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The New Coffee Room

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  2. General Discussion
  3. So are the Russians surprised by outcomes?

So are the Russians surprised by outcomes?

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  • George KG Offline
    George KG Offline
    George K
    wrote on last edited by
    #8

    What is the website for the president of Russia?

    http://en.kremlin.ru/

    What is the website for the government of Russia?

    http://government.ru/en/

    What is the website for the mayor of Moscow?

    https://www.mos.ru/en/

    Go ahead, look at those pages.

    "Now look here, you Baltic gas passer... " - Mik, 6/14/08

    The saying, "Lite is just one damn thing after another," is a gross understatement. The damn things overlap.

    1 Reply Last reply
    • RenaudaR Offline
      RenaudaR Offline
      Renauda
      wrote on last edited by Renauda
      #9

      No doubt Ukrainian resistance thus far has been Alamo like and, as bach pointed out anticipated and gamed by the Russians well in advance. My hunch though is that the Kremlin has deliberately reined in the advance upon the urban centres in the hope of forcing a capitulation. In particular, Moscow would want to keep damage to Kyiv - which Putin himself has described as the “spiritual heart of the Russian nation” - at a minimum.

      Zelenskyi in the past half hour announced that a Ukrainian delegation will meet a Russian delegation on the Belarus border at the Pripyat River. I suspect terms will be offered to the Ukrainians in the event the final offensive will be avoided.

      Elbows up!

      JollyJ George KG 2 Replies Last reply
      • bachophileB bachophile

        I find it hard to believe all this talk on social media how the Russians are frustrated and surprised that there is such fierce resistance.

        This must have been war gamed out a millions ways to consider every option.

        I think the idea of the Ukrainians rallying around a brave president and showing spunk must have crossed their planners minds. As well as vast international condemnation. I’m sure they knew it was coming but made their calculations that they can weather the storm.

        Hard to believe after four days Putin is saying,oh man maybe I goofed.

        CopperC Offline
        CopperC Offline
        Copper
        wrote on last edited by
        #10

        @bachophile said in So are the Russians surprised by outcomes?:

        Hard to believe after four days Putin is saying,oh man maybe I goofed.

        How does the current situation compare to his stated goal for this date?

        1 Reply Last reply
        • RenaudaR Renauda

          No doubt Ukrainian resistance thus far has been Alamo like and, as bach pointed out anticipated and gamed by the Russians well in advance. My hunch though is that the Kremlin has deliberately reined in the advance upon the urban centres in the hope of forcing a capitulation. In particular, Moscow would want to keep damage to Kyiv - which Putin himself has described as the “spiritual heart of the Russian nation” - at a minimum.

          Zelenskyi in the past half hour announced that a Ukrainian delegation will meet a Russian delegation on the Belarus border at the Pripyat River. I suspect terms will be offered to the Ukrainians in the event the final offensive will be avoided.

          JollyJ Offline
          JollyJ Offline
          Jolly
          wrote on last edited by
          #11

          @Renauda said in So are the Russians surprised by outcomes?:

          No doubt Ukrainian resistance thus far has been Alamo like and, as bach pointed out anticipated and gamed by the Russians well in advance. My hunch though is that the Kremlin has deliberately reined in the advance upon the urban centres in the hope of forcing a capitulation. In particular, Moscow would want to keep damage to Kyiv - which Putin himself has described as the “heart of the Russian nation” - minimised.

          Zelensky in the past half hour announced that a Ukrainian delegation will meet a Russian delegation on the Belarus border at the Pripyat River. I suspect terms will be offered to the Ukrainians in the event the final offensive will be avoided.

          Russians will press and Ukranians will play for time?

          “Cry havoc and let slip the DOGE of war!”

          Those who cheered as J-6 American prisoners were locked in solitary for 18 months without trial, now suddenly fight tooth and nail for foreign terrorists’ "due process". — Buck Sexton

          1 Reply Last reply
          • RenaudaR Renauda

            No doubt Ukrainian resistance thus far has been Alamo like and, as bach pointed out anticipated and gamed by the Russians well in advance. My hunch though is that the Kremlin has deliberately reined in the advance upon the urban centres in the hope of forcing a capitulation. In particular, Moscow would want to keep damage to Kyiv - which Putin himself has described as the “spiritual heart of the Russian nation” - at a minimum.

            Zelenskyi in the past half hour announced that a Ukrainian delegation will meet a Russian delegation on the Belarus border at the Pripyat River. I suspect terms will be offered to the Ukrainians in the event the final offensive will be avoided.

            George KG Offline
            George KG Offline
            George K
            wrote on last edited by
            #12

            @Renauda said in So are the Russians surprised by outcomes?:

            I suspect terms will be offered to the Ukrainians in the event the final offensive will be avoided.

