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The New Coffee Room

  1. TNCR
  2. General Discussion
  3. It gets personal

It gets personal

Scheduled Pinned Locked Moved General Discussion
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  • H Offline
    H Offline
    Horace
    wrote on 15 Mar 2025, 19:56 last edited by
    #35

    I agree that cutting studies off in the middle is stupid and lazy.

    Education is extremely important.

    1 Reply Last reply
    • X Offline
      X Offline
      xenon
      wrote on 15 Mar 2025, 19:58 last edited by
      #36

      If there were painful cuts across the board and belt tightening, that’d be one thing.

      These seem like theatrical cuts, since the new budget will add a record amount to the deficit.

      C 1 Reply Last reply 15 Mar 2025, 21:10
      • J Offline
        J Offline
        Jolly
        wrote on 15 Mar 2025, 20:07 last edited by
        #37

        I'm still waiting for an actual budget.

        “Cry havoc and let slip the DOGE of war!”

        Those who cheered as J-6 American prisoners were locked in solitary for 18 months without trial, now suddenly fight tooth and nail for foreign terrorists’ "due process". — Buck Sexton

        1 Reply Last reply
        • X xenon
          15 Mar 2025, 19:58

          If there were painful cuts across the board and belt tightening, that’d be one thing.

          These seem like theatrical cuts, since the new budget will add a record amount to the deficit.

          C Offline
          C Offline
          Copper
          wrote on 15 Mar 2025, 21:10 last edited by Copper
          #38

          @xenon said in It gets personal:

          the new budget will add a record amount to the deficit

          Does the new budget exist?

          1 Reply Last reply
          • J Online
            J Online
            jon-nyc
            wrote on 15 Mar 2025, 22:41 last edited by
            #39

            A budget resolution was passed, which outlines the increases or cuts expected from each committee of jurisdiction. So while we don't know precisely what the cuts are, we know generally.

            Thank you for your attention to this matter.

            1 Reply Last reply
            • J Online
              J Online
              jon-nyc
              wrote on 16 Mar 2025, 20:16 last edited by
              #40

              These are ‘preconditions’ set by the administration that are supposed to be met before they will sit down with Columbia.

              https://static01.nyt.com/newsgraphics/documenttools/6d3c124d8e20212d/85dec154-full.pdf

              One wonders what the negotiations would then be about.

              Thank you for your attention to this matter.

              M J 2 Replies Last reply 16 Mar 2025, 20:39
              • J Online
                J Online
                jon-nyc
                wrote on 16 Mar 2025, 20:20 last edited by
                #41

                FIRE’s take.

                Thank you for your attention to this matter.

                1 Reply Last reply
                • J jon-nyc
                  16 Mar 2025, 20:16

                  These are ‘preconditions’ set by the administration that are supposed to be met before they will sit down with Columbia.

                  https://static01.nyt.com/newsgraphics/documenttools/6d3c124d8e20212d/85dec154-full.pdf

                  One wonders what the negotiations would then be about.

                  M Offline
                  M Offline
                  Mik
                  wrote on 16 Mar 2025, 20:39 last edited by
                  #42

                  @jon-nyc said in It gets personal:

                  These are ‘preconditions’ set by the administration that are supposed to be met before they will sit down with Columbia.

                  https://static01.nyt.com/newsgraphics/documenttools/6d3c124d8e20212d/85dec154-full.pdf

                  One wonders what the negotiations would then be about.

                  alt text

                  "The intelligent man who is proud of his intelligence is like the condemned man who is proud of his large cell." Simone Weil

                  1 Reply Last reply
                  • B Offline
                    B Offline
                    blondie
                    wrote on 16 Mar 2025, 22:43 last edited by
                    #43

                    @kluurs Both of us here are thinking of the 2 of you there, hoping your wife’s research can continue. I can’t imagine having my life long passion, my area of expertise, being axed, after decades of contributing such good for medical research.

                    1 Reply Last reply
                    • J jon-nyc
                      16 Mar 2025, 20:16

                      These are ‘preconditions’ set by the administration that are supposed to be met before they will sit down with Columbia.

                      https://static01.nyt.com/newsgraphics/documenttools/6d3c124d8e20212d/85dec154-full.pdf

                      One wonders what the negotiations would then be about.

