So are the Russians surprised by outcomes?
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I find it hard to believe all this talk on social media how the Russians are frustrated and surprised that there is such fierce resistance.
This must have been war gamed out a millions ways to consider every option.
I think the idea of the Ukrainians rallying around a brave president and showing spunk must have crossed their planners minds. As well as vast international condemnation. I’m sure they knew it was coming but made their calculations that they can weather the storm.
Hard to believe after four days Putin is saying,oh man maybe I goofed.
wrote on 27 Feb 2022, 12:26 last edited by@bachophile said in So are the Russians surprised by outcomes?:
I find it hard to believe all this talk on social media how the Russians are frustrated and surprised that there is such fierce resistance.
This must have been war gamed out a millions ways to consider every option.
I think the idea of the Ukrainians rallying around a brave president and showing spunk must have crossed their planners minds. As well as vast international condemnation. I’m sure they knew it was coming but made their calculations that they can weather the storm.
Hard to believe after four days Putin is saying,oh man maybe I goofed.
I get that, but 4 days in and and Kyiv is still standing. That is not good news for Moscow, I think. There is a window during which the advantage is to the aggressor as the defense is being forced to react to your moves. After a certain amount of time that advantage does shift to the defender. I think you are going to see Ukraine actually going on the offensive soon…
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I find it hard to believe all this talk on social media how the Russians are frustrated and surprised that there is such fierce resistance.
This must have been war gamed out a millions ways to consider every option.
I think the idea of the Ukrainians rallying around a brave president and showing spunk must have crossed their planners minds. As well as vast international condemnation. I’m sure they knew it was coming but made their calculations that they can weather the storm.
Hard to believe after four days Putin is saying,oh man maybe I goofed.
wrote on 27 Feb 2022, 12:57 last edited by@bachophile said in So are the Russians surprised by outcomes?:
Hard to believe after four days Putin is saying,oh man maybe I goofed.
"Don't get cocky, kid."
You may be right, but I am still not optimistic. The resistance has been remarkable, to say the least.
But, if I'm wrong, and I hope I am, what happens to Putin after this clusterfuck of an invasion?
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wrote on 27 Feb 2022, 13:09 last edited by
Is Putin blinking?
https://www.cnn.com/europe/live-news/ukraine-russia-news-02-27-22/index.html
Ukrainian President Volodymyr Zelensky said he would be willing to hold talks with Russia but rejected the Russian proposal for a meeting to be held in Belarus, a staging ground for Moscow's invasion of Ukraine.
“We’ve heard a lot of talk about a meeting between Ukraine and Russia that might end this war and bring the peace back to us. Quite often [Minsk] is mentioned as the place for these negotiations," Zelensky said in an address posted on the presidency website on Sunday morning.
"The location was not chosen by [Ukraine] nor by [Belarus]. It was chosen by the Russian leadership."
Belarus has played a key role in Russia's invasion of Ukraine. Russian troops invaded through the Belarus border with support from Belarus' government, according to Ukrainian officials. The Biden administration has sanctioned nine Belarusian defense firms for their support of the invasion.
Addressing Belarus directly, Zelensky said: “If there were no aggressive actions from your territory, we could talk in Minsk, your city. When you were neutral, we talked in Minsk. That’s why we’re not talking in Minsk now."
In 2015, Ukrainian and Russian officials met in the Belarus capital to draw up the Minsk Agreements, which included a fragile ceasefire in two areas of Ukraine taken over by pro-Russian separatists the year before.
"Of course we want peace and want to meet. We want to end the war. Warsaw, Bratislava, Istanbul and Baku were offered to Russia. Any other cities are fine with us as long as there are no missiles flying from this country,” Zelensky said.
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wrote on 27 Feb 2022, 13:25 last edited by
Opposition seems to be worldwide. The cyber part of this is really interesting. Anonymous claims to have had great success in shutting down things .ru.
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Opposition seems to be worldwide. The cyber part of this is really interesting. Anonymous claims to have had great success in shutting down things .ru.
wrote on 27 Feb 2022, 13:27 last edited by@Mik said in So are the Russians surprised by outcomes?:
Opposition seems to be worldwide. The cyber part of this is really interesting. Anonymous claims to have had great success in shutting down things .ru.
I have been wondering if they have been countering some of Russia’s cyber attacks? I don’t think we will ever really know.
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@Mik said in So are the Russians surprised by outcomes?:
Opposition seems to be worldwide. The cyber part of this is really interesting. Anonymous claims to have had great success in shutting down things .ru.
I have been wondering if they have been countering some of Russia’s cyber attacks? I don’t think we will ever really know.
wrote on 27 Feb 2022, 13:47 last edited by@LuFins-Dad said in So are the Russians surprised by outcomes?:
I have been wondering if they have been countering some of Russia’s cyber attacks? I don’t think we will ever really know.
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wrote on 27 Feb 2022, 14:03 last edited by
What is the website for the president of Russia?
What is the website for the government of Russia?
What is the website for the mayor of Moscow?
Go ahead, look at those pages.
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wrote on 27 Feb 2022, 14:04 last edited by Renauda
No doubt Ukrainian resistance thus far has been Alamo like and, as bach pointed out anticipated and gamed by the Russians well in advance. My hunch though is that the Kremlin has deliberately reined in the advance upon the urban centres in the hope of forcing a capitulation. In particular, Moscow would want to keep damage to Kyiv - which Putin himself has described as the “spiritual heart of the Russian nation” - at a minimum.