            I wonder what terms would be acceptable to the Ukrainians?

            "Now look here, you Baltic gas passer... " - Mik, 6/14/08

            The saying, "Lite is just one damn thing after another," is a gross understatement. The damn things overlap.

            1 Reply Last reply
            • MikM Offline
              MikM Offline
              Mik
              wrote on last edited by
              #13

              I wonder what precipitated the offer of talks.

              “I am fond of pigs. Dogs look up to us. Cats look down on us. Pigs treat us as equals.” ~Winston S. Churchill

              RenaudaR 1 Reply Last reply
              • MikM Mik

                I wonder what precipitated the offer of talks.

                RenaudaR Offline
                RenaudaR Offline
                Renauda
                wrote on last edited by Renauda
                #14

                @Mik

                Cynically I believe, it was in the Bear’s plan all along. It provides yet another thin layer of veneer of justification for domestic consumption.

                Elbows up!

                1 Reply Last reply
                • MikM Offline
                  MikM Offline
                  Mik
                  wrote on last edited by
                  #15

                  Could well be. Easier to believe than Putin was taken by surprise by world reaction and Ukrainian opposition.

                  “I am fond of pigs. Dogs look up to us. Cats look down on us. Pigs treat us as equals.” ~Winston S. Churchill

                  RenaudaR 1 Reply Last reply
                  • MikM Mik

                    Could well be. Easier to believe than Putin was taken by surprise by world reaction and Ukrainian opposition.

                    RenaudaR Offline
                    RenaudaR Offline
                    Renauda
                    wrote on last edited by Renauda
                    #16

                    @Mik

                    But realistically, Zelenskyi and his people must also know Churchill’s famous, although probably apocryphal, dictum;

                    “You cannot reason with a tiger when your head is in its mouth!”

                    Elbows up!

                    1 Reply Last reply
                    • LarryL Offline
                      LarryL Offline
                      Larry
                      wrote on last edited by
                      #17

                      Putin is scared shitless. He has already put his nuclear weapons forces on high alert, claiming it's because of the sanctions that have been put on him personally. He is scared that the Ukrainians might actually force him out, he is worried about the massive protests going on in Russia, and I believe he has snapped mentally. Lots of options for other world leaders to actually lead, but the US is being led by a moron, so expect Biden to fuck up any chance there might be to stop wwIII.

                      1 Reply Last reply
                      • LuFins DadL Offline
                        LuFins DadL Offline
                        LuFins Dad
                        wrote on last edited by
                        #18

                        I think Putin expected the comedian to have already cut and run and become a government in exile. That’s what’s causing the problems for him. Yes, they expected tough resistance, but they expected a lot of that resistance to crumble when Zelensky left.

                        Beyond that, do you honestly believe Putin gives a rat’s ass about what the rest of the world thinks? I don’t.

                        The Brad

                        George KG 1 Reply Last reply
                        • LuFins DadL LuFins Dad

                          I think Putin expected the comedian to have already cut and run and become a government in exile. That’s what’s causing the problems for him. Yes, they expected tough resistance, but they expected a lot of that resistance to crumble when Zelensky left.

                          Beyond that, do you honestly believe Putin gives a rat’s ass about what the rest of the world thinks? I don’t.

                          George KG Offline
                          George KG Offline
                          George K
                          wrote on last edited by
                          #19

                          @LuFins-Dad said in So are the Russians surprised by outcomes?:

                          Beyond that, do you honestly believe Putin gives a rat’s ass about what the rest of the world thinks? I don’t.

                          Agreed about the "think" part. I don't think he expected the "does" part.

                          "Now look here, you Baltic gas passer... " - Mik, 6/14/08

                          The saying, "Lite is just one damn thing after another," is a gross understatement. The damn things overlap.

                          1 Reply Last reply
                          • MikM Mik

                            Opposition seems to be worldwide. The cyber part of this is really interesting. Anonymous claims to have had great success in shutting down things .ru.

                            https://www.msn.com/en-us/tv/news/anonymous-hacker-collective-takes-credit-for-cyberattacks-against-russian-government/ar-AAUmbAn?ocid=msedgntp

                            George KG Offline
                            George KG Offline
                            George K
                            wrote on last edited by
                            #20

                            @Mik said in So are the Russians surprised by outcomes?:

                            Opposition seems to be worldwide. The cyber part of this is really interesting. Anonymous claims to have had great success in shutting down things .ru.

                            https://www.msn.com/en-us/tv/news/anonymous-hacker-collective-takes-credit-for-cyberattacks-against-russian-government/ar-AAUmbAn?ocid=msedgntp

                            "Now look here, you Baltic gas passer... " - Mik, 6/14/08

                            The saying, "Lite is just one damn thing after another," is a gross understatement. The damn things overlap.

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