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The New Coffee Room

  1. TNCR
  2. General Discussion
  3. Massie: This bill adds 20T to the debt over 10 years.

Massie: This bill adds 20T to the debt over 10 years.

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  • 8 89th
    26 Feb 2025, 14:48

    Not as sexy as a headline of "$60 million dollars sent to NY on illegals!"

    We're fucked.

    H Offline
    H Offline
    Horace
    wrote on 26 Feb 2025, 15:13 last edited by
    #6

    @89th said in Massie: This bill adds 20T to the debt over 10 years.:

    Not as sexy as a headline of "$60 million dollars sent to NY on illegals!"

    We're fucked.

    Yeah, but it's impossible to take seriously any argument that a vote for Harris would have put us on a viable correction course.

    Education is extremely important.

    1 Reply Last reply
    • 8 Offline
      8 Offline
      89th
      wrote on 26 Feb 2025, 15:14 last edited by
      #7

      Yeah Harris would've just been a sequel to Weekend at Bernie's.

      1 Reply Last reply
      • L Offline
        L Offline
        LuFins Dad
        wrote on 26 Feb 2025, 15:14 last edited by
        #8

        The bill is a bunch of crap for a lot of reasons beyond the deficit increase. If passed, it makes servers and common labor into a protected and favored class, paying less on their taxes than others in the same income bracket. That is nuts. I want to see what those numbers alone are. I honestly wonder about the legality of it.

        But the meat of it is still making the 2017 tax cuts permanent, and frankly, I distrust the CBO’s estimates. From 2019-2023, the tax revenues averaged nearly $170B more per year than the CBO projections. At the same time, CBO projections on higher tax levels almost always overestimate the projected revenue. CBO projections for the Obama years projected $30T in federal revenues under the Obama administration’s plans, but the reality was about $4.5T less.

        Simultaneously, we’ve got a very serious market and real estate bubble going on, inflation is still higher than the Fed is comfortable with, and we still have high interest rates over what we’re used to seeing. We need substantial and sustainable growth right now, desperately. I don’t see how that happens while raising taxes back to the Obama levels.

        The Brad

        H J 2 Replies Last reply 26 Feb 2025, 15:19
        • L LuFins Dad
          26 Feb 2025, 15:14

          The bill is a bunch of crap for a lot of reasons beyond the deficit increase. If passed, it makes servers and common labor into a protected and favored class, paying less on their taxes than others in the same income bracket. That is nuts. I want to see what those numbers alone are. I honestly wonder about the legality of it.

          But the meat of it is still making the 2017 tax cuts permanent, and frankly, I distrust the CBO’s estimates. From 2019-2023, the tax revenues averaged nearly $170B more per year than the CBO projections. At the same time, CBO projections on higher tax levels almost always overestimate the projected revenue. CBO projections for the Obama years projected $30T in federal revenues under the Obama administration’s plans, but the reality was about $4.5T less.

          Simultaneously, we’ve got a very serious market and real estate bubble going on, inflation is still higher than the Fed is comfortable with, and we still have high interest rates over what we’re used to seeing. We need substantial and sustainable growth right now, desperately. I don’t see how that happens while raising taxes back to the Obama levels.

          H Offline
          H Offline
          Horace
          wrote on 26 Feb 2025, 15:19 last edited by
          #9

          @LuFins-Dad said in Massie: This bill adds 20T to the debt over 10 years.:

          The bill is a bunch of crap for a lot of reasons beyond the deficit increase. If passed, it makes servers and common labor into a protected and favored class, paying less on their taxes than others in the same income bracket. That is nuts. I want to see what those numbers alone are. I honestly wonder about the legality of it.

          I get the principle of the objection, but I think the actual numbers in play here are a rounding error.

          Education is extremely important.

          L 1 Reply Last reply 26 Feb 2025, 15:54
          • H Horace
            26 Feb 2025, 15:19

            @LuFins-Dad said in Massie: This bill adds 20T to the debt over 10 years.:

            The bill is a bunch of crap for a lot of reasons beyond the deficit increase. If passed, it makes servers and common labor into a protected and favored class, paying less on their taxes than others in the same income bracket. That is nuts. I want to see what those numbers alone are. I honestly wonder about the legality of it.

