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The New Coffee Room

  1. TNCR
  2. General Discussion
  3. The Ukraine war thread

The Ukraine war thread

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  • MikM Mik

    Good article, if not cheery. I think the major point is decisive victory is unlikely for either nation, but Russia's economy is so much smaller than the West's. The question is Ukrainian manpower. Weapons are important but you have to preserve the people to operate them.

    RenaudaR Offline
    RenaudaR Offline
    Renauda
    wrote on last edited by
    #1973

    @Mik

    This morning in a Zoom scrum between friends and former colleagues, we parsed through Freedman’s report. One of our number with considerably more experience in these matters than I, expressed his concern that he senses a growing risk of fraying in team Kyiv as to what and how to adjust strategy while at the same time maintaining the necessary messaging to manage expectations on multiple fronts and levels.

    I suspect his concern is well founded.

    Elbows up!

    1 Reply Last reply
    • MikM Away
      MikM Away
      Mik
      wrote on last edited by
      #1974

      It's a lot to maintain that fighting spirit as the Russian onslaught, incompetent though it may be, continues to wear them down.

      “I am fond of pigs. Dogs look up to us. Cats look down on us. Pigs treat us as equals.” ~Winston S. Churchill

      1 Reply Last reply
      • MikM Away
        MikM Away
        Mik
        wrote on last edited by
        #1975

        Speaking of Russian competence...

        https://www.msn.com/en-us/news/world/russian-troops-are-being-blown-up-by-their-own-minefields-because-their-leaders-won-t-say-where-they-are-ukraine-says/ar-AA1kMvEt?ocid=msedgntp&cvid=d3301936c16f4c89be763761bf1b15fa&ei=115

        “I am fond of pigs. Dogs look up to us. Cats look down on us. Pigs treat us as equals.” ~Winston S. Churchill

        1 Reply Last reply
        • George KG Offline
          George KG Offline
          George K
          wrote on last edited by
          #1976

          "Now look here, you Baltic gas passer... " - Mik, 6/14/08

          The saying, "Lite is just one damn thing after another," is a gross understatement. The damn things overlap.

          1 Reply Last reply
          • RenaudaR Offline
            RenaudaR Offline
            Renauda
            wrote on last edited by
            #1977

            Yesterday T. E. Lawrence just smiled, today it’s sardonic laughter:

            https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-europe-67593041

            Elbows up!

            1 Reply Last reply
            • MikM Away
              MikM Away
              Mik
              wrote on last edited by
              #1978

              Smart. Ukraine cannot kill enough Russians to stop the war, but an ill-equipped army can't accomplish much of anything except get itself killed.

              “I am fond of pigs. Dogs look up to us. Cats look down on us. Pigs treat us as equals.” ~Winston S. Churchill

              1 Reply Last reply
              • RenaudaR Offline
                RenaudaR Offline
                Renauda
                wrote on last edited by Renauda
                #1979

                More meat for the grinder….

                https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-europe-67592803

                And somehow NATO is to blame.

                Elbows up!

                1 Reply Last reply
                • George KG Offline
                  George KG Offline
                  George K
                  wrote on last edited by
                  #1980

                  https://www.statista.com/statistics/1334454/russian-armed-forces-personnel/

                  Screenshot 2023-12-01 at 5.13.37 PM.png

                  Even if the Ukrainian claim of 300K casualties is inflated by a factor of two, it's still a big hit.

                  "Now look here, you Baltic gas passer... " - Mik, 6/14/08

                  The saying, "Lite is just one damn thing after another," is a gross understatement. The damn things overlap.

                  1 Reply Last reply
                  • W Offline
                    W Offline
                    Wim
                    wrote on last edited by
                    #1981

                    A diplomatic failure for Russia:

                    https://euromaidanpress.com/2023/12/02/ukraine-outmaneuvers-russia-at-osce-in-chemical-weapons-maritime-agencies/

                    RenaudaR 1 Reply Last reply
                    • MikM Away
                      MikM Away
                      Mik
                      wrote on last edited by
                      #1982

                      It would appear Russia does not fear isolation.

