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The New Coffee Room

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  3. Gifts for Putin, Demands for Zelensky

Gifts for Putin, Demands for Zelensky

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  • HoraceH Horace

    @Doctor-Phibes And you were expecting the Biden/Harris strategy to lead to...?

    Doctor PhibesD Offline
    Doctor PhibesD Offline
    Doctor Phibes
    wrote on last edited by Doctor Phibes
    #24

    @Horace said in Gifts for Putin, Demands for Zelensky:

    @Doctor-Phibes And you were expecting the Biden/Harris strategy to lead to...?

    I wasn't expecting it to lead to anything, however it seems to me that one person is responsible for this war. Not Biden, not Zelenski, not Harris.

    Maybe he's the one who should be held accountable rather than attempting to shift blame like this, and certainly not by appeasement of actual dictators.

    I was only joking

    HoraceH 1 Reply Last reply
    • Doctor PhibesD Offline
      Doctor PhibesD Offline
      Doctor Phibes
      wrote on last edited by Doctor Phibes
      #25

      And as for criticising Zelensky for not holding elections. Presumably, Trump is looking to overlook the savagery and barbarity with which his friend Putin assures his own election victories?

      WTF is wrong with the guy?

      Or am I completely wrong about this? Maybe it's time for that great American conservative Tucker Carlson to go on another fact finding mission and marvel at the price of Russian eggs?

      I was only joking

      RenaudaR JollyJ 2 Replies Last reply
      • Doctor PhibesD Doctor Phibes

        And as for criticising Zelensky for not holding elections. Presumably, Trump is looking to overlook the savagery and barbarity with which his friend Putin assures his own election victories?

        WTF is wrong with the guy?

        Or am I completely wrong about this? Maybe it's time for that great American conservative Tucker Carlson to go on another fact finding mission and marvel at the price of Russian eggs?

        RenaudaR Offline
        RenaudaR Offline
        Renauda
        wrote on last edited by
        #26

        @Doctor-Phibes

        Some people, at least one or two in this forum in fact, cannot conceive that the axiom “it takes two to start a fight” does not always apply or ring true. This war is one such time.

        Putin started this war entirely on his own. It was solely born of his own paranoia and imperial ambitions. He will not stop until those are satisfied or he is in his grave. The Russians have a saying “the hunchback is only cured by the grave”. That applies to Putin.

        Elbows up!

        1 Reply Last reply
        👍
        • Doctor PhibesD Doctor Phibes

          @Horace said in Gifts for Putin, Demands for Zelensky:

          @Doctor-Phibes And you were expecting the Biden/Harris strategy to lead to...?

          I wasn't expecting it to lead to anything, however it seems to me that one person is responsible for this war. Not Biden, not Zelenski, not Harris.

          Maybe he's the one who should be held accountable rather than attempting to shift blame like this, and certainly not by appeasement of actual dictators.

          HoraceH Offline
          HoraceH Offline
          Horace
          wrote on last edited by
          #27

          @Doctor-Phibes said in Gifts for Putin, Demands for Zelensky:

          And as for criticising Zelensky for not holding elections. Presumably, Trump is looking to overlook the savagery and barbarity with which his friend Putin assures his own election victories?

          WTF is wrong with the guy?

          Or am I completely wrong about this? Maybe it's time for that great American conservative Tucker Carlson to go on another fact finding mission and marvel at the price of Russian eggs?

          Since you don't actually have any reasonable hope for any specific conclusion, you're talking about nothing other than your feels about the rhetoric being employed by the players. Meanwhile, there's a forever war going, at least until an inevitable Russian victory. I hear nobody engaging with that point, not even the illustrious Bolton, who admitted the Russians are the inevitable victor in a war of attrition, while also sneering at Trump for potentially "surrendering".

          Education is extremely important.

          1 Reply Last reply
          • Doctor PhibesD Doctor Phibes

            And as for criticising Zelensky for not holding elections. Presumably, Trump is looking to overlook the savagery and barbarity with which his friend Putin assures his own election victories?

            WTF is wrong with the guy?

            Or am I completely wrong about this? Maybe it's time for that great American conservative Tucker Carlson to go on another fact finding mission and marvel at the price of Russian eggs?

            JollyJ Offline
            JollyJ Offline
            Jolly
            wrote on last edited by
            #28

            @Doctor-Phibes said in Gifts for Putin, Demands for Zelensky:

            And as for criticising Zelensky for not holding elections. Presumably, Trump is looking to overlook the savagery and barbarity with which his friend Putin assures his own election victories?

            WTF is wrong with the guy?

            Or am I completely wrong about this? Maybe it's time for that great American conservative Tucker Carlson to go on another fact finding mission and marvel at the price of Russian eggs?

            He's decided to end this war. Zelensky is currently polling below 10% He using that as a hammer to make Ukraine sign off on a peace proposal.

            Is that right? Maybe not. Is it effective in ending this war? Perhaps.

