naval Infantry Brigade paraded right into a minefield laid by the Ukrainian 47th Mechanized Brigade.
                    Mines blew up some of the Russian vehicles. Drones struck others and also hounded the dismounted infantry.

                    One shell-shocked Russian crewman bailed out of his damaged vehicle, trudged a few steps through the snow, fell flat onto his back—and then exploded as a drone slammed into him.

                    ***NSFW content***

                    click to show

                    alt text

                    1 Reply Last reply
                    • RenaudaR Offline
                      RenaudaR Offline
                      Renauda
                      wrote on last edited by Renauda
                      #2421

                      Right now am listening to Trump talk about Ukraine in a Q & A presser from his Florida palace.

                      Trump is laying the bulk of the blame on Kyiv for this war, among other exaggerations, deflections and distortions. I feel very sorry for Rubio, his boss’s inability to show any statesmanship or hold his tongue is making a very difficult task into a near to impossible task.

                      Normally I would ask for someone to pass the barf bag. But this time I think need the whole porcelain bowl.

                      Edit (2 hours later):

                      What Trump said:

                      "I'm very disappointed, I hear that they're upset about not having a seat," Trump told reporters when asked what he would say to Ukrainians who feel "betrayed."

                      "Today I heard, oh, well, we weren't invited. Well, you've been there for three years...You should have never started it. You could have made a deal," he said.

                      https://amp.abc.net.au/article/104953730

                      Elbows up!

                      RenaudaR 1 Reply Last reply
                      • RenaudaR Renauda

                        Right now am listening to Trump talk about Ukraine in a Q & A presser from his Florida palace.

                        Trump is laying the bulk of the blame on Kyiv for this war, among other exaggerations, deflections and distortions. I feel very sorry for Rubio, his boss’s inability to show any statesmanship or hold his tongue is making a very difficult task into a near to impossible task.

                        Normally I would ask for someone to pass the barf bag. But this time I think need the whole porcelain bowl.

                        Edit (2 hours later):

                        What Trump said:

                        "I'm very disappointed, I hear that they're upset about not having a seat," Trump told reporters when asked what he would say to Ukrainians who feel "betrayed."

                        "Today I heard, oh, well, we weren't invited. Well, you've been there for three years...You should have never started it. You could have made a deal," he said.

                        https://amp.abc.net.au/article/104953730

                        RenaudaR Offline
                        RenaudaR Offline
                        Renauda
                        wrote on last edited by Renauda
                        #2422

                        Dbl post

                        Elbows up!

                        1 Reply Last reply
                        • MikM Offline
                          MikM Offline
                          Mik
                          wrote on last edited by
                          #2423

                          How does he figure it’s Ukraine’s fault? Seems like stretch, but he may have hard feelings

                          “I am fond of pigs. Dogs look up to us. Cats look down on us. Pigs treat us as equals.” ~Winston S. Churchill

                          1 Reply Last reply
                          • HoraceH Offline
                            HoraceH Offline
                            Horace
                            wrote on last edited by
                            #2424

                            I may not have heard what Renauda heard, but I heard a lot of blaming of Biden rather than Ukraine.

                            Education is extremely important.

                            RenaudaR 1 Reply Last reply
                            • HoraceH Horace

                              I may not have heard what Renauda heard, but I heard a lot of blaming of Biden rather than Ukraine.

                              RenaudaR Offline
                              RenaudaR Offline
                              Renauda
                              wrote on last edited by Renauda
                              #2425

                              @Horace

                              The blame Biden crap, I file under deflections and squelch. Just like Beauregard’s coffee and doughnut shop gossip around here.

                              You didn’t hear what Trumpigula said about Ukraine because you either weren’t listening or you didn’t want to hear it. To be honest I didn’t want to hear it either but I did and so did everyone else who was paying attention.

                              Elbows up!

                              1 Reply Last reply
                              • jon-nycJ Offline
                                jon-nycJ Offline
                                jon-nyc
                                wrote on last edited by
                                #2426

                                Only non-witches get due process.

                                • Cotton Mather, Salem Massachusetts, 1692
                                1 Reply Last reply
                                • jon-nycJ Offline
                                  jon-nycJ Offline
                                  jon-nyc
                                  wrote on last edited by
                                  #2427

                                  Only non-witches get due process.

                                  • Cotton Mather, Salem Massachusetts, 1692
                                  1 Reply Last reply
                                  • HoraceH Offline
                                    HoraceH Offline
                                    Horace
                                    wrote on last edited by Horace
                                    #2428

                                    Word on the street is that Zelensky wouldn't even win an election in Ukraine right now.

                                    https://news.gallup.com/poll/653495/half-ukrainians-quick-negotiated-end-war.aspx

                                    Education is extremely important.

                                    1 Reply Last reply
                                    • RenaudaR Offline
                                      RenaudaR Offline
                                      Renauda
                                      wrote on last edited by Renauda
                                      #2429

                                      I normally don’t look to CNN (or for that matter, any US news outlet) but the following clip is too good to pass up. At least two Republican senators haven’t drunk the Putin Kool-Aide:

                                      https://www.cnn.com/2025/02/18/politics/video/roger-wicker-john-kennedy-trump-putin-digvid

                                      @Horace

                                      Word on the street is that Zelensky wouldn't even win an election in Ukraine right now.

                                      https://news.gallup.com/poll/653495/half-ukrainians-quick-negotiated-end-war.aspx

                                      Surprised you would even give credence to a “street” poll under the conditions a country like Ukraine is currently facing. Must be for the sake of convenience or you actually believe Trump’s bald faced lies on the matter. On the other hand, you might get more favourable results if the poll were taken in Moscow.

                                      Anyways, let’s just wait a few more weeks to see how brutally Trump continues to rubbish and belittle the Ukrainian nation and their President. Then, by all means, let Gallup do another poll. This one you posted is nothing more than old hat from last autumn.

                                      Ukraine’s dilemma at this moment is not too far removed from Poland in August 1939:

                                      “With the Germans, we risk losing our freedom,” said Polish commander-in-chief Edward Rydz-Smigly, “with the Russians our soul.”

                                      Elbows up!

                                      1 Reply Last reply
                                      • Doctor PhibesD Offline
                                        Doctor PhibesD Offline
                                        Doctor Phibes
                                        wrote on last edited by
                                        #2430

                                        The idea that Zelensky is the problem here seems completely bogus.

                                        WTF are the Republicans thinking?

                                        I was only joking

                                        1 Reply Last reply
                                        • MikM Offline
                                          MikM Offline
                                          Mik
                                          wrote on last edited by
                                          #2431

                                          The party needs to give POTUS a big wakeup call.

                                          “I am fond of pigs. Dogs look up to us. Cats look down on us. Pigs treat us as equals.” ~Winston S. Churchill

                                          AxtremusA 1 Reply Last reply
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