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The New Coffee Room

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  3. Andrew Sullivan on The Roots of Wokeness

Andrew Sullivan on The Roots of Wokeness

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  • jon-nycJ jon-nyc

    One of the problems with our populist movements, like populist movements in general, is they are very keen on what they want to destroy and very vague on what or how to build in its place.

    HoraceH Offline
    HoraceH Offline
    Horace
    wrote on last edited by
    #26

    @jon-nyc said in Andrew Sullivan on The Roots of Wokeness:

    One of the problems with our populist movements, like populist movements in general, is they are very keen on what they want to destroy and very vague on what or how to build in its place.

    is that as big a problem as people's psychological blocks against distinguishing a preference for one candidate over the other, from full unqualified love of that candidate?

    Education is extremely important.

    1 Reply Last reply
    • HoraceH Offline
      HoraceH Offline
      Horace
      wrote on last edited by
      #27

      And by the way, the reason you remember what I allegedly wrote so vividly, is because it confirmed your bias that there's something psychologically wrong with Trump supporters. It's been your ground truth about my Trump support ever since, and from that seed of contempt grew your comfortable total dismissal of me as a tribal pill swallower. It's all very lazy of you.

      Education is extremely important.

      jon-nycJ 1 Reply Last reply
      • jon-nycJ Online
        jon-nycJ Online
        jon-nyc
        wrote on last edited by
        #28

        Funny, I didn't think you were tribal in 2011, and I did in 2017. Did I just become more lazy in that time?

        I'll bet I'm not the only one who noticed the change became more lazy.

        Only non-witches get due process.

        • Cotton Mather, Salem Massachusetts, 1692
        1 Reply Last reply
        • HoraceH Offline
          HoraceH Offline
          Horace
          wrote on last edited by
          #29

          You and whomever else thinks whatever you and whomever else think, are more than welcome to point it out to me when I post something that must certainly be informed by irrational tribalism. I am always willing to teach. I hope you're willing to learn.

          Education is extremely important.

          1 Reply Last reply
          • jon-nycJ Online
            jon-nycJ Online
            jon-nyc
            wrote on last edited by
            #30

            I'm looking forward to it.

            Only non-witches get due process.

            • Cotton Mather, Salem Massachusetts, 1692
            1 Reply Last reply
            • HoraceH Offline
              HoraceH Offline
              Horace
              wrote on last edited by
              #31

              Meanwhile, challenge to attempt an exercise of humility not accepted. Duly noted, and not surprising.

              Education is extremely important.

              1 Reply Last reply
              • jon-nycJ Online
                jon-nycJ Online
                jon-nyc
                wrote on last edited by
                #32

                I'm talking to you, aren't I?

                Only non-witches get due process.

                • Cotton Mather, Salem Massachusetts, 1692
                HoraceH 1 Reply Last reply
                • 89th8 Offline
                  89th8 Offline
                  89th
                  wrote on last edited by
                  #33

                  fight

                  1 Reply Last reply
                  • jon-nycJ jon-nyc

                    I'm talking to you, aren't I?

                    HoraceH Offline
                    HoraceH Offline
                    Horace
                    wrote on last edited by
                    #34

                    @jon-nyc said in Andrew Sullivan on The Roots of Wokeness:

                    I'm talking to you, aren't I?

                    Your ability to interact with the rabble from your perch above it all is always impressive.

                    Education is extremely important.

                    1 Reply Last reply
                    • 89th8 Offline
                      89th8 Offline
                      89th
                      wrote on last edited by
                      #35

                      fight

                      LarryL 1 Reply Last reply
                      • LarryL Offline
                        LarryL Offline
                        Larry
                        wrote on last edited by Larry
                        #36

                        It doesnt seem to have occurred to Jon that what he sees as "tribalism" from Horace is merely a normal and healthy ability to tell the difference between shit and shinola, and it is Jon's TDS that's standing in the way of him having that ability himself.

                        But of course I'm just a poor old Injun from the South so what would I know...

