Beyond the antivaxx stuff MAHA is either banal or fake
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@jon-nyc said in Beyond the antivaxx stuff MAHA is either banal or fake:
It's a silly question. It depends on the concrete vaccine, and it is not about whether it's more dangerous than the disease, it's about the likelihood of getting infected compared to the likelihood of undesirable side effects.
For instance, for most people in the US, a yellow fever vaccination would not make sense because there is a significant side effect risk and the likelihood of getting infected is very low.
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@Horace said in Beyond the antivaxx stuff MAHA is either banal or fake:
Anyway, the official story is that Moderna made changes to their application, and the FDA accepted the revised version. Everything else is narrative. But the implication that the FDA simply reversed is not accurate. Moderna did make changes to the app. According to my exhaustive google search.
As I said they likely promised a post marketing study. FDA last week said they would not review the submission because they (really he) didn’t accept the previously agreed upon study design. Now FDA says they will review the submission based on the previously agreed upon study design.
If that’s a non-back track, I would welcome more non-back tracks on vaccine policy in the future.
@jon-nyc said in Beyond the antivaxx stuff MAHA is either banal or fake:
@Horace said in Beyond the antivaxx stuff MAHA is either banal or fake:
Anyway, the official story is that Moderna made changes to their application, and the FDA accepted the revised version. Everything else is narrative. But the implication that the FDA simply reversed is not accurate. Moderna did make changes to the app. According to my exhaustive google search.
As I said they likely promised a post marketing study.
No "likely" about it. That's what happened, as I assume you've read.
FDA last week said they would not review the submission because they (really he) didn’t accept the previously agreed upon study design. Now FDA says they will review the submission based on the previously agreed upon study design.
If that’s a non-back track, I would welcome more non-back tracks on vaccine policy in the future.
It's a compromise, likely due at least partially to political pressures of one sort or another, of which we have no direct evidence. But it's a compromise. The FDA's encouragement to have a sit down intentionally left the door open to a compromise.
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@klaus Right but those are pretty accurately accessed by public heath professionals which is why you don’t see yellow fever vaccines in the recommended panel.
I would caution you against assuming there’s even an ounce of rationality behind the anti-vax movement. It’s one part naturalistic fallacy, two parts resentment, and three parts conspiratorial thinking.
Person. Woman. Man. Camera. TV.
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@klaus Right but those are pretty accurately accessed by public heath professionals which is why you don’t see yellow fever vaccines in the recommended panel.
I would caution you against assuming there’s even an ounce of rationality behind the anti-vax movement. It’s one part naturalistic fallacy, two parts resentment, and three parts conspiratorial thinking.
@jon-nyc said in Beyond the antivaxx stuff MAHA is either banal or fake:
@klaus Right but those are really accurately accessed by public heath professionals which is why you don’t see yellow fever vaccines in the recommended panel.
I would caution you against assuming there’s even an ounce of rationality behind the anti-vax movement. It’s one part naturalistic fallacy, two parts resentment, and three parts conspiratorial thinking.
There are plenty of coherent arguments that the COVID vaccine was on the wrong side of risk/reward for a large section of the populace who were economically forced to take it.
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@klaus Right but those are pretty accurately accessed by public heath professionals which is why you don’t see yellow fever vaccines in the recommended panel.
I would caution you against assuming there’s even an ounce of rationality behind the anti-vax movement. It’s one part naturalistic fallacy, two parts resentment, and three parts conspiratorial thinking.
said in Beyond the antivaxx stuff MAHA is either banal or fake:
@klaus Right but those are pretty accurately accessed by public heath professionals which is why you don’t see yellow fever vaccines in the recommended panel.
The one exception to this, sort of, is late adolescent males and the Covid vaccine. I say ‘sort of’ because it took a while for the data to come in so some delay is to be expected, also how the benefit-risk shakes out is highly dependent on things like severity of the current wave, brand of vaccine, dosing interval, etc. Still, when there was a reasonable amount of data available to show it was borderline or worse there were still public health officials who were afraid to address it lest they fuel vaccine hesitancy more broadly. A friend of mine was a lonely but ultimately effective voice in preventing a major university from requiring Covid vaccines in incoming freshman for this very reason.
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Anybody who would say that, say, the polio vaccine is worse than the disease is just insane. Like, that person should go into a mental institution immediately.
For Covid vaccines, there are some grey areas, as you say.
@Klaus said in Beyond the antivaxx stuff MAHA is either banal or fake:
Anybody who would say that, say, the polio vaccine is worse than the disease is just insane. Like, that person should go into a mental institution immediately.
That's like 99% of Trump voters, man.
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Now it looks like Prasad was just sidelined on the decision (no doubt due to pressure described above), so the leaders of CBER that he had overruled just withdrew his letter in a meeting with Moderna and issued a new letter agreeing to review the original submission. So basically ex post ante. I suspect the White House itself was involved.
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As U.S. hospitals face an increasing risk of encountering measles, and pressure to immediately spot it, health care workers face an unusual barrier: Many don't know what it looks like.
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As U.S. hospitals face an increasing risk of encountering measles, and pressure to immediately spot it, health care workers face an unusual barrier: Many don't know what it looks like.
@taiwan_girl said in Beyond the antivaxx stuff MAHA is either banal or fake:
As U.S. hospitals face an increasing risk of encountering measles, and pressure to immediately spot it, health care workers face an unusual barrier: Many don't know what it looks like.
Kinda surprised, it feels like every other physician I see is from some country where measles is still more prevalent than here, even with the outbreaks.
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Dr. Vinay Prasad, who has led the FDA’s vaccines and biotech drugs division, will depart at the end of April, FDA Commissioner Marty Makary said Friday. Federal health officials are searching for his replacement, Makary said.
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"How did we get here?" she asks. "How did we get to a place where we don't trust our doctors to do the very best thing for our children? How did we get to a place where vaccinations have become political?"
The answer is a mix of widespread misinformation, lingering resentment over COVID mandates, and politicians at the local and national level who are sowing mistrust of vaccines.
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