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The New Coffee Room

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  3. No Equality in America

No Equality in America

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  • R Offline
    R Offline
    Renauda
    wrote on 29 Jan 2021, 20:13 last edited by
    #12

    Phibes! Two minutes for using an historical reference to make your point.

    I hope a hockey analogy is considered inclusive in this den of iniquity.

    Elbows up!

    H 1 Reply Last reply 29 Jan 2021, 20:16
    • M Offline
      M Offline
      Mik
      wrote on 29 Jan 2021, 20:14 last edited by
      #13

      You mean hockey, the whitest game in the world?

      “I am fond of pigs. Dogs look up to us. Cats look down on us. Pigs treat us as equals.” ~Winston S. Churchill

      1 Reply Last reply
      • R Renauda
        29 Jan 2021, 20:13

        Phibes! Two minutes for using an historical reference to make your point.

        I hope a hockey analogy is considered inclusive in this den of iniquity.

        H Offline
        H Offline
        Horace
        wrote on 29 Jan 2021, 20:16 last edited by
        #14

        @renauda said in No Equality in America:

        Phibes! Two minutes for using an historical reference to make your point.

        I hope a hockey analogy is considered inclusive in this den of iniquity.

        If one wants to establish racism (specifically white-on-black racism) through history, be my guest shooting those fish in that barrel. But current america ain't that barrel. It's about social ideas. Not human nature.

        Education is extremely important.

        R 1 Reply Last reply 29 Jan 2021, 20:32
        • D Doctor Phibes
          29 Jan 2021, 19:56

          @lufins-dad said in No Equality in America:

          @doctor-phibes said in No Equality in America:

          If there's one thing that stands out about American history, and Western history in general, it's the total lack of winning experienced by white men, presumably due to the completely level playing field experienced by all.

          Meritocracy is a "white thing". As is (are? @Aqua-Letifer ) punctuality and work ethic. That's according to the National Museum of African American History and Culture.

          That explains why Glenn Miller made so much more money than Count Basie. He showed up on time. Obviously, his work ethic wasn't in question. Anybody with that level of talent is always going to work hard.

          L Offline
          L Offline
          LuFins Dad
          wrote on 29 Jan 2021, 20:18 last edited by
          #15

          @doctor-phibes said in No Equality in America:

          @lufins-dad said in No Equality in America:

          @doctor-phibes said in No Equality in America:

          If there's one thing that stands out about American history, and Western history in general, it's the total lack of winning experienced by white men, presumably due to the completely level playing field experienced by all.

          Meritocracy is a "white thing". As is (are? @Aqua-Letifer ) punctuality and work ethic. That's according to the National Museum of African American History and Culture.

          That explains why Glenn Miller made so much more money than Count Basie. He showed up on time. Obviously, his work ethic wasn't in question. Anybody with that level of talent is always going to work hard.

          I profess ignorance on the subject, which is why I am glad that I had the National Museum of African American History and Culture to instruct me on "Whiteness" and it's value system.

          The Brad

          1 Reply Last reply
          • H Horace
            29 Jan 2021, 20:05

            @doctor-phibes said in No Equality in America:

            Glenn Miller made so much more money than Count Basie

            Thanks for the reference from before any of us were born.

            I don't think we're unaware that racism has been a thing through human existence. We're trying pretty hard to counteract it these days, specifically in the west, and it's up to you to decide whether to give any credit for that whatsoever. There are plenty of countries left that really don't care what you think about it.

            D Offline
            D Offline
            Doctor Phibes
            wrote on 29 Jan 2021, 20:19 last edited by
            #16

            @horace said in No Equality in America:

            @doctor-phibes said in No Equality in America:

            Glenn Miller made so much more money than Count Basie

            Thanks for the reference from before any of us were born.

            I don't think we're unaware that racism has been a thing through human existence. We're trying pretty hard to counteract it these days, specifically in the west, and it's up to you to decide whether to give any credit for that whatsoever. There are plenty of countries left that really don't care what you think about it.

            I was just trying to provide a little light relief from the white guys complaining about how tough they have it.

            I was only joking

            H 1 Reply Last reply 29 Jan 2021, 20:19
            • D Doctor Phibes
              29 Jan 2021, 20:19

              @horace said in No Equality in America:

              @doctor-phibes said in No Equality in America:

              Glenn Miller made so much more money than Count Basie

              Thanks for the reference from before any of us were born.

              I don't think we're unaware that racism has been a thing through human existence. We're trying pretty hard to counteract it these days, specifically in the west, and it's up to you to decide whether to give any credit for that whatsoever. There are plenty of countries left that really don't care what you think about it.

