Mar-a-Lago raided
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wrote on 10 Aug 2022, 03:20 last edited by jon-nyc 8 Oct 2022, 03:26
@Jolly said in Mar-a-Lago raided:
The Dersh speaks:
I don’t know why people listen to Dersch or Tribe on the left. They’re simply old guys who harvested their former reputation in service of partisan ends. They are literally paid partisan shills.
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@jon-nyc said in Mar-a-Lago raided:
The thing to remember when listening to her is that she knows exactly what the FBI was looking for and why, and presumably what they found, at least of her client’s team is being honest with her.
So the fact that she’s casting aspersions is not a good sign for team Trump. She’s pretending to speak in hypothetical terms, but she almost certainly knows what they found.
Popcorn, please.
wrote on 10 Aug 2022, 03:38 last edited by jon-nyc 8 Oct 2022, 03:51@jon-nyc said in Mar-a-Lago raided:
The thing to remember when listening to her is that she knows exactly what the FBI was looking for and why, and presumably what they found, at least of her client’s team is being honest with her.
So the fact that she’s casting aspersions is not a good sign for team Trump. She’s pretending to speak in hypothetical terms, but she almost certainly knows what they found.
Popcorn, please.
Also their messaging pretty much guarantees this isn’t merely about classified docs. After all, they have a defense for that - the president is the ultimate authority on classification and can declassify anything at will.
The “they planted evidence” messaging that they are rolling out means this is about very specific crimes.
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wrote on 10 Aug 2022, 03:43 last edited by
At least the FBI got to sniff Me!ania's panties.
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wrote on 10 Aug 2022, 03:49 last edited by
Didn’t she used to sell them on eBay during her soft porn phase?
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wrote on 10 Aug 2022, 03:49 last edited by
Don't know about that. You bought some?
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wrote on 10 Aug 2022, 03:53 last edited by xenon 8 Oct 2022, 03:54
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wrote on 10 Aug 2022, 03:56 last edited by
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wrote on 10 Aug 2022, 04:03 last edited by
The messaging about planted evidence won’t save a 2024 candidacy if the evidence indicates a crime people care about. I suppose TDS sufferers think enough credulous supporters would still show up for him. I doubt that.
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The messaging about planted evidence won’t save a 2024 candidacy if the evidence indicates a crime people care about. I suppose TDS sufferers think enough credulous supporters would still show up for him. I doubt that.
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wrote on 10 Aug 2022, 04:08 last edited by
It's not a bad strategy at all. Him and his team have produced zero evidence for election fraud - doesn't stop a good chunk (most?) of his supporters from believing it.
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It's not a bad strategy at all. Him and his team have produced zero evidence for election fraud - doesn't stop a good chunk (most?) of his supporters from believing it.
wrote on 10 Aug 2022, 04:10 last edited by jon-nyc 8 Oct 2022, 04:15@xenon said in Mar-a-Lago raided:
It's not a bad strategy at all. Him and his team have produced zero evidence for election fraud - doesn't stop a good chunk (most?) of his supporters from believing it.
10s of millions of them. Probably 95% of GOP senators and half the representatives know it’s bullshit but are kept in line by fear of those 10s of millions.
That’s how personality cults work.
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@xenon said in Mar-a-Lago raided:
It's not a bad strategy at all. Him and his team have produced zero evidence for election fraud - doesn't stop a good chunk (most?) of his supporters from believing it.
10s of millions of them. Probably 95% of GOP senators and half the representatives know it’s bullshit but are kept in line by fear of those 10s of millions.
That’s how personality cults work.
wrote on 10 Aug 2022, 04:16 last edited by@jon-nyc said in Mar-a-Lago raided:
@xenon said in Mar-a-Lago raided:
It's not a bad strategy at all. Him and his team have produced zero evidence for election fraud - doesn't stop a good chunk (most?) of his supporters from believing it.
10s of millions of them. Probably 95% of GOP senators and half the representatives know it’s bullshit but are kept in line by fear of those 10s of millions.
That’s how cults work.
Actually calling the other political side a cult is how partisan hacks work. I don’t know how many people who would pull the lever for Trump would say out loud they think the election was stolen in 2020, but I suspect that number is smaller than the number of Biden voters who would attest to belief in fictitious oppression narratives. Is that a cult too?
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wrote on 10 Aug 2022, 04:26 last edited by jon-nyc 8 Oct 2022, 04:27
It’s an ideology and a religion. Maybe it’s a cult? I would have to think more deeply about where one definition ends and the other begins. My hesitancy is based on the fact that it lacks the unifying cult leader. But again, I’d have to think about it.
I am quite wary of both, as you know.
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It’s an ideology and a religion. Maybe it’s a cult? I would have to think more deeply about where one definition ends and the other begins. My hesitancy is based on the fact that it lacks the unifying cult leader. But again, I’d have to think about it.
I am quite wary of both, as you know.
wrote on 10 Aug 2022, 09:36 last edited by@jon-nyc said in Mar-a-Lago raided:
It’s an ideology and a religion.
