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  3. Roe & Casey overturned.

Roe & Casey overturned.

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  • JollyJ Jolly

    I suspect Madison was fairly familiar with the Declaration of Independence. Life, liberty and the pursuit of happiness, would be very familiar concepts to him.

    jon-nycJ Online
    jon-nycJ Online
    jon-nyc
    wrote on last edited by
    #51

    @Jolly True, but he was known to apply it rather selectively.

    Only non-witches get due process.

    • Cotton Mather, Salem Massachusetts, 1692
    1 Reply Last reply
    • George KG Offline
      George KG Offline
      George K
      wrote on last edited by George K
      #52

      Let that sink in. SecDef: We will not obey the law.

      "Now look here, you Baltic gas passer... " - Mik, 6/14/08

      The saying, "Lite is just one damn thing after another," is a gross understatement. The damn things overlap.

      JollyJ LuFins DadL 2 Replies Last reply
      • George KG George K

        Let that sink in. SecDef: We will not obey the law.

        JollyJ Offline
        JollyJ Offline
        Jolly
        wrote on last edited by
        #53

        @George-K said in Roe & Casey overturned.:

        Let that sink in. SecDef: We will not obey the law.

        I'm not sure he can do that.

        “Cry havoc and let slip the DOGE of war!”

        Those who cheered as J-6 American prisoners were locked in solitary for 18 months without trial, now suddenly fight tooth and nail for foreign terrorists’ "due process". — Buck Sexton

        George KG 1 Reply Last reply
        • JollyJ Jolly

          @George-K said in Roe & Casey overturned.:

          Let that sink in. SecDef: We will not obey the law.

          I'm not sure he can do that.

          George KG Offline
          George KG Offline
          George K
          wrote on last edited by
          #54

          @Jolly said in Roe & Casey overturned.:

          I'm not sure he can do that.

          Garland will be all over that, right?

          "Now look here, you Baltic gas passer... " - Mik, 6/14/08

          The saying, "Lite is just one damn thing after another," is a gross understatement. The damn things overlap.

          JollyJ 1 Reply Last reply
          • George KG George K

            @Jolly said in Roe & Casey overturned.:

            I'm not sure he can do that.

            Garland will be all over that, right?

            JollyJ Offline
            JollyJ Offline
            Jolly
            wrote on last edited by
            #55

            @George-K said in Roe & Casey overturned.:

            @Jolly said in Roe & Casey overturned.:

            I'm not sure he can do that.

            Garland will be all over that, right?

            Shirley, you jest

            “Cry havoc and let slip the DOGE of war!”

            Those who cheered as J-6 American prisoners were locked in solitary for 18 months without trial, now suddenly fight tooth and nail for foreign terrorists’ "due process". — Buck Sexton

            George KG 1 Reply Last reply
            • JollyJ Jolly

              @George-K said in Roe & Casey overturned.:

              @Jolly said in Roe & Casey overturned.:

              I'm not sure he can do that.

              Garland will be all over that, right?

              Shirley, you jest

              George KG Offline
              George KG Offline
              George K
              wrote on last edited by
              #56

              @Jolly said in Roe & Casey overturned.:

              Shirley, you jest

              Under who's jurisdiction is the DoD?

              If a soldier commits a non-federal crime, like burglary, who prosecutes?

              "Now look here, you Baltic gas passer... " - Mik, 6/14/08

              The saying, "Lite is just one damn thing after another," is a gross understatement. The damn things overlap.

              1 Reply Last reply
              • HoraceH Online
                HoraceH Online
                Horace
                wrote on last edited by Horace
                #57

                The leftist indoctrination into righteous destruction of any and every conservative political principle continues unabated. And next time a conservative leaning miscreant entity gets naughty, it’ll be right back to terrifying existential threats to our very democracy.

                The magic of the human mind is that they don’t even recognize the double standard.

                Education is extremely important.

                1 Reply Last reply
                • George KG George K

                  Let that sink in. SecDef: We will not obey the law.

                  LuFins DadL Offline
                  LuFins DadL Offline
                  LuFins Dad
                  wrote on last edited by
                  #58

                  @George-K said in Roe & Casey overturned.:

                  Let that sink in. SecDef: We will not obey the law.

                  Insurrectiony!

                  Seriously, I imagine the military can continue to provide abortion services on their bases, no matter what that state’s laws may be. It’s Federal Property, kind of like how US Embassies in other countries are on US soil, technically.

                  The Brad

                  George KG 1 Reply Last reply
                  • CopperC Online
                    CopperC Online
                    Copper
                    wrote on last edited by
                    #59

                    Proudly killing babies since Mỹ Lai

                    1 Reply Last reply
                    • LuFins DadL LuFins Dad

                      @George-K said in Roe & Casey overturned.:

                      Let that sink in. SecDef: We will not obey the law.

                      Insurrectiony!

                      Seriously, I imagine the military can continue to provide abortion services on their bases, no matter what that state’s laws may be. It’s Federal Property, kind of like how US Embassies in other countries are on US soil, technically.