                      J Offline
                      J Offline
                      Jolly
                      wrote on 16 Mar 2025, 22:55 last edited by
                      #44

                      @jon-nyc said in It gets personal:

                      These are ‘preconditions’ set by the administration that are supposed to be met before they will sit down with Columbia.

                      https://static01.nyt.com/newsgraphics/documenttools/6d3c124d8e20212d/85dec154-full.pdf

                      One wonders what the negotiations would then be about.

                      I don't have too many problems with the preconditions. I'm not sure about the receivership, as that goes too far.

                      “Cry havoc and let slip the DOGE of war!”

                      Those who cheered as J-6 American prisoners were locked in solitary for 18 months without trial, now suddenly fight tooth and nail for foreign terrorists’ "due process". — Buck Sexton

                      1 Reply Last reply
                      • R Offline
                        R Offline
                        Renauda
                        wrote on 16 Mar 2025, 23:44 last edited by
                        #45

                        I'm not sure about the receivership, as that goes too far.

                        I can’t imagine why you might think that. It is, after all, just one those useless touchy-feely interdisciplinary social science programmes. Or would you like it to be a Bible Studies programme under the guise of interdisciplinary studies programme? Just asking.

                        Elbows up!

                        1 Reply Last reply
                        • J Offline
                          J Offline
                          Jolly
                          wrote on 16 Mar 2025, 23:59 last edited by Jolly
                          #46

                          BTW, using Federal funds as a bludgeoning tool of compliance is nothing new.

                          In 1979, I was attending a private college. The Feds dropped in and told the College Administration you don't have enough black students. The college replied that 13% of the student body is black and here is documentation of our efforts to recruit more... We are offering substantial scholarships, particularly to those more economically unfortunate, but they must meet entrance criteria (which wasn't onerous, just a 23 ACT and graduation in the top 25% of your class).

                          And besides, we don't take any Federal funds. 😛

                          Well, said the Feds, the college may not, but your students have Pell Grants and student loans, which we will be happy to terminate.
                          Unless you can bring those black student percentages up to at least 20%

                          So the college had to find another 100 black students, qualified or not.

                          “Cry havoc and let slip the DOGE of war!”

                          Those who cheered as J-6 American prisoners were locked in solitary for 18 months without trial, now suddenly fight tooth and nail for foreign terrorists’ "due process". — Buck Sexton

                          1 Reply Last reply
                          • M Mik
                            15 Mar 2025, 19:52

                            There’s no way to cut painlessly, I agree. I also believe there are taxpayer supported studies that are not worth the expense. But many if not most are. To cut them off in mid study while still proposing deficit spending seems less than due diligence.

                            8 Offline
                            8 Offline
                            89th
                            wrote on 17 Mar 2025, 14:08 last edited by
                            #47

                            @Mik said in It gets personal:

                            There’s no way to cut painlessly, I agree. I also believe there are taxpayer supported studies that are not worth the expense. But many if not most are. To cut them off in mid study while still proposing deficit spending seems less than due diligence.

                            Yeah agreed. Lazy is a good term for it, chasing headlines is another. As you said, whether it's research grants, or federal employees, or other programs, there is good work out there, perhaps most of the time, and our country is better than the "meh, there will be blood" wrecking ball approach when a smart scalpel could be used to avoid hurting the good work that's out there.

                            1 Reply Last reply
                            • J Offline
                              J Offline
                              Jolly
                              wrote on 17 Mar 2025, 16:18 last edited by
                              #48

                              Smart scalpel is preferred, but the political will won't be there when you need it.

                              It's going to be the roast chicken method, if it's done

                              “Cry havoc and let slip the DOGE of war!”

                              Those who cheered as J-6 American prisoners were locked in solitary for 18 months without trial, now suddenly fight tooth and nail for foreign terrorists’ "due process". — Buck Sexton

                              8 1 Reply Last reply 17 Mar 2025, 16:25
                              • J Jolly
                                17 Mar 2025, 16:18

                                Smart scalpel is preferred, but the political will won't be there when you need it.

                                It's going to be the roast chicken method, if it's done

                                8 Offline
                                8 Offline
                                89th
                                wrote on 17 Mar 2025, 16:25 last edited by
                                #49

                                @Jolly said in It gets personal:

                                Smart scalpel is preferred, but the political will won't be there when you need it.

                                How so? Don't you think an approach where Trump said something like "I'm going to deploy 10 genius analysts into each <whatever> branch and ask them to provide a full report in 6 months of what should be cut immediately and what should be sent back to congress to review appropriations". It doesn't have to take 4 years, but it also doesn't have to take 4 weeks. The latter is reckless and lazy.