I call it the LALALA contingent. (Those Trumplovers who react to everything by sticking their fingers in their ears and going LA-LA-LA-LA-LA.)
There can be no other explanation for their die-hard allegiance to the hero after all this time.
You have to wonder though how malleable is his base in actuality. Does it not stand to reason that some number have fallen away, have said, enough is enough? Especially since their reasoning was pretty fucked up to begin with. And it's way too early to say how many (if any) will fall away in the wake of this development.
It may be that the times are a-changin and leaving the pundits behind in their perspicacity and prognostications. Leaving them going, Da-rump de dump, which way did dey go?
This is loosy-goosey think, I know, but there is often if not always a lava-lamp quality to the culture. No sooner do the sociologists think they have it nailed, than it changes.
If nothing else, it'll make jury selection interesting.
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@jon-nyc said in Mar-a-Lago raided:
It’s an ideology and a religion.
I call it the LALALA contingent. (Those Trumplovers who react to everything by sticking their fingers in their ears and going LA-LA-LA-LA-LA.)
There can be no other explanation for their die-hard allegiance to the hero after all this time.
You have to wonder though how malleable is his base in actuality. Does it not stand to reason that some number have fallen away, have said, enough is enough? Especially since their reasoning was pretty fucked up to begin with. And it's way too early to say how many (if any) will fall away in the wake of this development.
It may be that the times are a-changin and leaving the pundits behind in their perspicacity and prognostications. Leaving them going, Da-rump de dump, which way did dey go?
This is loosy-goosey think, I know, but there is often if not always a lava-lamp quality to the culture. No sooner do the sociologists think they have it nailed, than it changes.
If nothing else, it'll make jury selection interesting.
wrote on 10 Aug 2022, 11:45 last edited by@Catseye3 said in Mar-a-Lago raided:
@jon-nyc said in Mar-a-Lago raided:
It’s an ideology and a religion.
I call it the LALALA contingent. (Those Trumplovers who react to everything by sticking their fingers in their ears and going LA-LA-LA-LA-LA.)
He was referring to certain Biden voters. It was an attempt to respond to me, to his credit. The conversation was followed. It happens sometimes here.
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wrote on 10 Aug 2022, 12:15 last edited by
One Trump attorney claims that she was not allowed to see the probable cause for the warrant. It was sealed.
She also claims that at first, she was not allowed to see the warrant itself, finally it was shown to her. Unknown and unclear as to whether the warrant was actually delivered.
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wrote on 10 Aug 2022, 12:19 last edited by
Most recent speculation I read, from a left leaning major outlet, was that this is about the national archives stuff. The boring possibility having to do with disagreements over what is classified government property and what is personal property.
We shall see, but when? Long enough that if it’s a nothing burger, nobody will care?
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Most recent speculation I read, from a left leaning major outlet, was that this is about the national archives stuff. The boring possibility having to do with disagreements over what is classified government property and what is personal property.
We shall see, but when? Long enough that if it’s a nothing burger, nobody will care?
wrote on 10 Aug 2022, 12:27 last edited by@Horace said in Mar-a-Lago raided:
Long enough that if it’s a nothing burger, nobody will care?
Some interesting speculation from today's WSJ.
Mr. Trump has already returned 15 boxes of documents, but the National Archives wants to know if the former President retained classified material he shouldn’t have. This is what appears to have triggered the FBI search, but it’s far from clear why this couldn’t be settled cooperatively, or at most with a subpoena.
Didn’t someone at Justice point out that a search in this case would draw comparisons to Hillary Clinton’s mishandling of classified information before her 2016 presidential campaign? She was never prosecuted, as Mr. Trump was quick to point out. Unless Mr. Trump’s offense involves a serious risk to national security, half of America may see the Trump search as an example of unequal justice.
And...
That the Mar-a-Lago raid occurred only about 90 days from a national election also increases the political suspicion. Democrats want to keep Mr. Trump front and center in the midterm campaign, which is why the Jan. 6 committee is continuing into the autumn.
Anyone who thinks an indictment and trial of Mr. Trump would go smoothly is in for a rude surprise. Millions of his supporters will see this as vindication of his charges against the “deep state,” and who knows how they will respond. Has Mr. Garland considered all of this?
Worse in the long term is the precedent being set and the payback it is likely to inspire. Once the Rubicon of prosecuting a former President has been crossed—especially if the alleged offense and evidence are less than compelling—every future President will be a target. William Barr, Mr. Trump’s second AG, wisely resisted pressure to indict political actors without a very strong case. The next Republican AG will not be as scrupulous.
And...
The FBI search alone makes it more likely that Mr. Trump will run again for President, if only to vindicate himself. He will run as a martyr, and even Republicans who want to turn the page on the former President may be repelled by what they see as a political prosecution.
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wrote on 10 Aug 2022, 12:30 last edited by
The theory where this is a 4D chess trolling of Donald Trump to galvanize his run? Sure why not.