                      George KG Offline
                      George KG Offline
                      George K
                      wrote on last edited by George K
                      #60

                      @LuFins-Dad said in Roe & Casey overturned.:

                      I imagine the military can continue to provide abortion services on their bases, no matter what that state’s laws may be. It’s Federal Property

                      That's right. Now, what if birthing person has an abortion on non-military property? Will the military turn xer over to local law enforcement?

                      (Did I do that correctly by the way?)

                      "Now look here, you Baltic gas passer... " - Mik, 6/14/08

                      The saying, "Lite is just one damn thing after another," is a gross understatement. The damn things overlap.

                      LuFins DadL 1 Reply Last reply
                      • George KG George K

                        @LuFins-Dad said in Roe & Casey overturned.:

                        I imagine the military can continue to provide abortion services on their bases, no matter what that state’s laws may be. It’s Federal Property

                        That's right. Now, what if birthing person has an abortion on non-military property? Will the military turn xer over to local law enforcement?

                        (Did I do that correctly by the way?)

                        LuFins DadL Offline
                        LuFins DadL Offline
                        LuFins Dad
                        wrote on last edited by
                        #61

                        @George-K said in Roe & Casey overturned.:

                        @LuFins-Dad said in Roe & Casey overturned.:

                        I imagine the military can continue to provide abortion services on their bases, no matter what that state’s laws may be. It’s Federal Property

                        That's right. Now, what if birthing person has an abortion on non-military property? Will the military turn xer over to local law enforcement?

                        (Did I do that correctly by the way?)

                        If they are having an abortion, aren’t they the definition of non-birthing person?

                        The Brad

                        George KG 1 Reply Last reply
                        • LuFins DadL LuFins Dad

                          @George-K said in Roe & Casey overturned.:

                          @LuFins-Dad said in Roe & Casey overturned.:

                          I imagine the military can continue to provide abortion services on their bases, no matter what that state’s laws may be. It’s Federal Property

                          That's right. Now, what if birthing person has an abortion on non-military property? Will the military turn xer over to local law enforcement?

                          (Did I do that correctly by the way?)

                          If they are having an abortion, aren’t they the definition of non-birthing person?

                          George KG Offline
                          George KG Offline
                          George K
                          wrote on last edited by
                          #62

                          @LuFins-Dad said in Roe & Casey overturned.:

                          If they are having an abortion, aren’t they the definition of non-birthing person?

                          Don't make me post that "Scanners" exploding head gif...

                          "Now look here, you Baltic gas passer... " - Mik, 6/14/08

                          The saying, "Lite is just one damn thing after another," is a gross understatement. The damn things overlap.

                          1 Reply Last reply
                          • 89th8 Offline
                            89th8 Offline
                            89th
                            wrote on last edited by
                            #63

                            Mini vent here. I have a number of friends who have posted some variation of “this is taking away a woman’s control over her body!” complaint. It totally misses the mark…

                            Those that are pro-life (like me) fully support a woman’s right to control her body, of course…it’s only that we see the issue as a question of whether or not it should be legal to end a prenatal human life. To me it’s clearly more important to protect life than to protect an elective medical procedure. It’s about protecting unborn children, not about restricting a woman’s rights.

                            But the debate will never end because both sides see the issue differently. Can’t solve that. I agree @taiwan_girl this will eventually be reversed way down the road, but until then I think it’s very correct to leave this to each state to decide. It’s hard to think of a clearer example of a tough issue that is appropriate to legislate at the state level.

                            1 Reply Last reply
                            • KlausK Offline
                              KlausK Offline
                              Klaus
                              wrote on last edited by
                              #64

                              Maybe I'm missing something, but the way I understand the verdict, most protesters - from both sides - miss the point.

                              This was not a verdict about whether abortion is good or bad or whether it should be legal or not. It was about whether a right to abortion can be deduced from the constitution, or whether abortion rights (or lack thereof) have to be dealt with by law. Essentially, it's about whether there is a "natural right" to abortion, or whether it's something that the people decide, using the democratic process.

                              I do understand the practical consequences of the verdict, but it seems to me that one can agree (or disagree) with the verdict as both a "pro choicer" and a "pro lifer".

                              HoraceH George KG 2 Replies Last reply
                              • KlausK Klaus

                                Maybe I'm missing something, but the way I understand the verdict, most protesters - from both sides - miss the point.

                                This was not a verdict about whether abortion is good or bad or whether it should be legal or not. It was about whether a right to abortion can be deduced from the constitution, or whether abortion rights (or lack thereof) have to be dealt with by law. Essentially, it's about whether there is a "natural right" to abortion, or whether it's something that the people decide, using the democratic process.

                                I do understand the practical consequences of the verdict, but it seems to me that one can agree (or disagree) with the verdict as both a "pro choicer" and a "pro lifer".

                                HoraceH Online
                                HoraceH Online
                                Horace
                                wrote on last edited by
                                #65

                                @Klaus said in Roe & Casey overturned.:

                                Maybe I'm missing something, but the way I understand the verdict, most protesters - from both sides - miss the point.

