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The New Coffee Room

  1. TNCR
  2. General Discussion
  3. Rigged

Rigged

Scheduled Pinned Locked Moved General Discussion
58 Posts 12 Posters 791 Views
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  • JollyJ Jolly

    Trial by jury is only effective when it is fair.

    Rigged trials are not fair.

    MikM Away
    MikM Away
    Mik
    wrote on last edited by
    #8

    @Jolly said in Rigged:

    Trial by jury is only effective when it is fair.

    Rigged trials are not fair.

    That's partially why there are judges, to temper the inclinations of non-legal-professionals as jurors. If we've lost the judges we have no system.

    “I am fond of pigs. Dogs look up to us. Cats look down on us. Pigs treat us as equals.” ~Winston S. Churchill

    1 Reply Last reply
    • George KG George K

      @Jolly said in Rigged:

      And if this political tactic works, tit-for-tat will soon follow.

      Will the GOP have the balls to do this? I am skeptical.

      But, you can't put the shit back into the horse.

      LuFins DadL Offline
      LuFins DadL Offline
      LuFins Dad
      wrote on last edited by
      #9

      @George-K said in Rigged:

      @Jolly said in Rigged:

      And if this political tactic works, tit-for-tat will soon follow.

      Will the GOP have the balls to do this? I am skeptical.

      But, you can't put the shit back into the horse.

      It’s not about lack of balls, it’s about about lack of capacity.

      Dems don’t really have the exposure in Red jurisdictions the same way that Lame Donald has in New York. They live, work, and play in safely Dem controlled regions. That’s going to make it extraordinarily hard for a prosecutor in West Virginia to go after a Joe Biden or a Barack Obama. And going after political opponents at the Federal level is a completely different fish to fry and is much more difficult to pull off.

      The Brad

      1 Reply Last reply
      • jon-nycJ Online
        jon-nycJ Online
        jon-nyc
        wrote on last edited by
        #10

        Does Rich Lowry have any arguments or is it just a series of denunciations?

        It’s paywalled.

        "You never know what worse luck your bad luck has saved you from."
        -Cormac McCarthy

        1 Reply Last reply
        • JollyJ Jolly

          Right now, I think the majority of the country that has paid much attention to this trial knows it was not conducted properly. And if this political tactic works, tit-for-tat will soon follow.

          That will be the country your children will inherit.

          89th8 Offline
          89th8 Offline
          89th
          wrote on last edited by
          #11

          @Jolly said in Rigged:

          Right now, I think the majority of the country that has paid much attention to this trial knows it was not conducted properly. And if this political tactic works, tit-for-tat will soon follow.

          That will be the country your children will inherit.

          Not sure... most of the country has not paid much attention tot this trial. Heck, a former president was just found guilty of a felony and the headline isn't even the lead on some of the websites I check each morning such as cnbc.com and wtop.com. I think most of the country knows Trump pushes the line legally with many things so they aren't surprised when one of the cases finds him guilty.

          And honestly, if a president commits a felony.... go for it, charge them, find them guilty if they are. The dems and repubs have been doing this forever, I'm not too worried about the country. Maybe national debt, social security, war with China, and the damn cost of McDoubles.... but politically, I am hopeful in a few years we get past this battle of nursing home residents and restore some normalcy and energy to the white house to lead the executive branch against the above issues.

          MikM 1 Reply Last reply
          • 89th8 89th

            @Jolly said in Rigged:

            Right now, I think the majority of the country that has paid much attention to this trial knows it was not conducted properly. And if this political tactic works, tit-for-tat will soon follow.

            That will be the country your children will inherit.

            Not sure... most of the country has not paid much attention tot this trial. Heck, a former president was just found guilty of a felony and the headline isn't even the lead on some of the websites I check each morning such as cnbc.com and wtop.com. I think most of the country knows Trump pushes the line legally with many things so they aren't surprised when one of the cases finds him guilty.

            And honestly, if a president commits a felony.... go for it, charge them, find them guilty if they are. The dems and repubs have been doing this forever, I'm not too worried about the country. Maybe national debt, social security, war with China, and the damn cost of McDoubles.... but politically, I am hopeful in a few years we get past this battle of nursing home residents and restore some normalcy and energy to the white house to lead the executive branch against the above issues.

            MikM Away
            MikM Away
            Mik
            wrote on last edited by
            #12

            @89th I don't see how you can look at the totality of the tsunami of attempts to destroy a legally elected president and say you're not worried about it.

            “I am fond of pigs. Dogs look up to us. Cats look down on us. Pigs treat us as equals.” ~Winston S. Churchill

            1 Reply Last reply
            • 89th8 Offline
              89th8 Offline
              89th
              wrote on last edited by
              #13

              I haven't followed every case but feel like it's pretty common sense Trump pushes the legal boundary wherever he can, so when I see cases against him I am completely unsurprised.

              Whether it's being sloppy with handling classified records, or asking a state official to find votes in his favor, or allegedly sexually assaulting and defaming someone, or conspiracy to defraud the United States (subvert democracy), or to fraudulently report the value of properties in order to either lower his tax bill or improve the terms of his loans, or to falsify business records while paying hush money...