            I get the principle of the objection, but I think the actual numbers in play here are a rounding error.

            L Offline
            L Offline
            LuFins Dad
            wrote on 26 Feb 2025, 15:54 last edited by
            #10

            @Horace said in Massie: This bill adds 20T to the debt increase 10 years.:

            @LuFins-Dad said in Massie: This bill adds 20T to the debt over 10 years.:

            The bill is a bunch of crap for a lot of reasons beyond the deficit increase. If passed, it makes servers and common labor into a protected and favored class, paying less on their taxes than others in the same income bracket. That is nuts. I want to see what those numbers alone are. I honestly wonder about the legality of it.

            I get the principle of the objection, but I think the actual numbers in play here are a rounding error.

            You’re probably right, but the principal of the objection is still the point.

            Can my year end bonus be made a tip? Heck, what about my commissions?

            The Brad

            1 Reply Last reply
            • J Offline
              J Offline
              jon-nyc
              wrote on 26 Feb 2025, 16:09 last edited by
              #11

              Wait until hedge fund managers start paying themselves tips from their LLCs.

              Only non-witches get due process.

              • Cotton Mather, Salem Massachusetts, 1692
              1 Reply Last reply
              • L LuFins Dad
                26 Feb 2025, 15:14

                The bill is a bunch of crap for a lot of reasons beyond the deficit increase. If passed, it makes servers and common labor into a protected and favored class, paying less on their taxes than others in the same income bracket. That is nuts. I want to see what those numbers alone are. I honestly wonder about the legality of it.

                But the meat of it is still making the 2017 tax cuts permanent, and frankly, I distrust the CBO’s estimates. From 2019-2023, the tax revenues averaged nearly $170B more per year than the CBO projections. At the same time, CBO projections on higher tax levels almost always overestimate the projected revenue. CBO projections for the Obama years projected $30T in federal revenues under the Obama administration’s plans, but the reality was about $4.5T less.

                Simultaneously, we’ve got a very serious market and real estate bubble going on, inflation is still higher than the Fed is comfortable with, and we still have high interest rates over what we’re used to seeing. We need substantial and sustainable growth right now, desperately. I don’t see how that happens while raising taxes back to the Obama levels.

                J Offline
                J Offline
                Jolly
                wrote on 26 Feb 2025, 16:21 last edited by
                #12

                @LuFins-Dad said in Massie: This bill adds 20T to the debt over 10 years.:

                Simultaneously, we’ve got a very serious market and real estate bubble going on, inflation is still higher than the Fed is comfortable with, and we still have high interest rates over what we’re used to seeing. We need substantial and sustainable growth right now, desperately. I don’t see how that happens while raising taxes back to the Obama levels.

                This. 👆

                I'm also in favor of a cap on the tip exemption.

                “Cry havoc and let slip the DOGE of war!”

                Those who cheered as J-6 American prisoners were locked in solitary for 18 months without trial, now suddenly fight tooth and nail for foreign terrorists’ "due process". — Buck Sexton

                1 Reply Last reply
                • J Offline
                  J Offline
                  Jolly
                  wrote on 26 Feb 2025, 16:22 last edited by
                  #13

                  Secondly, a lot of our problem is entitlements. Fer gawd's sake, take the cap off of FICA...

                  “Cry havoc and let slip the DOGE of war!”

                  Those who cheered as J-6 American prisoners were locked in solitary for 18 months without trial, now suddenly fight tooth and nail for foreign terrorists’ "due process". — Buck Sexton

                  1 Reply Last reply
                  • H Offline
                    H Offline
                    Horace
                    wrote on 26 Feb 2025, 16:24 last edited by
                    #14

                    So, where's the removal of the SS cap? Is that in the picture in any conceivable legislative future?

                    Education is extremely important.

                    1 Reply Last reply
                    • L Offline
                      L Offline
                      LuFins Dad
                      wrote on 26 Feb 2025, 16:39 last edited by
                      #15

                      Pssst, it’s not the entitlements…

                      https://budget.house.gov/press-release/op-ed-wall-street-journal-welfare-is-whats-eating-the-budget

                      The Brad

                      J 1 Reply Last reply 26 Feb 2025, 16:47
                      • H Offline
                        H Offline
                        Horace
                        wrote on 26 Feb 2025, 16:45 last edited by
                        #16

                        "We give too much money to the poor" will be a tough sell.

