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The New Coffee Room

  1. TNCR
  2. General Discussion
  3. The Ukraine war thread

The Ukraine war thread

Scheduled Pinned Locked Moved General Discussion
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  • MikM Mik

    Good article, if not cheery. I think the major point is decisive victory is unlikely for either nation, but Russia's economy is so much smaller than the West's. The question is Ukrainian manpower. Weapons are important but you have to preserve the people to operate them.

    George KG Offline
    George KG Offline
    George K
    wrote on last edited by
    #1972

    @Mik said in The Ukraine war thread:

    The question is Ukrainian manpower

    Indeed. I've seen reports that Russia has sustained >300K casualties. Considering the size of their military, that's not crippling (except, perhaps, in public opinion).

    Ukraine can't bear that kind of loss, and Russia will continue to throw troops into the grinder.

    "Now look here, you Baltic gas passer... " - Mik, 6/14/08

    The saying, "Lite is just one damn thing after another," is a gross understatement. The damn things overlap.

    1 Reply Last reply
    • MikM Mik

      Good article, if not cheery. I think the major point is decisive victory is unlikely for either nation, but Russia's economy is so much smaller than the West's. The question is Ukrainian manpower. Weapons are important but you have to preserve the people to operate them.

      RenaudaR Offline
      RenaudaR Offline
      Renauda
      wrote on last edited by
      #1973

      @Mik

      This morning in a Zoom scrum between friends and former colleagues, we parsed through Freedman’s report. One of our number with considerably more experience in these matters than I, expressed his concern that he senses a growing risk of fraying in team Kyiv as to what and how to adjust strategy while at the same time maintaining the necessary messaging to manage expectations on multiple fronts and levels.

      I suspect his concern is well founded.

      Elbows up!

      1 Reply Last reply
      • MikM Offline
        MikM Offline
        Mik
        wrote on last edited by
        #1974

        It's a lot to maintain that fighting spirit as the Russian onslaught, incompetent though it may be, continues to wear them down.

        “I am fond of pigs. Dogs look up to us. Cats look down on us. Pigs treat us as equals.” ~Winston S. Churchill

        1 Reply Last reply
        • MikM Offline
          MikM Offline
          Mik
          wrote on last edited by
          #1975

          Speaking of Russian competence...

          https://www.msn.com/en-us/news/world/russian-troops-are-being-blown-up-by-their-own-minefields-because-their-leaders-won-t-say-where-they-are-ukraine-says/ar-AA1kMvEt?ocid=msedgntp&cvid=d3301936c16f4c89be763761bf1b15fa&ei=115

          “I am fond of pigs. Dogs look up to us. Cats look down on us. Pigs treat us as equals.” ~Winston S. Churchill

          1 Reply Last reply
          • George KG Offline
            George KG Offline
            George K
            wrote on last edited by
            #1976

            "Now look here, you Baltic gas passer... " - Mik, 6/14/08

            The saying, "Lite is just one damn thing after another," is a gross understatement. The damn things overlap.

            1 Reply Last reply
            • RenaudaR Offline
              RenaudaR Offline
              Renauda
              wrote on last edited by
              #1977

              Yesterday T. E. Lawrence just smiled, today it’s sardonic laughter:

              https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-europe-67593041

              Elbows up!

              1 Reply Last reply
              • MikM Offline
                MikM Offline
                Mik
                wrote on last edited by
                #1978

                Smart. Ukraine cannot kill enough Russians to stop the war, but an ill-equipped army can't accomplish much of anything except get itself killed.

                “I am fond of pigs. Dogs look up to us. Cats look down on us. Pigs treat us as equals.” ~Winston S. Churchill

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                • RenaudaR Offline
                  RenaudaR Offline
                  Renauda
                  wrote on last edited by Renauda
                  #1979

                  More meat for the grinder….

                  https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-europe-67592803

                  And somehow NATO is to blame.

                  Elbows up!

                  1 Reply Last reply
                  • George KG Offline
                    George KG Offline
                    George K
                    wrote on last edited by
                    #1980

                    https://www.statista.com/statistics/1334454/russian-armed-forces-personnel/

                    Screenshot 2023-12-01 at 5.13.37 PM.png

                    Even if the Ukrainian claim of 300K casualties is inflated by a factor of two, it's still a big hit.

                    "Now look here, you Baltic gas passer... " - Mik, 6/14/08

                    The saying, "Lite is just one damn thing after another," is a gross understatement. The damn things overlap.