                                This was not a verdict about whether abortion is good or bad or whether it should be legal or not. It was about whether a right to abortion can be deduced from the constitution, or whether abortion rights (or lack thereof) have to be dealt with by law. Essentially, it's about whether there is a "natural right" to abortion, or whether it's something that the people decide, using the democratic process.

                                I do understand the practical consequences of the verdict, but it seems to me that one can agree (or disagree) with the verdict as both a "pro choicer" and a "pro lifer".

                                Under no circumstance will constitutional logic interfere with culture war issues decided by the Supreme Court. If a case makes it to the Supreme Court, culture wars supersede the constitution. Just ask the justices. How else is one supposed to understand predictable differences in their votes? Different understandings of the constitution, or different present day opinions about how the law ought to be?

                                Education is extremely important.

                                1 Reply Last reply
                                • KlausK Klaus

                                  Maybe I'm missing something, but the way I understand the verdict, most protesters - from both sides - miss the point.

                                  This was not a verdict about whether abortion is good or bad or whether it should be legal or not. It was about whether a right to abortion can be deduced from the constitution, or whether abortion rights (or lack thereof) have to be dealt with by law. Essentially, it's about whether there is a "natural right" to abortion, or whether it's something that the people decide, using the democratic process.

                                  I do understand the practical consequences of the verdict, but it seems to me that one can agree (or disagree) with the verdict as both a "pro choicer" and a "pro lifer".

                                  George KG Offline
                                  George KG Offline
                                  George K
                                  wrote on last edited by
                                  #66

                                  @Klaus said in Roe & Casey overturned.:

                                  Essentially, it's about whether there is a "natural right" to abortion, or whether it's something that the people decide, using the democratic process.

                                  Close. But not quite. Congress can enact a law allowing abortion in any fashion, to any time up to delivery. Presumably, such a law would not be unconstitutional, because, as has been said, the word "abortion" doesn't appear in the constitution. The court's job is to interpret the law and determine the constitutionality of that law, not to determine whether the law is "good" or "bad." That job belongs to the legislature, and by extension, the people who select it.

                                  "Now look here, you Baltic gas passer... " - Mik, 6/14/08

                                  The saying, "Lite is just one damn thing after another," is a gross understatement. The damn things overlap.

                                  KlausK 1 Reply Last reply
                                  • jon-nycJ Online
                                    jon-nycJ Online
                                    jon-nyc
                                    wrote on last edited by
                                    #67

                                    Here’s his statement:

                                    Nothing is more important to me or to this Department than the health and well-being of our Service members, the civilian workforce and DOD families. I am committed to taking care of our people and ensuring the readiness and resilience of our Force. The Department is examining this decision closely and evaluating our policies to ensure we continue to provide seamless access to reproductive health care as permitted by federal law.

                                    Doesn’t seem that nefarious.

                                    Only non-witches get due process.

                                    • Cotton Mather, Salem Massachusetts, 1692
                                    George KG 1 Reply Last reply
                                    • jon-nycJ jon-nyc

                                      Here’s his statement:

                                      Nothing is more important to me or to this Department than the health and well-being of our Service members, the civilian workforce and DOD families. I am committed to taking care of our people and ensuring the readiness and resilience of our Force. The Department is examining this decision closely and evaluating our policies to ensure we continue to provide seamless access to reproductive health care as permitted by federal law.

                                      Doesn’t seem that nefarious.

                                      George KG Offline
                                      George KG Offline
                                      George K
                                      wrote on last edited by
                                      #68

                                      @jon-nyc said in Roe & Casey overturned.:

                                      Doesn’t seem that nefarious.

                                      The military doesn't cover abortion except in cases of rape, incest or threat to life of mother birthing person. Otherwise they must leave the base.

                                      https://www.azmirror.com/2022/06/23/access-to-abortion-for-members-of-the-military-expanded-in-pentagon-spending-bill/

                                      And, as has been stated there is no "federal law" about abortion - other than the Hyde amendment.

                                      "Now look here, you Baltic gas passer... " - Mik, 6/14/08

                                      The saying, "Lite is just one damn thing after another," is a gross understatement. The damn things overlap.

                                      1 Reply Last reply
                                      • jon-nycJ Online
                                        jon-nycJ Online
                                        jon-nyc
                                        wrote on last edited by
                                        #69

                                        Be that as it may, the actual statement doesn’t really indicate that they intend to ignore any laws.

                                        Only non-witches get due process.

                                        • Cotton Mather, Salem Massachusetts, 1692
                                        taiwan_girlT George KG LuFins DadL 3 Replies Last reply
                                        • jon-nycJ jon-nyc

                                          Be that as it may, the actual statement doesn’t really indicate that they intend to ignore any laws.

                                          taiwan_girlT Offline
                                          taiwan_girlT Offline
                                          taiwan_girl
                                          wrote on last edited by
                                          #70

                                          @jon-nyc said in Roe & Casey overturned.:

                                          Be that as it may, the actual statement doesn’t really indicate that they intend to ignore any laws.

                                          @George-K I have to agree with Jon. Seems like a headline that is imply way more than has been actually stated.

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