                        Education is extremely important.

                        1 Reply Last reply
                        • L LuFins Dad
                          26 Feb 2025, 16:39

                          Pssst, it’s not the entitlements…

                          https://budget.house.gov/press-release/op-ed-wall-street-journal-welfare-is-whats-eating-the-budget

                          J Offline
                          J Offline
                          jon-nyc
                          wrote on 26 Feb 2025, 16:47 last edited by jon-nyc
                          #17

                          @LuFins-Dad said in Massie: This bill adds 20T to the debt over 10 years.:

                          Pssst, it’s not the entitlements…

                          https://budget.house.gov/press-release/op-ed-wall-street-journal-welfare-is-whats-eating-the-budget

                          This is really disingenuous. The ticking time bomb that are entitlements won’t actually explode for a decade ergo it’s not the problem.

                          Zero out everything he mentions and entitlements still bankrupt us before Finley graduates college.

                          Only non-witches get due process.

                          • Cotton Mather, Salem Massachusetts, 1692
                          L 1 Reply Last reply 26 Feb 2025, 17:08
                          • C Offline
                            C Offline
                            Copper
                            wrote on 26 Feb 2025, 16:52 last edited by
                            #18

                            This might be a good time to start a balanced budget movement.

                            1 Reply Last reply
                            • J jon-nyc
                              26 Feb 2025, 16:47

                              @LuFins-Dad said in Massie: This bill adds 20T to the debt over 10 years.:

                              Pssst, it’s not the entitlements…

                              https://budget.house.gov/press-release/op-ed-wall-street-journal-welfare-is-whats-eating-the-budget

                              This is really disingenuous. The ticking time bomb that are entitlements won’t actually explode for a decade ergo it’s not the problem.

                              Zero out everything he mentions and entitlements still bankrupt us before Finley graduates college.

                              L Offline
                              L Offline
                              LuFins Dad
                              wrote on 26 Feb 2025, 17:08 last edited by
                              #19

                              @jon-nyc said in Massie: This bill adds 20T to the debt over 10 years.:

                              @LuFins-Dad said in Massie: This bill adds 20T to the debt over 10 years.:

                              Pssst, it’s not the entitlements…

                              https://budget.house.gov/press-release/op-ed-wall-street-journal-welfare-is-whats-eating-the-budget

                              This is really disingenuous. The ticking time bomb that are entitlements won’t actually explode for a decade ergo it’s not the problem.

                              Zero out everything he mentions and entitlements still bankrupt us before Finley graduates college.

                              Yeah, remind me again who has been calling for a removal of the FICA caps and a .5% FICA increase?

                              The Brad

                              J 1 Reply Last reply 26 Feb 2025, 17:10
                              • L Offline
                                L Offline
                                LuFins Dad
                                wrote on 26 Feb 2025, 17:10 last edited by
                                #20

                                But everybody keeps forgetting about the upcoming 25% tariffs. That will take care of everything.

                                The Brad

                                1 Reply Last reply
                                • L LuFins Dad
                                  26 Feb 2025, 17:08

                                  @jon-nyc said in Massie: This bill adds 20T to the debt over 10 years.:

                                  @LuFins-Dad said in Massie: This bill adds 20T to the debt over 10 years.:

                                  Pssst, it’s not the entitlements…

                                  https://budget.house.gov/press-release/op-ed-wall-street-journal-welfare-is-whats-eating-the-budget

                                  This is really disingenuous. The ticking time bomb that are entitlements won’t actually explode for a decade ergo it’s not the problem.

                                  Zero out everything he mentions and entitlements still bankrupt us before Finley graduates college.

                                  Yeah, remind me again who has been calling for a removal of the FICA caps and a .5% FICA increase?

                                  J Offline
                                  J Offline
                                  jon-nyc
                                  wrote on 26 Feb 2025, 17:10 last edited by
                                  #21

                                  @LuFins-Dad said in Massie: This bill adds 20T to the debt over 10 years.:

                                  @jon-nyc said in Massie: This bill adds 20T to the debt over 10 years.:

                                  @LuFins-Dad said in Massie: This bill adds 20T to the debt over 10 years.:

                                  Pssst, it’s not the entitlements…

                                  https://budget.house.gov/press-release/op-ed-wall-street-journal-welfare-is-whats-eating-the-budget

                                  This is really disingenuous. The ticking time bomb that are entitlements won’t actually explode for a decade ergo it’s not the problem.

