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The New Coffee Room

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  3. So are the Russians surprised by outcomes?

So are the Russians surprised by outcomes?

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  • RenaudaR Renauda

    No doubt Ukrainian resistance thus far has been Alamo like and, as bach pointed out anticipated and gamed by the Russians well in advance. My hunch though is that the Kremlin has deliberately reined in the advance upon the urban centres in the hope of forcing a capitulation. In particular, Moscow would want to keep damage to Kyiv - which Putin himself has described as the “spiritual heart of the Russian nation” - at a minimum.

    Zelenskyi in the past half hour announced that a Ukrainian delegation will meet a Russian delegation on the Belarus border at the Pripyat River. I suspect terms will be offered to the Ukrainians in the event the final offensive will be avoided.

    JollyJ Offline
    JollyJ Offline
    Jolly
    wrote on last edited by
    #11

    @Renauda said in So are the Russians surprised by outcomes?:

    No doubt Ukrainian resistance thus far has been Alamo like and, as bach pointed out anticipated and gamed by the Russians well in advance. My hunch though is that the Kremlin has deliberately reined in the advance upon the urban centres in the hope of forcing a capitulation. In particular, Moscow would want to keep damage to Kyiv - which Putin himself has described as the “heart of the Russian nation” - minimised.

    Zelensky in the past half hour announced that a Ukrainian delegation will meet a Russian delegation on the Belarus border at the Pripyat River. I suspect terms will be offered to the Ukrainians in the event the final offensive will be avoided.

    Russians will press and Ukranians will play for time?

    “Cry havoc and let slip the DOGE of war!”

    Those who cheered as J-6 American prisoners were locked in solitary for 18 months without trial, now suddenly fight tooth and nail for foreign terrorists’ "due process". — Buck Sexton

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    • RenaudaR Renauda

      No doubt Ukrainian resistance thus far has been Alamo like and, as bach pointed out anticipated and gamed by the Russians well in advance. My hunch though is that the Kremlin has deliberately reined in the advance upon the urban centres in the hope of forcing a capitulation. In particular, Moscow would want to keep damage to Kyiv - which Putin himself has described as the “spiritual heart of the Russian nation” - at a minimum.

      Zelenskyi in the past half hour announced that a Ukrainian delegation will meet a Russian delegation on the Belarus border at the Pripyat River. I suspect terms will be offered to the Ukrainians in the event the final offensive will be avoided.

      George KG Offline
      George KG Offline
      George K
      wrote on last edited by
      #12

      @Renauda said in So are the Russians surprised by outcomes?:

      I suspect terms will be offered to the Ukrainians in the event the final offensive will be avoided.

      I wonder what terms would be acceptable to the Ukrainians?

      "Now look here, you Baltic gas passer... " - Mik, 6/14/08

      The saying, "Lite is just one damn thing after another," is a gross understatement. The damn things overlap.

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      • MikM Offline
        MikM Offline
        Mik
        wrote on last edited by
        #13

        I wonder what precipitated the offer of talks.

        “I am fond of pigs. Dogs look up to us. Cats look down on us. Pigs treat us as equals.” ~Winston S. Churchill

        RenaudaR 1 Reply Last reply
        • MikM Mik

          I wonder what precipitated the offer of talks.

          RenaudaR Offline
          RenaudaR Offline
          Renauda
          wrote on last edited by Renauda
          #14

          @Mik

          Cynically I believe, it was in the Bear’s plan all along. It provides yet another thin layer of veneer of justification for domestic consumption.

          Elbows up!

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          • MikM Offline
            MikM Offline
            Mik
            wrote on last edited by
            #15

            Could well be. Easier to believe than Putin was taken by surprise by world reaction and Ukrainian opposition.

            “I am fond of pigs. Dogs look up to us. Cats look down on us. Pigs treat us as equals.” ~Winston S. Churchill

            RenaudaR 1 Reply Last reply
            • MikM Mik

              Could well be. Easier to believe than Putin was taken by surprise by world reaction and Ukrainian opposition.

              RenaudaR Offline
              RenaudaR Offline
              Renauda
              wrote on last edited by Renauda
              #16

              @Mik

              But realistically, Zelenskyi and his people must also know Churchill’s famous, although probably apocryphal, dictum;

              “You cannot reason with a tiger when your head is in its mouth!”

              Elbows up!

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              • LarryL Offline
                LarryL Offline
                Larry
                wrote on last edited by
                #17

                Putin is scared shitless. He has already put his nuclear weapons forces on high alert, claiming it's because of the sanctions that have been put on him personally. He is scared that the Ukrainians might actually force him out, he is worried about the massive protests going on in Russia, and I believe he has snapped mentally. Lots of options for other world leaders to actually lead, but the US is being led by a moron, so expect Biden to fuck up any chance there might be to stop wwIII.

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                • LuFins DadL Offline
                  LuFins DadL Offline
                  LuFins Dad
                  wrote on last edited by
                  #18

                  I think Putin expected the comedian to have already cut and run and become a government in exile. That’s what’s causing the problems for him. Yes, they expected tough resistance, but they expected a lot of that resistance to crumble when Zelensky left.

                  Beyond that, do you honestly believe Putin gives a rat’s ass about what the rest of the world thinks? I don’t.

                  The Brad

                  George KG 1 Reply Last reply
                  • LuFins DadL LuFins Dad

                    I think Putin expected the comedian to have already cut and run and become a government in exile. That’s what’s causing the problems for him. Yes, they expected tough resistance, but they expected a lot of that resistance to crumble when Zelensky left.

                    Beyond that, do you honestly believe Putin gives a rat’s ass about what the rest of the world thinks? I don’t.

                    George KG Offline
                    George KG Offline
                    George K
                    wrote on last edited by
                    #19

                    @LuFins-Dad said in So are the Russians surprised by outcomes?:

                    Beyond that, do you honestly believe Putin gives a rat’s ass about what the rest of the world thinks? I don’t.

                    Agreed about the "think" part. I don't think he expected the "does" part.

                    "Now look here, you Baltic gas passer... " - Mik, 6/14/08

                    The saying, "Lite is just one damn thing after another," is a gross understatement. The damn things overlap.

                    1 Reply Last reply
                    • MikM Mik

                      Opposition seems to be worldwide. The cyber part of this is really interesting. Anonymous claims to have had great success in shutting down things .ru.

                      https://www.msn.com/en-us/tv/news/anonymous-hacker-collective-takes-credit-for-cyberattacks-against-russian-government/ar-AAUmbAn?ocid=msedgntp

                      George KG Offline
                      George KG Offline
                      George K
                      wrote on last edited by
                      #20

                      @Mik said in So are the Russians surprised by outcomes?:

                      Opposition seems to be worldwide. The cyber part of this is really interesting. Anonymous claims to have had great success in shutting down things .ru.

                      https://www.msn.com/en-us/tv/news/anonymous-hacker-collective-takes-credit-for-cyberattacks-against-russian-government/ar-AAUmbAn?ocid=msedgntp

                      "Now look here, you Baltic gas passer... " - Mik, 6/14/08

                      The saying, "Lite is just one damn thing after another," is a gross understatement. The damn things overlap.

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