            “Cry havoc and let slip the DOGE of war!”

            Those who cheered as J-6 American prisoners were locked in solitary for 18 months without trial, now suddenly fight tooth and nail for foreign terrorists’ "due process". — Buck Sexton

            Doctor PhibesD RenaudaR LuFins DadL 3 Replies Last reply
            • Doctor PhibesD Offline
              Doctor PhibesD Offline
              Doctor Phibes
              wrote on last edited by
              #29

              And what do you pair of brain surgeons suggest if Putin doesn't stop at Ukraine?

              I was only joking

              HoraceH 1 Reply Last reply
              • Doctor PhibesD Doctor Phibes

                And what do you pair of brain surgeons suggest if Putin doesn't stop at Ukraine?

                HoraceH Offline
                HoraceH Offline
                Horace
                wrote on last edited by
                #30

                @Doctor-Phibes I think it's cute that you can think deeply enough to interrogate the opinions of others, while you offer literally nothing in the way of an alternative plan that has any hope of ending anywhere but a Russian victory.

                But hey, maybe I'm wrong. Please prove me wrong, please offer an alternative. Or just continue to be baffled at how anybody could possibly not use the right words, that's really the important thing here.

                Education is extremely important.

                Doctor PhibesD 1 Reply Last reply
                • JollyJ Jolly

                  @Doctor-Phibes said in Gifts for Putin, Demands for Zelensky:

                  And as for criticising Zelensky for not holding elections. Presumably, Trump is looking to overlook the savagery and barbarity with which his friend Putin assures his own election victories?

                  WTF is wrong with the guy?

                  Or am I completely wrong about this? Maybe it's time for that great American conservative Tucker Carlson to go on another fact finding mission and marvel at the price of Russian eggs?

                  He's decided to end this war. Zelensky is currently polling below 10% He using that as a hammer to make Ukraine sign off on a peace proposal.

                  Is that right? Maybe not. Is it effective in ending this war? Perhaps.

                  Doctor PhibesD Offline
                  Doctor PhibesD Offline
                  Doctor Phibes
                  wrote on last edited by
                  #31

                  @Jolly said in Gifts for Putin, Demands for Zelensky:

                  He's decided to end this war. Zelensky is currently polling below 10%

                  Oh for fuck's sake Jolly. You're parroting Russian propoganda.

                  https://www.bbc.com/news/articles/c9814k2jlxko

                  Official polling is limited and it is extremely difficult to carry out accurate surveys during a time of war. Millions of Ukrainians have fled and Russia has occupied around a fifth of the country.

                  However, some polling has been possible to carry out by telephone. A survey conducted this month found that 57% of Ukrainians said they trusted the president, according to the Ukraine-based Kyiv International Institute of Sociology.

                  I was only joking

                  1 Reply Last reply
                  • HoraceH Horace

                    @Doctor-Phibes I think it's cute that you can think deeply enough to interrogate the opinions of others, while you offer literally nothing in the way of an alternative plan that has any hope of ending anywhere but a Russian victory.

                    But hey, maybe I'm wrong. Please prove me wrong, please offer an alternative. Or just continue to be baffled at how anybody could possibly not use the right words, that's really the important thing here.

                    Doctor PhibesD Offline
                    Doctor PhibesD Offline
                    Doctor Phibes
                    wrote on last edited by Doctor Phibes
                    #32

                    @Horace said in Gifts for Putin, Demands for Zelensky:

                    @Doctor-Phibes I think it's cute that you can think deeply enough to interrogate the opinions of others, while you offer literally nothing in the way of an alternative plan that has any hope of ending anywhere but a Russian victory.

                    But hey, maybe I'm wrong. Please prove me wrong, please offer an alternative. Or just continue to be baffled at how anybody could possibly not use the right words, that's really the important thing here.

                    So, Trump blames Ukraine for starting this war, and somehow I'm the one in the wrong for pointing out that this is a lie?

                    And no, I don't have a solution. And neither do you, so try reining in the intellectual superiority bullshit for once.

                    I was only joking

                    HoraceH 1 Reply Last reply
                    • JollyJ Jolly

                      @Doctor-Phibes said in Gifts for Putin, Demands for Zelensky:

                      And as for criticising Zelensky for not holding elections. Presumably, Trump is looking to overlook the savagery and barbarity with which his friend Putin assures his own election victories?

                      WTF is wrong with the guy?

                      Or am I completely wrong about this? Maybe it's time for that great American conservative Tucker Carlson to go on another fact finding mission and marvel at the price of Russian eggs?

                      He's decided to end this war. Zelensky is currently polling below 10% He using that as a hammer to make Ukraine sign off on a peace proposal.

                      Is that right? Maybe not. Is it effective in ending this war? Perhaps.

                      RenaudaR Offline
                      RenaudaR Offline
                      Renauda
                      wrote on last edited by Renauda
                      #33

                      @Jolly

                      Zelensky is currently polling below 10%

                      Did you pull that off a Rumble site or directly from the Russian Foreign Ministry site?