                    1 Reply Last reply
                    • W Offline
                      W Offline
                      Wim
                      wrote on last edited by
                      #1981

                      A diplomatic failure for Russia:

                      https://euromaidanpress.com/2023/12/02/ukraine-outmaneuvers-russia-at-osce-in-chemical-weapons-maritime-agencies/

                      RenaudaR 1 Reply Last reply
                      • MikM Offline
                        MikM Offline
                        Mik
                        wrote on last edited by
                        #1982

                        It would appear Russia does not fear isolation.

                        “I am fond of pigs. Dogs look up to us. Cats look down on us. Pigs treat us as equals.” ~Winston S. Churchill

                        1 Reply Last reply
                        • W Wim

                          A diplomatic failure for Russia:

                          https://euromaidanpress.com/2023/12/02/ukraine-outmaneuvers-russia-at-osce-in-chemical-weapons-maritime-agencies/

                          RenaudaR Offline
                          RenaudaR Offline
                          Renauda
                          wrote on last edited by
                          #1983

                          @Wim
                          The losses are significant from the Kremlin’s point of view in that it surely feels it has a right to entitlement to have a voting representative on both agencies’ governing bodies.

                          Big diplomatic win for Ukraine, EU and NATO.

                          Elbows up!

                          W 1 Reply Last reply
                          • RenaudaR Renauda

                            @Wim
                            The losses are significant from the Kremlin’s point of view in that it surely feels it has a right to entitlement to have a voting representative on both agencies’ governing bodies.

                            Big diplomatic win for Ukraine, EU and NATO.

                            W Offline
                            W Offline
                            Wim
                            wrote on last edited by
                            #1984

                            @Renauda I suppose Lavrov felt pretty uneasy. Who else is to be blamed for this debacle?

                            1 Reply Last reply
                            • MikM Offline
                              MikM Offline
                              Mik
                              wrote on last edited by
                              #1985

                              Here's what might help Putin out of office. Not sure where he's getting the cash for this expansion.

                              https://www.msn.com/en-us/news/world/putin-orders-russian-armed-forces-personnel-increase-of-170-000/ar-AA1kTUtQ?ocid=msedgntp&cvid=138bcec0f1bd4d798538c5f270b2d1c3&ei=17

                              “I am fond of pigs. Dogs look up to us. Cats look down on us. Pigs treat us as equals.” ~Winston S. Churchill

                              1 Reply Last reply
                              • JollyJ Offline
                                JollyJ Offline
                                Jolly
                                wrote on last edited by
                                #1986

                                The average age of a Ukraine soldier is in the forties. Putin is playing a war of attrition, using bodies instead of equipment.

                                Biden straddled the fence too long. Not the right equipment, not enough equipment, too many restrictions on use.

                                Almost as if he was fighting a proxy war, trying to simply bleed the Russians.

                                “Cry havoc and let slip the DOGE of war!”

                                Those who cheered as J-6 American prisoners were locked in solitary for 18 months without trial, now suddenly fight tooth and nail for foreign terrorists’ "due process". — Buck Sexton

                                1 Reply Last reply
                                • W Offline
                                  W Offline
                                  Wim
                                  wrote on last edited by
                                  #1987

                                  Speaking of attrition:
                                  https://euromaidanpress.com/2023/12/03/frontline-report-russian-soldiers-refuse-to-attack-dnipro-islands-as-ukrainians-maintain-bridgehead-across-the-river/

                                  1 Reply Last reply
                                  • W Offline
                                    W Offline
                                    Wim
                                    wrote on last edited by
                                    #1988

                                    Another diplomatic failure for Russia:

                                    https://euromaidanpress.com/2023/12/08/armenia-azerbaijan-breakthrough-signals-end-of-russias-south-caucasus-influence/

                                    1 Reply Last reply
                                    • RenaudaR Offline
                                      RenaudaR Offline
                                      Renauda
                                      wrote on last edited by
                                      #1989

                                      We’ll see how long it takes for the Kremlin to withdraw its “peacekeepers” from the area.

                                      Elbows up!

                                      1 Reply Last reply
                                      • jon-nycJ Offline
                                        jon-nycJ Offline
                                        jon-nyc
                                        wrote on last edited by
                                        #1990

                                        Only non-witches get due process.

                                        • Cotton Mather, Salem Massachusetts, 1692
                                        1 Reply Last reply
                                        • George KG Offline
                                          George KG Offline
                                          George K
                                          wrote on last edited by
                                          #1991

                                          Will this make snipers an obsolete specialty?

                                          "Now look here, you Baltic gas passer... " - Mik, 6/14/08

                                          The saying, "Lite is just one damn thing after another," is a gross understatement. The damn things overlap.

                                          1 Reply Last reply
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