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The New Coffee Room

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  3. The biggest tragedy in classical music history.

The biggest tragedy in classical music history.

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  • George KG Offline
    George KG Offline
    George K
    wrote on last edited by
    #5

    Mendelssohn v Chopin?

    Beautiful melodies, winner is Chopin - probably.
    A more well-rounded composer, winner is Felix - probably.

    But returning to your thesis, Schubert would probably beat either of them.

    I've commented before about Time Magazine talking about the Beatle's arrival in New York. Basically, they said, "These boys from Liverpool can write a melody that would make Schubert proud."

    "Now look here, you Baltic gas passer... " - Mik, 6/14/08

    The saying, "Lite is just one damn thing after another," is a gross understatement. The damn things overlap.

    1 Reply Last reply
    • jon-nycJ jon-nyc

      I think Mendelssohn clears that very low bar even with his young death.

      A serious question, how many beautiful melodies did humanity lose to Chopin's untimely death? We'll never know.

      AxtremusA Offline
      AxtremusA Offline
      Axtremus
      wrote on last edited by
      #6

      @jon-nyc said in The biggest tragedy in classical music history.:

      ... how many beautiful melodies did humanity lose to Chopin's untimely death the lack of participation from women, ethnic minorities, and members of the LGBTQ+ community? We'll never know.

      George KG 1 Reply Last reply
      • AxtremusA Axtremus

        @jon-nyc said in The biggest tragedy in classical music history.:

        ... how many beautiful melodies did humanity lose to Chopin's untimely death the lack of participation from women, ethnic minorities, and members of the LGBTQ+ community? We'll never know.

        George KG Offline
        George KG Offline
        George K
        wrote on last edited by
        #7

        @Axtremus Clara Schumann, Pyotr Tchaikovsky. and Camille Saint-Saens might have some thoughts on that.

        "Now look here, you Baltic gas passer... " - Mik, 6/14/08

        The saying, "Lite is just one damn thing after another," is a gross understatement. The damn things overlap.

        1 Reply Last reply
        • 89th8 Offline
          89th8 Offline
          89th
          wrote on last edited by
          #8

          Honestly I think the biggest tragedy was Beethoven being deaf. Think his music is good? Imagine if he could’ve heard his own shit.

          jon-nycJ 1 Reply Last reply
          • jon-nycJ Online
            jon-nycJ Online
            jon-nyc
            wrote on last edited by jon-nyc
            #9

            @Ax, true, but you're venturing into Rumsfeld's unknown unknowns, whereas I'm talking about known unknowns.

            Thank you for your attention to this matter.

            AxtremusA 1 Reply Last reply
            • 89th8 89th

              Honestly I think the biggest tragedy was Beethoven being deaf. Think his music is good? Imagine if he could’ve heard his own shit.

              jon-nycJ Online
              jon-nycJ Online
              jon-nyc
              wrote on last edited by jon-nyc
              #10

              @89th said in The biggest tragedy in classical music history.:

              Honestly I think the biggest tragedy was Beethoven being deaf. Think his music is good? Imagine if he could’ve heard his own shit.

              I suspect his death at the youngish age of 57 was a bigger loss than his deafness. He clearly had the music in his head and could transcribe it to paper.

              Thank you for your attention to this matter.

              1 Reply Last reply
              • jon-nycJ jon-nyc

                @Ax, true, but you're venturing into Rumsfeld's unknown unknowns, whereas I'm talking about known unknowns.

                AxtremusA Offline
                AxtremusA Offline
                Axtremus
                wrote on last edited by Axtremus
                #11

                @jon-nyc Consider it a highlighting of the potential magnitude of the unknown unknowns dwarfing the magnitude of the known unknowns.

                1 Reply Last reply
                • AxtremusA Offline
                  AxtremusA Offline
                  Axtremus
                  wrote on last edited by
                  #12

                  Statistically, musicians produce their "best works" when they are young. So maybe discount the "loss productivity" of the aging composers more?