                      In any case you are quite mislead on this as Phibes already pointed out.

                      Elbows up!

                      1 Reply Last reply
                      • Doctor PhibesD Doctor Phibes

                        @Horace said in Gifts for Putin, Demands for Zelensky:

                        @Doctor-Phibes I think it's cute that you can think deeply enough to interrogate the opinions of others, while you offer literally nothing in the way of an alternative plan that has any hope of ending anywhere but a Russian victory.

                        But hey, maybe I'm wrong. Please prove me wrong, please offer an alternative. Or just continue to be baffled at how anybody could possibly not use the right words, that's really the important thing here.

                        So, Trump blames Ukraine for starting this war, and somehow I'm the one in the wrong for pointing out that this is a lie?

                        And no, I don't have a solution. And neither do you, so try reining in the intellectual superiority bullshit for once.

                        HoraceH Offline
                        HoraceH Offline
                        Horace
                        wrote on last edited by
                        #34

                        @Doctor-Phibes said in Gifts for Putin, Demands for Zelensky:

                        @Horace said in Gifts for Putin, Demands for Zelensky:

                        @Doctor-Phibes I think it's cute that you can think deeply enough to interrogate the opinions of others, while you offer literally nothing in the way of an alternative plan that has any hope of ending anywhere but a Russian victory.

                        But hey, maybe I'm wrong. Please prove me wrong, please offer an alternative. Or just continue to be baffled at how anybody could possibly not use the right words, that's really the important thing here.

                        So, Trump blames Ukraine for starting this war, and somehow I'm the one in the wrong for pointing out that this is a lie?

                        That's a wild misinterpretation of this conversation. Or maybe you can point to anybody in this thread saying Ukraine started the war?

                        And no, I don't have a solution. And neither do you, so try reigning in the intellectual superiority bullshit for once.

                        No, you'll just happily go along with all the dunking as Trump makes noises towards a negotiated end to the war. Just like the illustrious Bolton, sneering at the idea of Trump "surrendering", while admitting in the same conversation that the other possible end is a Russian victory in a war of attrition. I hope for a negotiated peace, before the war of attrition reaches its inevitable conclusion. I realize those negotiations will get dunked on by all the usual suspects, all along the way, and I realize no negotiations were occurring under Biden. I'll take the faint hope over no hope.

                        Education is extremely important.

                        RenaudaR Doctor PhibesD 2 Replies Last reply
                        • HoraceH Horace

                          @Doctor-Phibes said in Gifts for Putin, Demands for Zelensky:

                          @Horace said in Gifts for Putin, Demands for Zelensky:

                          @Doctor-Phibes I think it's cute that you can think deeply enough to interrogate the opinions of others, while you offer literally nothing in the way of an alternative plan that has any hope of ending anywhere but a Russian victory.

                          But hey, maybe I'm wrong. Please prove me wrong, please offer an alternative. Or just continue to be baffled at how anybody could possibly not use the right words, that's really the important thing here.

                          So, Trump blames Ukraine for starting this war, and somehow I'm the one in the wrong for pointing out that this is a lie?

                          That's a wild misinterpretation of this conversation. Or maybe you can point to anybody in this thread saying Ukraine started the war?

                          And no, I don't have a solution. And neither do you, so try reigning in the intellectual superiority bullshit for once.

                          No, you'll just happily go along with all the dunking as Trump makes noises towards a negotiated end to the war. Just like the illustrious Bolton, sneering at the idea of Trump "surrendering", while admitting in the same conversation that the other possible end is a Russian victory in a war of attrition. I hope for a negotiated peace, before the war of attrition reaches its inevitable conclusion. I realize those negotiations will get dunked on by all the usual suspects, all along the way, and I realize no negotiations were occurring under Biden. I'll take the faint hope over no hope.

                          RenaudaR Offline
                          RenaudaR Offline
                          Renauda
                          wrote on last edited by Renauda
                          #35

                          @Horace

                          . I hope for a negotiated peace, before the war of attrition reaches its inevitable conclusion.

                          Convince me. All you are peddling is that Ukraine unconditionally surrender to all the Kremlin’s demands. There won’t even be a sovereign rump left of the Ukrainian state when it’s over. It will be the Kremlin’s puppet.

                          Elbows up!

                          1 Reply Last reply
                          • HoraceH Horace

                            @Doctor-Phibes said in Gifts for Putin, Demands for Zelensky:

                            @Horace said in Gifts for Putin, Demands for Zelensky:

                            @Doctor-Phibes I think it's cute that you can think deeply enough to interrogate the opinions of others, while you offer literally nothing in the way of an alternative plan that has any hope of ending anywhere but a Russian victory.

                            But hey, maybe I'm wrong. Please prove me wrong, please offer an alternative. Or just continue to be baffled at how anybody could possibly not use the right words, that's really the important thing here.