              I was just trying to provide a little light relief from the white guys complaining about how tough they have it.

              H Offline
              H Offline
              Horace
              wrote on 29 Jan 2021, 20:19 last edited by
              #17

              @doctor-phibes said in No Equality in America:

              @horace said in No Equality in America:

              @doctor-phibes said in No Equality in America:

              Glenn Miller made so much more money than Count Basie

              Thanks for the reference from before any of us were born.

              I don't think we're unaware that racism has been a thing through human existence. We're trying pretty hard to counteract it these days, specifically in the west, and it's up to you to decide whether to give any credit for that whatsoever. There are plenty of countries left that really don't care what you think about it.

              I was just trying to provide a little light relief from the white guys complaining about how tough they have it.

              Which ones of us have ever done that again?

              Education is extremely important.

              1 Reply Last reply
              • H Horace
                29 Jan 2021, 20:16

                @renauda said in No Equality in America:

                Phibes! Two minutes for using an historical reference to make your point.

                I hope a hockey analogy is considered inclusive in this den of iniquity.

                If one wants to establish racism (specifically white-on-black racism) through history, be my guest shooting those fish in that barrel. But current america ain't that barrel. It's about social ideas. Not human nature.

                R Offline
                R Offline
                Renauda
                wrote on 29 Jan 2021, 20:32 last edited by Renauda
                #18

                @horace

                What has a hockey analogy got to do with social ideas? Plenty of systemic racism in all countries, not just in the USA. Not just limited to whites and blacks, but I imagine you already knew that.

                The truth is USA get first billing internationally because of what the country represents globally and how it wishes others to perceive it. It can no more shed itself of its past which defined people by race than Europe can shed itself of its past that defined people by their class and to a lesser extent, their religion.

                Elbows up!

                H 1 Reply Last reply 29 Jan 2021, 20:36
                • R Renauda
                  29 Jan 2021, 20:32

                  @horace

                  What has a hockey analogy got to do with social ideas? Plenty of systemic racism in all countries, not just in the USA. Not just limited to whites and blacks, but I imagine you already knew that.

                  The truth is USA get first billing internationally because of what the country represents globally and how it wishes others to perceive it. It can no more shed itself of its past which defined people by race than Europe can shed itself of its past that defined people by their class and to a lesser extent, their religion.

                  H Offline
                  H Offline
                  Horace
                  wrote on 29 Jan 2021, 20:36 last edited by
                  #19

                  @renauda said in No Equality in America:

                  @horace

                  What has a hockey analogy got to do with social ideas? Plenty of systemic racism in all countries, not just in the USA. Not just limited to whites and blacks, but I imagine you already knew that.

                  The truth is USA get first billing internationally because of what the country represents globally and how it wishes others to perceive it. It can no more shed itself of its past which defined people by race than Europe can shed itself its past that defined people by their class and to a lesser extent, their religion.

                  Yes, humans want to win. It's how we survive as individuals. I personally never lose sight of that, regardless of what other people tell me about their virtue.

                  Those who've already won and who have a bunkered winning position sometimes present themselves as our most virtuous. Those are the ones I have issue with, mostly.

                  Education is extremely important.

                  R 1 Reply Last reply 29 Jan 2021, 21:32
                  • L LuFins Dad
                    29 Jan 2021, 19:46

                    @doctor-phibes said in No Equality in America:

                    If there's one thing that stands out about American history, and Western history in general, it's the total lack of winning experienced by white men, presumably due to the completely level playing field experienced by all.

                    Meritocracy is a "white thing". As is (are? @Aqua-Letifer ) punctuality and work ethic. That's according to the National Museum of African American History and Culture.

                    A Offline
                    A Offline
                    Aqua Letifer
                    wrote on 29 Jan 2021, 20:56 last edited by
                    #20

                    @lufins-dad said in No Equality in America:

                    @doctor-phibes said in No Equality in America:

                    If there's one thing that stands out about American history, and Western history in general, it's the total lack of winning experienced by white men, presumably due to the completely level playing field experienced by all.

                    Meritocracy is a "white thing". As is (are? @Aqua-Letifer ) punctuality and work ethic. That's according to the National Museum of African American History and Culture.

                    As are, yeah.

                    Please love yourself.

                    1 Reply Last reply
                    • H Horace
                      29 Jan 2021, 20:36

                      @renauda said in No Equality in America:

                      @horace

                      What has a hockey analogy got to do with social ideas? Plenty of systemic racism in all countries, not just in the USA. Not just limited to whites and blacks, but I imagine you already knew that.

