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The New Coffee Room

  1. TNCR
  2. General Discussion
  3. Puzzle time - don't waste braindead liberals

Puzzle time - don't waste braindead liberals

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  • jon-nycJ Online
    jon-nycJ Online
    jon-nyc
    wrote on last edited by
    #24

    That wasn’t correct. I need to fix it and repost.

    Only non-witches get due process.

    • Cotton Mather, Salem Massachusetts, 1692
    1 Reply Last reply
    • KlausK Offline
      KlausK Offline
      Klaus
      wrote on last edited by Klaus
      #25

      You are close. Many right ideas in your draft.

      1 Reply Last reply
      • jon-nycJ Online
        jon-nycJ Online
        jon-nyc
        wrote on last edited by
        #26

        I know it’s the second example I drew out which I didn’t like.

        Only non-witches get due process.

        • Cotton Mather, Salem Massachusetts, 1692
        1 Reply Last reply
        • jon-nycJ Online
          jon-nycJ Online
          jon-nyc
          wrote on last edited by
          #27

          I am confident my answer is right, just trying to show it’s exhaustive

          Only non-witches get due process.

          • Cotton Mather, Salem Massachusetts, 1692
          1 Reply Last reply
          • KlausK Offline
            KlausK Offline
            Klaus
            wrote on last edited by Klaus
            #28

            I think it's not exhaustive. You get only 11 distinct BDLs that way, not 16.

            1 Reply Last reply
            • jon-nycJ Online
              jon-nycJ Online
              jon-nyc
              wrote on last edited by
              #29

              I got 16. 25 possible segments, 9 fell out as redundant.

              Only non-witches get due process.

              • Cotton Mather, Salem Massachusetts, 1692
              1 Reply Last reply
              • KlausK Offline
                KlausK Offline
                Klaus
                wrote on last edited by
                #30

                9 are obviously redundant. But there are 4 more that are redundant. Do you want me to illustrate that?

                1 Reply Last reply
                • jon-nycJ Online
                  jon-nycJ Online
                  jon-nyc
                  wrote on last edited by
                  #31

                  Not yet

                  Only non-witches get due process.

                  • Cotton Mather, Salem Massachusetts, 1692
                  1 Reply Last reply
                  • jon-nycJ Online
                    jon-nycJ Online
                    jon-nyc
                    wrote on last edited by
                    #32

                    Yes so the midpoints, shifted if necessary, of the following segments:

                    A0-L0
                    A0-L1
                    A0-L2
                    A0-L3
                    A0-L4
                    A1-L2
                    A1-L3
                    A1-L4
                    A2-L3
                    A2-L4
                    A3-L4

                    Where A0 and L0 are the positions of Ax and Larry respectively. and A1-4 and L1-4 are their apparent positions in the 4 mirrors that surround them.

                    Only non-witches get due process.

                    • Cotton Mather, Salem Massachusetts, 1692
                    1 Reply Last reply
                    • KlausK Offline
                      KlausK Offline
                      Klaus
                      wrote on last edited by
                      #33

                      Exactly. The detail that you presumably missed previously was that the situation is symmetric: The midpoint of A1-L2 is the same as A2-L1. That's why only 11 remain.

                      But those 11 aren't enough.

                      1 Reply Last reply
                      • jon-nycJ Online
                        jon-nycJ Online
                        jon-nyc
                        wrote on last edited by
                        #34

                        I could put the arena on a coordinate system and define all the points of the 11 barriers in terms of Ax's coordinates x1,y1; Larry's coordinates x2,y2; and the width W and height(depth) H of the arena.

                        Only non-witches get due process.

                        • Cotton Mather, Salem Massachusetts, 1692
                        1 Reply Last reply
                        • jon-nycJ Online
                          jon-nycJ Online
                          jon-nyc
                          wrote on last edited by jon-nyc
                          #35

                          That's what I was getting at earlier, wondering if they were exhaustive. I didn't look for higher-order reflections, assuming or hoping they'd collapse to the ones I'd defined. Give me some more time.

                          Only non-witches get due process.