                            So, Trump blames Ukraine for starting this war, and somehow I'm the one in the wrong for pointing out that this is a lie?

                            That's a wild misinterpretation of this conversation. Or maybe you can point to anybody in this thread saying Ukraine started the war?

                            And no, I don't have a solution. And neither do you, so try reigning in the intellectual superiority bullshit for once.

                            No, you'll just happily go along with all the dunking as Trump makes noises towards a negotiated end to the war. Just like the illustrious Bolton, sneering at the idea of Trump "surrendering", while admitting in the same conversation that the other possible end is a Russian victory in a war of attrition. I hope for a negotiated peace, before the war of attrition reaches its inevitable conclusion. I realize those negotiations will get dunked on by all the usual suspects, all along the way, and I realize no negotiations were occurring under Biden. I'll take the faint hope over no hope.

                            Doctor PhibesD Offline
                            Doctor PhibesD Offline
                            Doctor Phibes
                            wrote on last edited by
                            #36

                            @Horace said in Gifts for Putin, Demands for Zelensky:

                            @Doctor-Phibes said in Gifts for Putin, Demands for Zelensky:

                            @Horace said in Gifts for Putin, Demands for Zelensky:

                            @Doctor-Phibes I think it's cute that you can think deeply enough to interrogate the opinions of others, while you offer literally nothing in the way of an alternative plan that has any hope of ending anywhere but a Russian victory.

                            But hey, maybe I'm wrong. Please prove me wrong, please offer an alternative. Or just continue to be baffled at how anybody could possibly not use the right words, that's really the important thing here.

                            So, Trump blames Ukraine for starting this war, and somehow I'm the one in the wrong for pointing out that this is a lie?

                            That's a wild misinterpretation of this conversation. Or maybe you can point to anybody in this thread saying Ukraine started the war?

                            And no, I don't have a solution. And neither do you, so try reigning in the intellectual superiority bullshit for once.

                            No, you'll just happily go along with all the dunking as Trump makes noises towards a negotiated end to the war. Just like the illustrious Bolton, sneering at the idea of Trump "surrendering", while admitting in the same conversation that the other possible end is a Russian victory in a war of attrition. I hope for a negotiated peace, before the war of attrition reaches its inevitable conclusion. I realize those negotiations will get dunked on by all the usual suspects, all along the way, and I realize no negotiations were occurring under Biden. I'll take the faint hope over no hope.

                            An American President bullying the victim in this barbaric situation and quite possibly giving Putin exactly what he wants is not negotiating an end to the war.

                            I was only joking

                            HoraceH 1 Reply Last reply
                            • Doctor PhibesD Doctor Phibes

                              @Horace said in Gifts for Putin, Demands for Zelensky:

                              @Doctor-Phibes said in Gifts for Putin, Demands for Zelensky:

                              @Horace said in Gifts for Putin, Demands for Zelensky:

                              @Doctor-Phibes I think it's cute that you can think deeply enough to interrogate the opinions of others, while you offer literally nothing in the way of an alternative plan that has any hope of ending anywhere but a Russian victory.

                              But hey, maybe I'm wrong. Please prove me wrong, please offer an alternative. Or just continue to be baffled at how anybody could possibly not use the right words, that's really the important thing here.

                              So, Trump blames Ukraine for starting this war, and somehow I'm the one in the wrong for pointing out that this is a lie?

                              That's a wild misinterpretation of this conversation. Or maybe you can point to anybody in this thread saying Ukraine started the war?

                              And no, I don't have a solution. And neither do you, so try reigning in the intellectual superiority bullshit for once.

                              No, you'll just happily go along with all the dunking as Trump makes noises towards a negotiated end to the war. Just like the illustrious Bolton, sneering at the idea of Trump "surrendering", while admitting in the same conversation that the other possible end is a Russian victory in a war of attrition. I hope for a negotiated peace, before the war of attrition reaches its inevitable conclusion. I realize those negotiations will get dunked on by all the usual suspects, all along the way, and I realize no negotiations were occurring under Biden. I'll take the faint hope over no hope.

                              An American President bullying the victim in this barbaric situation and quite possibly giving Putin exactly what he wants is not negotiating an end to the war.

                              HoraceH Offline
                              HoraceH Offline
                              Horace
                              wrote on last edited by
                              #37

                              @Doctor-Phibes said in Gifts for Putin, Demands for Zelensky:

                              @Horace said in Gifts for Putin, Demands for Zelensky:

                              @Doctor-Phibes said in Gifts for Putin, Demands for Zelensky:

                              @Horace said in Gifts for Putin, Demands for Zelensky:

                              @Doctor-Phibes I think it's cute that you can think deeply enough to interrogate the opinions of others, while you offer literally nothing in the way of an alternative plan that has any hope of ending anywhere but a Russian victory.

                              But hey, maybe I'm wrong. Please prove me wrong, please offer an alternative. Or just continue to be baffled at how anybody could possibly not use the right words, that's really the important thing here.