              In other words, FAFO. I'd feel the same if Obama allegedly did all of those things and the justice system went after him.

              JollyJ 1 Reply Last reply
              • A AndyD

                Say what you like, trial by jury is a sound system.

                I hear the orange-turd turned red as the guilty verdicts were pronounced.

                Ferchrissake, choose someone, anyone! else to represent the GOP.

                RenaudaR Offline
                RenaudaR Offline
                Renauda
                wrote on last edited by Renauda
                #14

                @AndyD said in Rigged:

                Say what you like, trial by jury is a sound system.

                I am sure that Trump was gulity as hell and the verdict was correct. I don’t not think this was the trial that should have come first. The pending trials are the ones that would damage the Trump brand most. This one is the least damaging and will likely bolster his campaign.

                Not much for anyone to rejoice about. Politically Trump is stronger today than he was before the jury read its verdict.

                Elbows up!

                MikM 1 Reply Last reply
                • RenaudaR Renauda

                  @AndyD said in Rigged:

                  Say what you like, trial by jury is a sound system.

                  I am sure that Trump was gulity as hell and the verdict was correct. I don’t not think this was the trial that should have come first. The pending trials are the ones that would damage the Trump brand most. This one is the least damaging and will likely bolster his campaign.

                  Not much for anyone to rejoice about. Politically Trump is stronger today than he was before the jury read its verdict.

                  MikM Away
                  MikM Away
                  Mik
                  wrote on last edited by
                  #15

                  @Renauda I think you are right about him being stronger. The trial was a fiasco.

                  “I am fond of pigs. Dogs look up to us. Cats look down on us. Pigs treat us as equals.” ~Winston S. Churchill

                  1 Reply Last reply
                  • 89th8 89th

                    I haven't followed every case but feel like it's pretty common sense Trump pushes the legal boundary wherever he can, so when I see cases against him I am completely unsurprised.

                    Whether it's being sloppy with handling classified records, or asking a state official to find votes in his favor, or allegedly sexually assaulting and defaming someone, or conspiracy to defraud the United States (subvert democracy), or to fraudulently report the value of properties in order to either lower his tax bill or improve the terms of his loans, or to falsify business records while paying hush money...

                    In other words, FAFO. I'd feel the same if Obama allegedly did all of those things and the justice system went after him.

                    JollyJ Offline
                    JollyJ Offline
                    Jolly
                    wrote on last edited by
                    #16

                    @89th said in Rigged:

                    I haven't followed every case but feel like it's pretty common sense Trump pushes the legal boundary wherever he can, so when I see cases against him I am completely unsurprised.

                    Whether it's being sloppy with handling classified records, or asking a state official to find votes in his favor, or allegedly sexually assaulting and defaming someone, or conspiracy to defraud the United States (subvert democracy), or to fraudulently report the value of properties in order to either lower his tax bill or improve the terms of his loans, or to falsify business records while paying hush money...

                    In other words, FAFO. I'd feel the same if Obama allegedly did all of those things and the justice system went after him.

                    If Obama had been convicted yesterday, your city would be burning...

                    “Cry havoc and let slip the DOGE of war!”

                    Those who cheered as J-6 American prisoners were locked in solitary for 18 months without trial, now suddenly fight tooth and nail for foreign terrorists’ "due process". — Buck Sexton

                    1 Reply Last reply
                    • AxtremusA Offline
                      AxtremusA Offline
                      Axtremus
                      wrote on last edited by
                      #17

                      So … what’s the next trial that will get all the media attention, and TNCR’s attention?

                      1 Reply Last reply
                      • X Offline
                        X Offline
                        xenon
                        wrote on last edited by xenon
                        #18

                        The legal issues in this trial are too complicated for the lay person to understand. I listened to the advisory opinion podcast Jon linked, and I don't really get it.
                        This will just create more division - no clarity.

                        MikM 1 Reply Last reply
                        • X xenon

                          The legal issues in this trial are too complicated for the lay person to understand. I listened to the advisory opinion podcast Jon linked, and I don't really get it.
                          This will just create more division - no clarity.

                          MikM Away
                          MikM Away
                          Mik
                          wrote on last edited by
                          #19

                          @xenon Yep. I was just listening to NPR on my way to haircut. They bemoaned the abandonment of long held norms - only by the GOP, of course. Either a complete lack of self-awareness or a deliberate descent into propaganda.

                          “I am fond of pigs. Dogs look up to us. Cats look down on us. Pigs treat us as equals.” ~Winston S. Churchill

                          JollyJ George KG 2 Replies Last reply
                          • MikM Mik

                            @xenon Yep. I was just listening to NPR on my way to haircut. They bemoaned the abandonment of long held norms - only by the GOP, of course. Either a complete lack of self-awareness or a deliberate descent into propaganda.

                            JollyJ Offline
                            JollyJ Offline
                            Jolly
                            wrote on last edited by
                            #20

                            @Mik said in Rigged:

                            @xenon Yep. I was just listening to NPR on my way to haircut. They bemoaned the abandonment of long held norms - only by the GOP, of course. Either a complete lack of self-awareness or a deliberate descent into propaganda.