                          • Cotton Mather, Salem Massachusetts, 1692
                          1 Reply Last reply
                          • KlausK Offline
                            KlausK Offline
                            Klaus
                            wrote on last edited by Klaus
                            #36

                            If you want some data to play around with: I wrote down 10 lines of code to help me verify my method, which also supports your approach without many modifications (which shows that you are not far off from mine).

                            For instance, for this setup:

                            larry = (1.0,2.0)
                            ax = (8.0,5.0)
                            width = 10.0
                            height = 6.0
                            

                            your approach yields the following 25 midpoints:

                            [(4.5,3.5),(4.5,7.5),(4.5,1.5),(13.5,3.5),(3.5,3.5),(4.5,4.5),(4.5,8.5),(4.5,2.5),(13.5,4.5),(3.5,4.5),(4.5,-1.5),(4.5,2.5),(4.5,-3.5),(13.5,-1.5),(3.5,-1.5),(6.5,3.5),(6.5,7.5),(6.5,1.5),(15.5,3.5),(5.5,3.5),(-3.5,3.5),(-3.5,7.5),(-3.5,1.5),(5.5,3.5),(-4.5,3.5)]
                            

                            which, when shifted back, yield these 11 coordinates for BDLs:

                            [(3.5,1.5),(3.5,3.5),(3.5,4.5),(4.5,1.5),(4.5,2.5),(4.5,3.5),(4.5,4.5),(5.5,3.5),(6.5,1.5),(6.5,3.5),(6.5,4.5)]
                            
                            1 Reply Last reply
                            • jon-nycJ Online
                              jon-nycJ Online
                              jon-nyc
                              wrote on last edited by jon-nyc
                              #37

                              I think I got it. I need to add two additional reflections for each of Ax and Larry which amount to the double reflections off the pair of mirrors at each corner.

                              That gives me 36 segments, of which 20 drop out as redundant.

                              Only non-witches get due process.

                              • Cotton Mather, Salem Massachusetts, 1692
                              1 Reply Last reply
                              • jon-nycJ Online
                                jon-nycJ Online
                                jon-nyc
                                wrote on last edited by jon-nyc
                                #38

                                This sketch shows the reflections for two arbitrary points.

                                Screen Shot 2020-10-17 at 5.57.37 PM.png

                                Only non-witches get due process.

                                • Cotton Mather, Salem Massachusetts, 1692
                                1 Reply Last reply
                                • KlausK Offline
                                  KlausK Offline
                                  Klaus
                                  wrote on last edited by
                                  #39

                                  I agree with the 16, but why is that exhaustive?

                                  1 Reply Last reply
                                  • jon-nycJ Online
                                    jon-nycJ Online
                                    jon-nyc
                                    wrote on last edited by
                                    #40

                                    Proof tomorrow. 😉

                                    Only non-witches get due process.

                                    • Cotton Mather, Salem Massachusetts, 1692
                                    1 Reply Last reply
                                    • KlausK Offline
                                      KlausK Offline
                                      Klaus
                                      wrote on last edited by
                                      #41

                                      OK, so this is what I got.

                                      ||

                                      1. Create an infinite grid of copies of the room by mirroring the room, with the original room in the center. Each copy gets a copy of Ax (but not of Larry). Now there's a 1:1 correspondence between the possible attacks and the straight lines from Ax copies to Larry.

                                      2. Consider the set of midpoints of those straight lines, reflected back to the original rectangle.
                                        They form 16 distinct points. Why only 16? It turns out that if you move by 4 rooms on the infinite grid in any direction, the midpoint (reflected back) is the same. Consider for instance the grid at (0,0) (the original room) vs (4,0). The midpoint lies in the room at (2,0), which has the same layout as the original room (because it was mirrored twice). That's why situation from (4,0) is basically like a magnified version of the original situation at (0,0). A similar argument can be made for moving by 4 rooms in any other direction. Hence it is sufficient to consider any 4x4 square of rooms.

                                      If you are interested, I wrote a few lines of code to compute the coordinates that I'm happy to share.
                                      ||

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