                              So, Trump blames Ukraine for starting this war, and somehow I'm the one in the wrong for pointing out that this is a lie?

                              That's a wild misinterpretation of this conversation. Or maybe you can point to anybody in this thread saying Ukraine started the war?

                              And no, I don't have a solution. And neither do you, so try reigning in the intellectual superiority bullshit for once.

                              No, you'll just happily go along with all the dunking as Trump makes noises towards a negotiated end to the war. Just like the illustrious Bolton, sneering at the idea of Trump "surrendering", while admitting in the same conversation that the other possible end is a Russian victory in a war of attrition. I hope for a negotiated peace, before the war of attrition reaches its inevitable conclusion. I realize those negotiations will get dunked on by all the usual suspects, all along the way, and I realize no negotiations were occurring under Biden. I'll take the faint hope over no hope.

                              An American President bullying the victim in this barbaric situation and quite possibly giving Putin exactly what he wants is not negotiating an end to the war.

                              You clearly don't want to say it out loud, and I don't blame you, but you effectively prefer a prolonged war of attrition, that Ukraine ultimately loses. Or maybe you're hoping for a Deus Ex Machina where Putin dies and a Western progressive rises in his place. I agree that that would be nice.

                              Education is extremely important.

                              Doctor PhibesD RenaudaR 2 Replies Last reply
                              • X Offline
                                X Offline
                                xenon
                                wrote on last edited by xenon
                                #38

                                The issue is that the “negotiated” settlement still results Ukrainians being “pacified” by the Russians. Pretty much same result as a prolonged war of attrition - except maybe the fighters just get blindfolded and executed.

                                1 Reply Last reply
                                • HoraceH Horace

                                  @Doctor-Phibes said in Gifts for Putin, Demands for Zelensky:

                                  @Horace said in Gifts for Putin, Demands for Zelensky:

                                  @Doctor-Phibes said in Gifts for Putin, Demands for Zelensky:

                                  @Horace said in Gifts for Putin, Demands for Zelensky:

                                  @Doctor-Phibes I think it's cute that you can think deeply enough to interrogate the opinions of others, while you offer literally nothing in the way of an alternative plan that has any hope of ending anywhere but a Russian victory.

                                  But hey, maybe I'm wrong. Please prove me wrong, please offer an alternative. Or just continue to be baffled at how anybody could possibly not use the right words, that's really the important thing here.

                                  So, Trump blames Ukraine for starting this war, and somehow I'm the one in the wrong for pointing out that this is a lie?

                                  That's a wild misinterpretation of this conversation. Or maybe you can point to anybody in this thread saying Ukraine started the war?

                                  And no, I don't have a solution. And neither do you, so try reigning in the intellectual superiority bullshit for once.

                                  No, you'll just happily go along with all the dunking as Trump makes noises towards a negotiated end to the war. Just like the illustrious Bolton, sneering at the idea of Trump "surrendering", while admitting in the same conversation that the other possible end is a Russian victory in a war of attrition. I hope for a negotiated peace, before the war of attrition reaches its inevitable conclusion. I realize those negotiations will get dunked on by all the usual suspects, all along the way, and I realize no negotiations were occurring under Biden. I'll take the faint hope over no hope.

                                  An American President bullying the victim in this barbaric situation and quite possibly giving Putin exactly what he wants is not negotiating an end to the war.

                                  You clearly don't want to say it out loud, and I don't blame you, but you effectively prefer a prolonged war of attrition, that Ukraine ultimately loses. Or maybe you're hoping for a Deus Ex Machina where Putin dies and a Western progressive rises in his place. I agree that that would be nice.

                                  Doctor PhibesD Offline
                                  Doctor PhibesD Offline
                                  Doctor Phibes
                                  wrote on last edited by Doctor Phibes
                                  #39

                                  @Horace said in Gifts for Putin, Demands for Zelensky:

                                  @Doctor-Phibes said in Gifts for Putin, Demands for Zelensky:

                                  @Horace said in Gifts for Putin, Demands for Zelensky:

                                  @Doctor-Phibes said in Gifts for Putin, Demands for Zelensky:

                                  @Horace said in Gifts for Putin, Demands for Zelensky:

                                  @Doctor-Phibes I think it's cute that you can think deeply enough to interrogate the opinions of others, while you offer literally nothing in the way of an alternative plan that has any hope of ending anywhere but a Russian victory.

                                  But hey, maybe I'm wrong. Please prove me wrong, please offer an alternative. Or just continue to be baffled at how anybody could possibly not use the right words, that's really the important thing here.

                                  So, Trump blames Ukraine for starting this war, and somehow I'm the one in the wrong for pointing out that this is a lie?

                                  That's a wild misinterpretation of this conversation. Or maybe you can point to anybody in this thread saying Ukraine started the war?

                                  And no, I don't have a solution. And neither do you, so try reigning in the intellectual superiority bullshit for once.