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                  • jon-nycJ Online
                    jon-nycJ Online
                    jon-nyc
                    wrote on last edited by jon-nyc
                    #13

                    Well, there were women composers. Follow Leah Broad on twitter, she’ll introduce you to them. Maybe there would have been more had society been different. Hence my post about unknown unknowns.

                    How many non-Europeans would have been writing European art music (which is, after all, what we mean when we say 'classical music') in 1800, even if they were 'allowed' to? Probably none, within a reasonable rounding error.

                    Thank you for your attention to this matter.

                    1 Reply Last reply
                    • jon-nycJ jon-nyc

                      Schubert dying at 31.

                      Talk me out of it. You automatically lose if the word "Mozart" appears in your answer.

                      KlausK Online
                      KlausK Online
                      Klaus
                      wrote on last edited by
                      #14

                      @jon-nyc said in The biggest tragedy in classical music history.:

                      Schubert dying at 31.

                      Talk me out of it. You automatically lose if the word "Mozart" appears in your answer.

                      Mozart died too late, if anything.

                      Schubert has the best melodies. I'm working on the Schubert/Liszt "Ständchen" at the moment. Such a great melody!

                      That said, Schubert also wrote a lot of boring music. I don't care much for his early piano sonatas before D840, for instance.

                      1 Reply Last reply
                      • kluursK Offline
                        kluursK Offline
                        kluurs
                        wrote on last edited by
                        #15

                        After hearing me play, some might suggest my playing is a great tragedy for classical music.

                        1 Reply Last reply
                        • LuFins DadL Offline
                          LuFins DadL Offline
                          LuFins Dad
                          wrote on last edited by
                          #16

                          Greatest tragedy? Bartok living long enough to publish Mikrocosmos.

                          The Brad

                          1 Reply Last reply
                          • Doctor PhibesD Offline
                            Doctor PhibesD Offline
                            Doctor Phibes
                            wrote on last edited by
                            #17

                            Classic FM hiring David Mellor as a presenter.

                            I was only joking

                            1 Reply Last reply
                            • AxtremusA Axtremus

                              [woke]
                              The biggest tragedy in classical music history is the lack of representation from women, ethnic minorities, and the LGBTQ+ community.
                              [/woke]

                              CopperC Offline
                              CopperC Offline
                              Copper
                              wrote on last edited by
                              #18

                              @Axtremus said in The biggest tragedy in classical music history.:

                              [woke]
                              The biggest tragedy in classical music history is the lack of representation from women, ethnic minorities, and the LGBTQ+ community.
                              [/woke]

                              Funny, I had assumed that most were in the community.

                              1 Reply Last reply
                              • RenaudaR Offline
                                RenaudaR Offline
                                Renauda
                                wrote on last edited by Renauda
                                #19

                                Not the biggest tragedy in classical music by any means, but it is sad that Henry Purcell died at 36. He gave the world a rich inheritance as a composer and surely had much more to give. Certainly one of my favourite composers - even some of his vocal compositions.

                                Elbows up!

                                1 Reply Last reply
                                • CopperC Offline
                                  CopperC Offline
                                  Copper
                                  wrote on last edited by
                                  #20

                                  Sadder still, those masters who never composed a note.

                                  taiwan_girlT 1 Reply Last reply
                                  • RainmanR Offline
                                    RainmanR Offline
                                    Rainman
                                    wrote on last edited by
                                    #21

                                    Or those that tried and composed and no matter what they did, it all just sucked.

                                    1 Reply Last reply
                                    • CopperC Copper

                                      Sadder still, those masters who never composed a note.

                                      taiwan_girlT Offline
                                      taiwan_girlT Offline
                                      taiwan_girl
                                      wrote on last edited by
                                      #22

                                      @Copper said in The biggest tragedy in classical music history.:

                                      Sadder still, those masters who never composed a note.

                                      Somewhat related, but I have thought when I have in a super poor area - maybe there is a kid in the rural village in India who could find a cure for cancer but will never have the opportunity. Or, maybe there is another Schubert here.......

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