                                1 Reply Last reply
                                • J Offline
                                  J Offline
                                  Jolly
                                  wrote on 17 Mar 2025, 19:31 last edited by Jolly
                                  #50

                                  A very smart man once said, If t'were done, it is well it t'were done quickly.

                                  In politics, when you've got Big MO, you gitter done. The longer something rattles around in the box, the more opposition you'll tend to have.

                                  In the case of cuts, corporate or government, you cut fast and hard. Sometimes, you have to adjust the cuts later, but that's usually easier than the paralysis of analysis.

                                  “Cry havoc and let slip the DOGE of war!”

                                  Those who cheered as J-6 American prisoners were locked in solitary for 18 months without trial, now suddenly fight tooth and nail for foreign terrorists’ "due process". — Buck Sexton

                                  M L 2 Replies Last reply 17 Mar 2025, 21:26
                                  • K Offline
                                    K Offline
                                    kluurs
                                    wrote on 17 Mar 2025, 21:14 last edited by
                                    #51

                                    Reminds me of a contest at college where they wanted to rename the "Great Hall" into something more interesting. Someone submitted "Nixon's Tomb" - which I thought was wonderful. I was actually on the committee that would decide the name - and spoke forcefully in favor of the name change - but by the time I got done speaking, even I was convinced it wasn't such a great idea since Nixon seemed to take things personal and while it would have made the national news - not the news that would result in good tidings.

                                    1 Reply Last reply
                                    • J Jolly
                                      17 Mar 2025, 19:31

                                      A very smart man once said, If t'were done, it is well it t'were done quickly.

                                      In politics, when you've got Big MO, you gitter done. The longer something rattles around in the box, the more opposition you'll tend to have.

                                      In the case of cuts, corporate or government, you cut fast and hard. Sometimes, you have to adjust the cuts later, but that's usually easier than the paralysis of analysis.

                                      M Offline
                                      M Offline
                                      Mik
                                      wrote on 17 Mar 2025, 21:26 last edited by
                                      #52

                                      @Jolly said in It gets personal:

                                      A very smart man once said, If t'were done, it is well it t'were done quickly.

                                      In politics, when you've got Big MO, you gitter done. The longer something rattles around in the box, the more opposition you'll tend to have.

                                      In the case of cuts, corporate or government, you cut fast and hard. Sometimes, you have to adjust the cuts later, but that's usually easier than the paralysis of analysis.

                                      Ah, but Macbeth was speaking of murder, not cost cutting. 😄

                                      "The intelligent man who is proud of his intelligence is like the condemned man who is proud of his large cell." Simone Weil

                                      J 1 Reply Last reply 17 Mar 2025, 23:55
                                      • J Jolly
                                        17 Mar 2025, 19:31

                                        A very smart man once said, If t'were done, it is well it t'were done quickly.

                                        In politics, when you've got Big MO, you gitter done. The longer something rattles around in the box, the more opposition you'll tend to have.

                                        In the case of cuts, corporate or government, you cut fast and hard. Sometimes, you have to adjust the cuts later, but that's usually easier than the paralysis of analysis.

                                        L Offline
                                        L Offline
                                        LuFins Dad
                                        wrote on 17 Mar 2025, 21:42 last edited by
                                        #53

                                        @Jolly said in It gets personal:

                                        A very smart man once said, If t'were done, it is well it t'were done quickly.

                                        In politics, when you've got Big MO, you gitter done. The longer something rattles around in the box, the more opposition you'll tend to have.

                                        In the case of cuts, corporate or government, you cut fast and hard. Sometimes, you have to adjust the cuts later, but that's usually easier than the paralysis of analysis.

                                        Great. What have they actually cut?

                                        The Brad

                                        1 Reply Last reply
                                        • C Offline
                                          C Offline
                                          Copper
                                          wrote on 17 Mar 2025, 23:34 last edited by
                                          #54

                                          All told, more than 30,000 federal employees were fired in recent weeks after the Trump administration directed a mass purge of probationary staff.

                                          https://www.govexec.com/workforce/2025/03/trump-administration-taking-steps-comply-court-orders-reinstate-tens-thousands-fired-workers/403795/

                                          8 1 Reply Last reply 18 Mar 2025, 13:37
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