                            Propaganda.

                            They know exactly what they are doing. I used to listen to NPR 25 years ago. I never listen to them today. They no longer have anything my America wants to listen to...

                            “Cry havoc and let slip the DOGE of war!”

                            Those who cheered as J-6 American prisoners were locked in solitary for 18 months without trial, now suddenly fight tooth and nail for foreign terrorists’ "due process". — Buck Sexton

                            1 Reply Last reply
                            • MikM Mik

                              @xenon Yep. I was just listening to NPR on my way to haircut. They bemoaned the abandonment of long held norms - only by the GOP, of course. Either a complete lack of self-awareness or a deliberate descent into propaganda.

                              George KG Offline
                              George KG Offline
                              George K
                              wrote on last edited by
                              #21

                              @Mik said in Rigged:

                              They bemoaned the abandonment of long held norms

                              Did they bother to explain what those "norms" are?

                              Have they talked about how, exactly, Trump is a threat to democracy?

                              "Now look here, you Baltic gas passer... " - Mik, 6/14/08

                              The saying, "Lite is just one damn thing after another," is a gross understatement. The damn things overlap.

                              1 Reply Last reply
                              • 89th8 Offline
                                89th8 Offline
                                89th
                                wrote on last edited by
                                #22

                                He literally tried to overturn an election in which he lost, so that he could stay in power.

                                JollyJ CopperC 2 Replies Last reply
                                • X Offline
                                  X Offline
                                  xenon
                                  wrote on last edited by xenon
                                  #23

                                  I agree with 89 on a broader point - Trump just doesn't get what America is and how it's able to work. I think he has excellent instincts on what it should feel like to be an American.

                                  That's not enough. He gets into situations that undermine the republic and he's way too self absorbed to care.

                                  He also brings out the worst in the opposition. That's kind of not his fault - but we should all know better.

                                  JollyJ 1 Reply Last reply
                                  • 89th8 89th

                                    He literally tried to overturn an election in which he lost, so that he could stay in power.

                                    JollyJ Offline
                                    JollyJ Offline
                                    Jolly
                                    wrote on last edited by
                                    #24

                                    @89th said in Rigged:

                                    He literally tried to overturn an election in which he lost, so that he could stay in power.

                                    He thought he had been cheated and was using every legal means possible to try to beat the cheat.

                                    Now, stud duck, you tell me what laws he broke? I'd like to hear how Trump was illegally trying to overturn the government...

                                    “Cry havoc and let slip the DOGE of war!”

                                    Those who cheered as J-6 American prisoners were locked in solitary for 18 months without trial, now suddenly fight tooth and nail for foreign terrorists’ "due process". — Buck Sexton

                                    MikM 1 Reply Last reply
                                    • JollyJ Jolly

                                      @89th said in Rigged:

                                      He literally tried to overturn an election in which he lost, so that he could stay in power.

                                      He thought he had been cheated and was using every legal means possible to try to beat the cheat.

                                      Now, stud duck, you tell me what laws he broke? I'd like to hear how Trump was illegally trying to overturn the government...

                                      MikM Away
                                      MikM Away
                                      Mik
                                      wrote on last edited by
                                      #25

                                      @Jolly love the new avatar. Perfect.

                                      “I am fond of pigs. Dogs look up to us. Cats look down on us. Pigs treat us as equals.” ~Winston S. Churchill

                                      JollyJ 1 Reply Last reply
                                      • 89th8 89th

                                        He literally tried to overturn an election in which he lost, so that he could stay in power.

                                        CopperC Offline
                                        CopperC Offline
                                        Copper
                                        wrote on last edited by
                                        #26

                                        @89th said in Rigged:

                                        He literally tried to overturn an election in which he lost, so that he could stay in power.

                                        By literally I assume you mean legally.

                                        1 Reply Last reply
                                        • X xenon

                                          I agree with 89 on a broader point - Trump just doesn't get what America is and how it's able to work. I think he has excellent instincts on what it should feel like to be an American.

                                          That's not enough. He gets into situations that undermine the republic and he's way too self absorbed to care.

                                          He also brings out the worst in the opposition. That's kind of not his fault - but we should all know better.

                                          JollyJ Offline
                                          JollyJ Offline
                                          Jolly
                                          wrote on last edited by
                                          #27

                                          @xenon said in Rigged:

                                          I agree with 89 on a broader point - Trump just doesn't get what America is and how it's able to work.

                                          I think he gets it. Not maybe what it is, but what it should be.

                                          As for how it works...Trump put more real dollars in American pockets during his first three years in office, than had been done in decades. Low taxes, a friendly business climate, a less intrusive government...That isn't what makes America work better?

                                          “Cry havoc and let slip the DOGE of war!”

                                          Those who cheered as J-6 American prisoners were locked in solitary for 18 months without trial, now suddenly fight tooth and nail for foreign terrorists’ "due process". — Buck Sexton

                                          taiwan_girlT 1 Reply Last reply
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