                        1 Reply Last reply
                        • 89th8 89th

                          fight

                          LarryL Offline
                          LarryL Offline
                          Larry
                          wrote on last edited by
                          #37

                          @89th said in Andrew Sullivan on The Roots of Wokeness:

                          fight

                          Not until I start grinning and calling someone Richard. THEN it's on....... hahaha

                          1 Reply Last reply
                          • HoraceH Horace

                            And by the way, the reason you remember what I allegedly wrote so vividly, is because it confirmed your bias that there's something psychologically wrong with Trump supporters. It's been your ground truth about my Trump support ever since, and from that seed of contempt grew your comfortable total dismissal of me as a tribal pill swallower. It's all very lazy of you.

                            jon-nycJ Online
                            jon-nycJ Online
                            jon-nyc
                            wrote on last edited by
                            #38

                            @Horace said in Andrew Sullivan on The Roots of Wokeness:

                            And by the way, the reason you remember what I allegedly wrote so vividly, is because it confirmed ....

                            This is an interesting sentence. You're conceding that reading such a statement from you would stick in my memory, while at the same time casting doubt on it. Seems like you should pick one?

                            Anyway, I'll give you the much - we all have lots of motivations for things we do, many if not most unknown to us. The one a person reports at a particular time isn't the whole picture. But it contains information nevertheless.

                            Only non-witches get due process.

                            • Cotton Mather, Salem Massachusetts, 1692
                            1 Reply Last reply
                            • HoraceH Offline
                              HoraceH Offline
                              Horace
                              wrote on last edited by
                              #39

                              I think you took something out of full context, leaped at a few words that fit with something that you want to believe. Something that makes the world simpler, more comprehensible and self-serving. This is how the human mind operates. I am not immune from that, but I try to have some humility around that.

                              Education is extremely important.

                              1 Reply Last reply
                              • HoraceH Offline
                                HoraceH Offline
                                Horace
                                wrote on last edited by
                                #40

                                But that said, and as I mentioned above, everybody thinks some selective destruction is for the best sometimes. It is not categorically insane, while your convenient framing of what I said was meant to be categorically insane.

                                Education is extremely important.

                                1 Reply Last reply
                                • jon-nycJ Online
                                  jon-nycJ Online
                                  jon-nyc
                                  wrote on last edited by
                                  #41

                                  In our populist movements the select statement is getting much too broad.

                                  Only non-witches get due process.

                                  • Cotton Mather, Salem Massachusetts, 1692
                                  1 Reply Last reply
                                  • HoraceH Offline
                                    HoraceH Offline
                                    Horace
                                    wrote on last edited by
                                    #42

                                    Yes I have often bemoaned the mindless destructive impulses of the left, cloaked in righteousness, that have become more and more prevalent in the Trump era.

                                    Education is extremely important.

                                    1 Reply Last reply
                                    • jon-nycJ Online
                                      jon-nycJ Online
                                      jon-nyc
                                      wrote on last edited by
                                      #43

                                      Yes you have. You are quite good at recognizing the shortcomings of the outgroup.

                                      Only non-witches get due process.

                                      • Cotton Mather, Salem Massachusetts, 1692
                                      HoraceH 1 Reply Last reply
                                      • Catseye3C Offline
                                        Catseye3C Offline
                                        Catseye3
                                        wrote on last edited by Catseye3
                                        #44

                                        Moving on down in the article, in any discussion, Sullivan writes, "An oppressed person’s word is always the last one."

                                        Is that because the other is struck dumb by the surreal stupidity with which he is confronted? He stands there, mouth agape, with nothing to say, while the SJW struts off, satisfied at having silenced another disgusting heteronormal.

                                        Success is measured by your discipline and inner peace. – Mike Ditka

                                        HoraceH 1 Reply Last reply
                                        • jon-nycJ jon-nyc

                                          Yes you have. You are quite good at recognizing the shortcomings of the outgroup.

                                          HoraceH Offline
                                          HoraceH Offline
                                          Horace
                                          wrote on last edited by
                                          #45

                                          @jon-nyc said in Andrew Sullivan on The Roots of Wokeness:

                                          Yes you have. You are quite good at recognizing the shortcomings of the outgroup.

                                          Thanks jon. And you're good at seeming like the sort of person who doesn't take sides.

                                          Education is extremely important.

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