                                  No, you'll just happily go along with all the dunking as Trump makes noises towards a negotiated end to the war. Just like the illustrious Bolton, sneering at the idea of Trump "surrendering", while admitting in the same conversation that the other possible end is a Russian victory in a war of attrition. I hope for a negotiated peace, before the war of attrition reaches its inevitable conclusion. I realize those negotiations will get dunked on by all the usual suspects, all along the way, and I realize no negotiations were occurring under Biden. I'll take the faint hope over no hope.

                                  An American President bullying the victim in this barbaric situation and quite possibly giving Putin exactly what he wants is not negotiating an end to the war.

                                  You clearly don't want to say it out loud, and I don't blame you, but you effectively prefer a prolonged war of attrition, that Ukraine ultimately loses. Or maybe you're hoping for a Deus Ex Machina where Putin dies and a Western progressive rises in his place. I agree that that would be nice.

                                  It's really not about what I want, or what you want, or even what Donald Trump wants. Surely, it's about what Ukrainians want. They are the innocent victims here.

                                  Is anybody asking them? You seem keener to tell them that it's in everybody's best interest if they capitulate.

                                  I was only joking

                                  HoraceH 1 Reply Last reply
                                  • Doctor PhibesD Doctor Phibes

                                    @Horace said in Gifts for Putin, Demands for Zelensky:

                                    @Doctor-Phibes said in Gifts for Putin, Demands for Zelensky:

                                    @Horace said in Gifts for Putin, Demands for Zelensky:

                                    @Doctor-Phibes said in Gifts for Putin, Demands for Zelensky:

                                    @Horace said in Gifts for Putin, Demands for Zelensky:

                                    @Doctor-Phibes I think it's cute that you can think deeply enough to interrogate the opinions of others, while you offer literally nothing in the way of an alternative plan that has any hope of ending anywhere but a Russian victory.

                                    But hey, maybe I'm wrong. Please prove me wrong, please offer an alternative. Or just continue to be baffled at how anybody could possibly not use the right words, that's really the important thing here.

                                    So, Trump blames Ukraine for starting this war, and somehow I'm the one in the wrong for pointing out that this is a lie?

                                    That's a wild misinterpretation of this conversation. Or maybe you can point to anybody in this thread saying Ukraine started the war?

                                    And no, I don't have a solution. And neither do you, so try reigning in the intellectual superiority bullshit for once.

                                    No, you'll just happily go along with all the dunking as Trump makes noises towards a negotiated end to the war. Just like the illustrious Bolton, sneering at the idea of Trump "surrendering", while admitting in the same conversation that the other possible end is a Russian victory in a war of attrition. I hope for a negotiated peace, before the war of attrition reaches its inevitable conclusion. I realize those negotiations will get dunked on by all the usual suspects, all along the way, and I realize no negotiations were occurring under Biden. I'll take the faint hope over no hope.

                                    An American President bullying the victim in this barbaric situation and quite possibly giving Putin exactly what he wants is not negotiating an end to the war.

                                    You clearly don't want to say it out loud, and I don't blame you, but you effectively prefer a prolonged war of attrition, that Ukraine ultimately loses. Or maybe you're hoping for a Deus Ex Machina where Putin dies and a Western progressive rises in his place. I agree that that would be nice.

                                    It's really not about what I want, or what you want, or even what Donald Trump wants. Surely, it's about what Ukrainians want. They are the innocent victims here.

                                    Is anybody asking them? You seem keener to tell them that it's in everybody's best interest if they capitulate.

                                    HoraceH Offline
                                    HoraceH Offline
                                    Horace
                                    wrote on last edited by
                                    #40

                                    @Doctor-Phibes said in Gifts for Putin, Demands for Zelensky:

                                    @Horace said in Gifts for Putin, Demands for Zelensky:

                                    @Doctor-Phibes said in Gifts for Putin, Demands for Zelensky:

                                    @Horace said in Gifts for Putin, Demands for Zelensky:

                                    @Doctor-Phibes said in Gifts for Putin, Demands for Zelensky:

                                    @Horace said in Gifts for Putin, Demands for Zelensky:

                                    @Doctor-Phibes I think it's cute that you can think deeply enough to interrogate the opinions of others, while you offer literally nothing in the way of an alternative plan that has any hope of ending anywhere but a Russian victory.

                                    But hey, maybe I'm wrong. Please prove me wrong, please offer an alternative. Or just continue to be baffled at how anybody could possibly not use the right words, that's really the important thing here.

                                    So, Trump blames Ukraine for starting this war, and somehow I'm the one in the wrong for pointing out that this is a lie?

                                    That's a wild misinterpretation of this conversation. Or maybe you can point to anybody in this thread saying Ukraine started the war?

                                    And no, I don't have a solution. And neither do you, so try reigning in the intellectual superiority bullshit for once.