                                  Zero out everything he mentions and entitlements still bankrupt us before Finley graduates college.

                                  Yeah, remind me again who has been calling for a removal of the FICA caps and a .5% FICA increase?

                                  Me.

                                  Only non-witches get due process.

                                  • Cotton Mather, Salem Massachusetts, 1692
                                  L 1 Reply Last reply 26 Feb 2025, 17:16
                                  • H Offline
                                    H Offline
                                    Horace
                                    wrote on 26 Feb 2025, 17:15 last edited by
                                    #22

                                    I think everybody on this board has been in favor of a removal of the SS cap.

                                    Education is extremely important.

                                    L 8 2 Replies Last reply 26 Feb 2025, 17:16
                                    • J jon-nyc
                                      26 Feb 2025, 17:10

                                      @LuFins-Dad said in Massie: This bill adds 20T to the debt over 10 years.:

                                      @jon-nyc said in Massie: This bill adds 20T to the debt over 10 years.:

                                      @LuFins-Dad said in Massie: This bill adds 20T to the debt over 10 years.:

                                      Pssst, it’s not the entitlements…

                                      https://budget.house.gov/press-release/op-ed-wall-street-journal-welfare-is-whats-eating-the-budget

                                      This is really disingenuous. The ticking time bomb that are entitlements won’t actually explode for a decade ergo it’s not the problem.

                                      Zero out everything he mentions and entitlements still bankrupt us before Finley graduates college.

                                      Yeah, remind me again who has been calling for a removal of the FICA caps and a .5% FICA increase?

                                      Me.

                                      L Offline
                                      L Offline
                                      LuFins Dad
                                      wrote on 26 Feb 2025, 17:16 last edited by
                                      #23

                                      @jon-nyc said in Massie: This bill adds 20T to the debt over 10 years.:

                                      @LuFins-Dad said in Massie: This bill adds 20T to the debt over 10 years.:

                                      @jon-nyc said in Massie: This bill adds 20T to the debt over 10 years.:

                                      @LuFins-Dad said in Massie: This bill adds 20T to the debt over 10 years.:

                                      Pssst, it’s not the entitlements…

                                      https://budget.house.gov/press-release/op-ed-wall-street-journal-welfare-is-whats-eating-the-budget

                                      This is really disingenuous. The ticking time bomb that are entitlements won’t actually explode for a decade ergo it’s not the problem.

                                      Zero out everything he mentions and entitlements still bankrupt us before Finley graduates college.

                                      Yeah, remind me again who has been calling for a removal of the FICA caps and a .5% FICA increase?

                                      Me.

                                      Here’s one of mine - https://nodebb.the-new-coffee-room.club/post/328667

                                      Show me one of yours.

                                      The Brad

                                      1 Reply Last reply
                                      • H Horace
                                        26 Feb 2025, 17:15

                                        I think everybody on this board has been in favor of a removal of the SS cap.

                                        L Offline
                                        L Offline
                                        LuFins Dad
                                        wrote on 26 Feb 2025, 17:16 last edited by
                                        #24

                                        @Horace said in Massie: This bill adds 20T to the debt over 10 years.:

                                        I think everybody on this board has been in favor of a removal of the SS cap.

                                        Ahhh, but a FICA increase as well?

                                        The Brad

                                        1 Reply Last reply
                                        • H Horace
                                          26 Feb 2025, 17:15

                                          I think everybody on this board has been in favor of a removal of the SS cap.

                                          8 Offline
                                          8 Offline
                                          89th
                                          wrote on 26 Feb 2025, 18:48 last edited by
                                          #25

                                          @Horace said in Massie: This bill adds 20T to the debt over 10 years.:

                                          I think everybody on this board has been in favor of a removal of the SS cap.

                                          Speak for yourselves! I make $2 million per year and have no need to pay social security after the first $175k... aka what I call January's paycheck.

                                          AxtremusA 1 Reply Last reply 27 Feb 2025, 03:41
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