Zelenskyi in the past half hour announced that a Ukrainian delegation will meet a Russian delegation on the Belarus border at the Pripyat River. I suspect terms will be offered to the Ukrainians in the event the final offensive will be avoided.
Elbows up!
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I find it hard to believe all this talk on social media how the Russians are frustrated and surprised that there is such fierce resistance.
This must have been war gamed out a millions ways to consider every option.
I think the idea of the Ukrainians rallying around a brave president and showing spunk must have crossed their planners minds. As well as vast international condemnation. I’m sure they knew it was coming but made their calculations that they can weather the storm.
Hard to believe after four days Putin is saying,oh man maybe I goofed.
wrote on 27 Feb 2022, 14:31 last edited by@bachophile said in So are the Russians surprised by outcomes?:
Hard to believe after four days Putin is saying,oh man maybe I goofed.
How does the current situation compare to his stated goal for this date?
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No doubt Ukrainian resistance thus far has been Alamo like and, as bach pointed out anticipated and gamed by the Russians well in advance. My hunch though is that the Kremlin has deliberately reined in the advance upon the urban centres in the hope of forcing a capitulation. In particular, Moscow would want to keep damage to Kyiv - which Putin himself has described as the “spiritual heart of the Russian nation” - at a minimum.
Zelenskyi in the past half hour announced that a Ukrainian delegation will meet a Russian delegation on the Belarus border at the Pripyat River. I suspect terms will be offered to the Ukrainians in the event the final offensive will be avoided.
wrote on 27 Feb 2022, 14:34 last edited by@Renauda said in So are the Russians surprised by outcomes?:
No doubt Ukrainian resistance thus far has been Alamo like and, as bach pointed out anticipated and gamed by the Russians well in advance. My hunch though is that the Kremlin has deliberately reined in the advance upon the urban centres in the hope of forcing a capitulation. In particular, Moscow would want to keep damage to Kyiv - which Putin himself has described as the “heart of the Russian nation” - minimised.
Zelensky in the past half hour announced that a Ukrainian delegation will meet a Russian delegation on the Belarus border at the Pripyat River. I suspect terms will be offered to the Ukrainians in the event the final offensive will be avoided.
Russians will press and Ukranians will play for time?
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No doubt Ukrainian resistance thus far has been Alamo like and, as bach pointed out anticipated and gamed by the Russians well in advance. My hunch though is that the Kremlin has deliberately reined in the advance upon the urban centres in the hope of forcing a capitulation. In particular, Moscow would want to keep damage to Kyiv - which Putin himself has described as the “spiritual heart of the Russian nation” - at a minimum.
Zelenskyi in the past half hour announced that a Ukrainian delegation will meet a Russian delegation on the Belarus border at the Pripyat River. I suspect terms will be offered to the Ukrainians in the event the final offensive will be avoided.
wrote on 27 Feb 2022, 14:46 last edited by@Renauda said in So are the Russians surprised by outcomes?:
I suspect terms will be offered to the Ukrainians in the event the final offensive will be avoided.
I wonder what terms would be acceptable to the Ukrainians?
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wrote on 27 Feb 2022, 14:49 last edited by
I wonder what precipitated the offer of talks.
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wrote on 27 Feb 2022, 14:57 last edited by
Could well be. Easier to believe than Putin was taken by surprise by world reaction and Ukrainian opposition.
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Could well be. Easier to believe than Putin was taken by surprise by world reaction and Ukrainian opposition.
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wrote on 27 Feb 2022, 15:04 last edited by
Putin is scared shitless. He has already put his nuclear weapons forces on high alert, claiming it's because of the sanctions that have been put on him personally. He is scared that the Ukrainians might actually force him out, he is worried about the massive protests going on in Russia, and I believe he has snapped mentally. Lots of options for other world leaders to actually lead, but the US is being led by a moron, so expect Biden to fuck up any chance there might be to stop wwIII.
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wrote on 27 Feb 2022, 15:23 last edited by
I think Putin expected the comedian to have already cut and run and become a government in exile. That’s what’s causing the problems for him. Yes, they expected tough resistance, but they expected a lot of that resistance to crumble when Zelensky left.
Beyond that, do you honestly believe Putin gives a rat’s ass about what the rest of the world thinks? I don’t.
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I think Putin expected the comedian to have already cut and run and become a government in exile. That’s what’s causing the problems for him. Yes, they expected tough resistance, but they expected a lot of that resistance to crumble when Zelensky left.
Beyond that, do you honestly believe Putin gives a rat’s ass about what the rest of the world thinks? I don’t.
wrote on 27 Feb 2022, 15:30 last edited by@LuFins-Dad said in So are the Russians surprised by outcomes?:
Beyond that, do you honestly believe Putin gives a rat’s ass about what the rest of the world thinks? I don’t.
Agreed about the "think" part. I don't think he expected the "does" part.
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Opposition seems to be worldwide. The cyber part of this is really interesting. Anonymous claims to have had great success in shutting down things .ru.
wrote on 24 Mar 2022, 11:51 last edited by@Mik said in So are the Russians surprised by outcomes?:
Opposition seems to be worldwide. The cyber part of this is really interesting. Anonymous claims to have had great success in shutting down things .ru.