                                    No, you'll just happily go along with all the dunking as Trump makes noises towards a negotiated end to the war. Just like the illustrious Bolton, sneering at the idea of Trump "surrendering", while admitting in the same conversation that the other possible end is a Russian victory in a war of attrition. I hope for a negotiated peace, before the war of attrition reaches its inevitable conclusion. I realize those negotiations will get dunked on by all the usual suspects, all along the way, and I realize no negotiations were occurring under Biden. I'll take the faint hope over no hope.

                                    An American President bullying the victim in this barbaric situation and quite possibly giving Putin exactly what he wants is not negotiating an end to the war.

                                    You clearly don't want to say it out loud, and I don't blame you, but you effectively prefer a prolonged war of attrition, that Ukraine ultimately loses. Or maybe you're hoping for a Deus Ex Machina where Putin dies and a Western progressive rises in his place. I agree that that would be nice.

                                    It's really not about what I want, or what you want, or even what Donald Trump wants. Surely, it's about what Ukrainians want. They are the innocent victims here.

                                    Is anybody asking them? You seem keener to tell them.

                                    I think you have difficulty conceptualizing a situation where there is no powerful law enforcer who can enforce what is or is not fair.

                                    Education is extremely important.

                                    Doctor PhibesD 1 Reply Last reply
                                    • HoraceH Horace

                                      @Doctor-Phibes said in Gifts for Putin, Demands for Zelensky:

                                      @Horace said in Gifts for Putin, Demands for Zelensky:

                                      @Doctor-Phibes said in Gifts for Putin, Demands for Zelensky:

                                      @Horace said in Gifts for Putin, Demands for Zelensky:

                                      @Doctor-Phibes said in Gifts for Putin, Demands for Zelensky:

                                      @Horace said in Gifts for Putin, Demands for Zelensky:

                                      @Doctor-Phibes I think it's cute that you can think deeply enough to interrogate the opinions of others, while you offer literally nothing in the way of an alternative plan that has any hope of ending anywhere but a Russian victory.

                                      But hey, maybe I'm wrong. Please prove me wrong, please offer an alternative. Or just continue to be baffled at how anybody could possibly not use the right words, that's really the important thing here.

                                      So, Trump blames Ukraine for starting this war, and somehow I'm the one in the wrong for pointing out that this is a lie?

                                      That's a wild misinterpretation of this conversation. Or maybe you can point to anybody in this thread saying Ukraine started the war?

                                      And no, I don't have a solution. And neither do you, so try reigning in the intellectual superiority bullshit for once.

                                      No, you'll just happily go along with all the dunking as Trump makes noises towards a negotiated end to the war. Just like the illustrious Bolton, sneering at the idea of Trump "surrendering", while admitting in the same conversation that the other possible end is a Russian victory in a war of attrition. I hope for a negotiated peace, before the war of attrition reaches its inevitable conclusion. I realize those negotiations will get dunked on by all the usual suspects, all along the way, and I realize no negotiations were occurring under Biden. I'll take the faint hope over no hope.

                                      An American President bullying the victim in this barbaric situation and quite possibly giving Putin exactly what he wants is not negotiating an end to the war.

                                      You clearly don't want to say it out loud, and I don't blame you, but you effectively prefer a prolonged war of attrition, that Ukraine ultimately loses. Or maybe you're hoping for a Deus Ex Machina where Putin dies and a Western progressive rises in his place. I agree that that would be nice.

                                      It's really not about what I want, or what you want, or even what Donald Trump wants. Surely, it's about what Ukrainians want. They are the innocent victims here.

                                      Is anybody asking them? You seem keener to tell them.

                                      I think you have difficulty conceptualizing a situation where there is no powerful law enforcer who can enforce what is or is not fair.

                                      Doctor PhibesD Offline
                                      Doctor PhibesD Offline
                                      Doctor Phibes
                                      wrote on last edited by
                                      #41

                                      @Horace said in Gifts for Putin, Demands for Zelensky:

                                      I think you have difficulty conceptualizing a situation where there is no powerful law enforcer who can enforce what is or is not fair.

                                      And people like you would have seen Britain surrender to the Nazis, because you'd have difficulty conceptualising a situation where they could beat the motherfuckers.

                                      I was only joking

                                      HoraceH 1 Reply Last reply
                                      • HoraceH Horace

                                        @Doctor-Phibes said in Gifts for Putin, Demands for Zelensky:

                                        @Horace said in Gifts for Putin, Demands for Zelensky:

                                        @Doctor-Phibes said in Gifts for Putin, Demands for Zelensky:

                                        @Horace said in Gifts for Putin, Demands for Zelensky:

                                        @Doctor-Phibes I think it's cute that you can think deeply enough to interrogate the opinions of others, while you offer literally nothing in the way of an alternative plan that has any hope of ending anywhere but a Russian victory.

                                        But hey, maybe I'm wrong. Please prove me wrong, please offer an alternative. Or just continue to be baffled at how anybody could possibly not use the right words, that's really the important thing here.