                      The truth is USA get first billing internationally because of what the country represents globally and how it wishes others to perceive it. It can no more shed itself of its past which defined people by race than Europe can shed itself its past that defined people by their class and to a lesser extent, their religion.

                      Yes, humans want to win. It's how we survive as individuals. I personally never lose sight of that, regardless of what other people tell me about their virtue.

                      Those who've already won and who have a bunkered winning position sometimes present themselves as our most virtuous. Those are the ones I have issue with, mostly.

                      R Offline
                      R Offline
                      Renauda
                      wrote on 29 Jan 2021, 21:32 last edited by
                      #21

                      @horace said in No Equality in America:

                      Those who've already won and who have a bunkered winning position sometimes present themselves as our most virtuous. Those are the ones I have issue with, mostly.

                      Okay although I am not sure what exactly you mean. Are you referring to wealthy elites with influence or simply members of the intelligentsia? In any case, what is the root of your issue with them? The fact that they might have influence in society? Acting above their respective station?

                      Elbows up!

                      H 1 Reply Last reply 29 Jan 2021, 21:39
                      • R Renauda
                        29 Jan 2021, 21:32

                        @horace said in No Equality in America:

                        Those who've already won and who have a bunkered winning position sometimes present themselves as our most virtuous. Those are the ones I have issue with, mostly.

                        Okay although I am not sure what exactly you mean. Are you referring to wealthy elites with influence or simply members of the intelligentsia? In any case, what is the root of your issue with them? The fact that they might have influence in society? Acting above their respective station?

                        H Offline
                        H Offline
                        Horace
                        wrote on 29 Jan 2021, 21:39 last edited by
                        #22

                        @renauda said in No Equality in America:

                        @horace said in No Equality in America:

                        Those who've already won and who have a bunkered winning position sometimes present themselves as our most virtuous. Those are the ones I have issue with, mostly.

                        Okay although I am not sure what exactly you mean. Are you referring to wealthy elites with influence or simply members of the intelligentsia? In any case, what is the root of your issue with them? The fact that they might have influence in society? Acting above their respective station?

                        I have never liked the idea that one could say they are virtuous, caring for the disadvantaged, after realizing they will never have to care about themselves in that way.

                        Education is extremely important.

                        R 1 Reply Last reply 29 Jan 2021, 22:19
                        • H Horace
                          29 Jan 2021, 21:39

                          @renauda said in No Equality in America:

                          @horace said in No Equality in America:

                          Those who've already won and who have a bunkered winning position sometimes present themselves as our most virtuous. Those are the ones I have issue with, mostly.

                          Okay although I am not sure what exactly you mean. Are you referring to wealthy elites with influence or simply members of the intelligentsia? In any case, what is the root of your issue with them? The fact that they might have influence in society? Acting above their respective station?

                          I have never liked the idea that one could say they are virtuous, caring for the disadvantaged, after realizing they will never have to care about themselves in that way.

                          R Offline
                          R Offline
                          Renauda
                          wrote on 29 Jan 2021, 22:19 last edited by
                          #23

                          @horace Still doesn't answer my question. Who considers themselves virtuous? Philanthropists? Elites? Educated people? Ordinary folks who do volunteer work for specific causes and charities?

                          Elbows up!

                          H 1 Reply Last reply 29 Jan 2021, 22:19
                          • R Renauda
                            29 Jan 2021, 22:19

                            @horace Still doesn't answer my question. Who considers themselves virtuous? Philanthropists? Elites? Educated people? Ordinary folks who do volunteer work for specific causes and charities?

                            H Offline
                            H Offline
                            Horace
                            wrote on 29 Jan 2021, 22:19 last edited by
                            #24

                            @renauda said in No Equality in America:

                            @horace Still doesn't answer my question. Who considers themselves virtuous? Philanthropists? Elites? Educated people? Ordinary folks who do volunteer work for specific causes and charities?

                            That's a good question. I can't answer it, it's not logical, only preceptional.

                            Education is extremely important.

                            R 1 Reply Last reply 29 Jan 2021, 22:21
                            • H Horace
                              29 Jan 2021, 22:19

                              @renauda said in No Equality in America:

                              @horace Still doesn't answer my question. Who considers themselves virtuous? Philanthropists? Elites? Educated people? Ordinary folks who do volunteer work for specific causes and charities?

                              That's a good question. I can't answer it, it's not logical, only preceptional.

                              R Offline
                              R Offline
                              Renauda
                              wrote on 29 Jan 2021, 22:21 last edited by
                              #25

                              @horace Fair enough.

                              Elbows up!

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