                      “I am fond of pigs. Dogs look up to us. Cats look down on us. Pigs treat us as equals.” ~Winston S. Churchill

                      1 Reply Last reply
                      • W Wim

                        A diplomatic failure for Russia:

                        https://euromaidanpress.com/2023/12/02/ukraine-outmaneuvers-russia-at-osce-in-chemical-weapons-maritime-agencies/

                        RenaudaR Offline
                        RenaudaR Offline
                        Renauda
                        wrote on last edited by
                        #1983

                        @Wim
                        The losses are significant from the Kremlin’s point of view in that it surely feels it has a right to entitlement to have a voting representative on both agencies’ governing bodies.

                        Big diplomatic win for Ukraine, EU and NATO.

                        Elbows up!

                        W 1 Reply Last reply
                        • RenaudaR Renauda

                          @Wim
                          The losses are significant from the Kremlin’s point of view in that it surely feels it has a right to entitlement to have a voting representative on both agencies’ governing bodies.

                          Big diplomatic win for Ukraine, EU and NATO.

                          W Offline
                          W Offline
                          Wim
                          wrote on last edited by
                          #1984

                          @Renauda I suppose Lavrov felt pretty uneasy. Who else is to be blamed for this debacle?

                          1 Reply Last reply
                          • MikM Away
                            MikM Away
                            Mik
                            wrote on last edited by
                            #1985

                            Here's what might help Putin out of office. Not sure where he's getting the cash for this expansion.

                            https://www.msn.com/en-us/news/world/putin-orders-russian-armed-forces-personnel-increase-of-170-000/ar-AA1kTUtQ?ocid=msedgntp&cvid=138bcec0f1bd4d798538c5f270b2d1c3&ei=17

                            “I am fond of pigs. Dogs look up to us. Cats look down on us. Pigs treat us as equals.” ~Winston S. Churchill

                            1 Reply Last reply
                            • JollyJ Offline
                              JollyJ Offline
                              Jolly
                              wrote on last edited by
                              #1986

                              The average age of a Ukraine soldier is in the forties. Putin is playing a war of attrition, using bodies instead of equipment.

                              Biden straddled the fence too long. Not the right equipment, not enough equipment, too many restrictions on use.

                              Almost as if he was fighting a proxy war, trying to simply bleed the Russians.

                              “Cry havoc and let slip the DOGE of war!”

                              Those who cheered as J-6 American prisoners were locked in solitary for 18 months without trial, now suddenly fight tooth and nail for foreign terrorists’ "due process". — Buck Sexton

                              1 Reply Last reply
                              • W Offline
                                W Offline
                                Wim
                                wrote on last edited by
                                #1987

                                Speaking of attrition:
                                https://euromaidanpress.com/2023/12/03/frontline-report-russian-soldiers-refuse-to-attack-dnipro-islands-as-ukrainians-maintain-bridgehead-across-the-river/

                                1 Reply Last reply
                                • W Offline
                                  W Offline
                                  Wim
                                  wrote on last edited by
                                  #1988

                                  Another diplomatic failure for Russia:

                                  https://euromaidanpress.com/2023/12/08/armenia-azerbaijan-breakthrough-signals-end-of-russias-south-caucasus-influence/

                                  1 Reply Last reply
                                  • RenaudaR Offline
                                    RenaudaR Offline
                                    Renauda
                                    wrote on last edited by
                                    #1989

                                    We’ll see how long it takes for the Kremlin to withdraw its “peacekeepers” from the area.

                                    Elbows up!

                                    1 Reply Last reply
                                    • jon-nycJ Offline
                                      jon-nycJ Offline
                                      jon-nyc
                                      wrote on last edited by
                                      #1990

                                      Only non-witches get due process.

                                      • Cotton Mather, Salem Massachusetts, 1692
                                      1 Reply Last reply
                                      • George KG Offline
                                        George KG Offline
                                        George K
                                        wrote on last edited by
                                        #1991

                                        Will this make snipers an obsolete specialty?

                                        "Now look here, you Baltic gas passer... " - Mik, 6/14/08

                                        The saying, "Lite is just one damn thing after another," is a gross understatement. The damn things overlap.

                                        1 Reply Last reply
                                        • MikM Away
                                          MikM Away
                                          Mik
                                          wrote on last edited by
                                          #1992

                                          Death from above. That was some unit's motto.

                                          “I am fond of pigs. Dogs look up to us. Cats look down on us. Pigs treat us as equals.” ~Winston S. Churchill

                                          George KG 1 Reply Last reply
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