                                        So, Trump blames Ukraine for starting this war, and somehow I'm the one in the wrong for pointing out that this is a lie?

                                        That's a wild misinterpretation of this conversation. Or maybe you can point to anybody in this thread saying Ukraine started the war?

                                        And no, I don't have a solution. And neither do you, so try reigning in the intellectual superiority bullshit for once.

                                        No, you'll just happily go along with all the dunking as Trump makes noises towards a negotiated end to the war. Just like the illustrious Bolton, sneering at the idea of Trump "surrendering", while admitting in the same conversation that the other possible end is a Russian victory in a war of attrition. I hope for a negotiated peace, before the war of attrition reaches its inevitable conclusion. I realize those negotiations will get dunked on by all the usual suspects, all along the way, and I realize no negotiations were occurring under Biden. I'll take the faint hope over no hope.

                                        An American President bullying the victim in this barbaric situation and quite possibly giving Putin exactly what he wants is not negotiating an end to the war.

                                        You clearly don't want to say it out loud, and I don't blame you, but you effectively prefer a prolonged war of attrition, that Ukraine ultimately loses. Or maybe you're hoping for a Deus Ex Machina where Putin dies and a Western progressive rises in his place. I agree that that would be nice.

                                        RenaudaR Offline
                                        RenaudaR Offline
                                        Renauda
                                        wrote on last edited by Renauda
                                        #42

                                        @Horace said in Gifts for Putin, Demands for Zelensky:

                                        @Doctor-Phibes said in Gifts for Putin, Demands for Zelensky:

                                        @Horace said in Gifts for Putin, Demands for Zelensky:

                                        @Doctor-Phibes said in Gifts for Putin, Demands for Zelensky:

                                        @Horace said in Gifts for Putin, Demands for Zelensky:

                                        @Doctor-Phibes I think it's cute that you can think deeply enough to interrogate the opinions of others, while you offer literally nothing in the way of an alternative plan that has any hope of ending anywhere but a Russian victory.

                                        But hey, maybe I'm wrong. Please prove me wrong, please offer an alternative. Or just continue to be baffled at how anybody could possibly not use the right words, that's really the important thing here.

                                        So, Trump blames Ukraine for starting this war, and somehow I'm the one in the wrong for pointing out that this is a lie?

                                        That's a wild misinterpretation of this conversation. Or maybe you can point to anybody in this thread saying Ukraine started the war?

                                        And no, I don't have a solution. And neither do you, so try reigning in the intellectual superiority bullshit for once.

                                        No, you'll just happily go along with all the dunking as Trump makes noises towards a negotiated end to the war. Just like the illustrious Bolton, sneering at the idea of Trump "surrendering", while admitting in the same conversation that the other possible end is a Russian victory in a war of attrition. I hope for a negotiated peace, before the war of attrition reaches its inevitable conclusion. I realize those negotiations will get dunked on by all the usual suspects, all along the way, and I realize no negotiations were occurring under Biden. I'll take the faint hope over no hope.

                                        An American President bullying the victim in this barbaric situation and quite possibly giving Putin exactly what he wants is not negotiating an end to the war.

                                        You clearly don't want to say it out loud, and I don't blame you, but you effectively prefer a prolonged war of attrition, that Ukraine ultimately loses. Or maybe you're hoping for a Deus Ex Machina where Putin dies and a Western progressive rises in his place. I agree that that would be nice.

                                        Stop digging yourself deeper than you already are. Projection and deflection won’t work here.

                                        Nobody with any understanding of Russia expects a Western progressive to replace the tyrant in the Kremlin. That horse left the barn and died a miserable death sometime during Yeltsin’s second term in the 1990s. The best we can hope for is someone like Putin appeared to be during his first term. Preferably someone whose prior profession was something other than a KGB or FSB hood.

                                        Elbows up!

                                        HoraceH 1 Reply Last reply
                                        • Doctor PhibesD Doctor Phibes

                                          @Horace said in Gifts for Putin, Demands for Zelensky:

                                          I think you have difficulty conceptualizing a situation where there is no powerful law enforcer who can enforce what is or is not fair.

                                          And people like you would have seen Britain surrender to the Nazis, because you'd have difficulty conceptualising a situation where they could beat the motherfuckers.

                                          HoraceH Offline
                                          HoraceH Offline
                                          Horace
                                          wrote on last edited by
                                          #43

                                          @Doctor-Phibes said in Gifts for Putin, Demands for Zelensky:

                                          @Horace said in Gifts for Putin, Demands for Zelensky:

                                          I think you have difficulty conceptualizing a situation where there is no powerful law enforcer who can enforce what is or is not fair.

                                          And people like you would have seen Britain surrender to the Nazis, because you'd have difficulty conceptualising a situation where they could beat the motherfuckers.

                                          But see, that's an actual argument. If you would like to go with "but Ukraine can win", then great. At least it's an argument. Not one I've seen any informed person agree with, but it's an argument.

                                          Education is extremely important.

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