No Equality in America
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@lufins-dad said in No Equality in America:
@doctor-phibes said in No Equality in America:
If there's one thing that stands out about American history, and Western history in general, it's the total lack of winning experienced by white men, presumably due to the completely level playing field experienced by all.
Meritocracy is a "white thing". As is (are? @Aqua-Letifer ) punctuality and work ethic. That's according to the National Museum of African American History and Culture.
That explains why Glenn Miller made so much more money than Count Basie. He showed up on time. Obviously, his work ethic wasn't in question. Anybody with that level of talent is always going to work hard.
wrote on 29 Jan 2021, 20:00 last edited byThis post is deleted! -
@lufins-dad said in No Equality in America:
@doctor-phibes said in No Equality in America:
If there's one thing that stands out about American history, and Western history in general, it's the total lack of winning experienced by white men, presumably due to the completely level playing field experienced by all.
Meritocracy is a "white thing". As is (are? @Aqua-Letifer ) punctuality and work ethic. That's according to the National Museum of African American History and Culture.
That explains why Glenn Miller made so much more money than Count Basie. He showed up on time. Obviously, his work ethic wasn't in question. Anybody with that level of talent is always going to work hard.
wrote on 29 Jan 2021, 20:05 last edited by Horace@doctor-phibes said in No Equality in America:
Glenn Miller made so much more money than Count Basie
Thanks for the reference from before any of us were born.
I don't think we're unaware that racism has been a thing through human existence. We're trying pretty hard to counteract it these days, specifically in the west, and it's up to you to decide whether to give any credit for that whatsoever. There are plenty of countries left that really don't care what you think about it.
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wrote on 29 Jan 2021, 20:13 last edited by
Phibes! Two minutes for using an historical reference to make your point.
I hope a hockey analogy is considered inclusive in this den of iniquity.
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wrote on 29 Jan 2021, 20:14 last edited by
You mean hockey, the whitest game in the world?
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Phibes! Two minutes for using an historical reference to make your point.
I hope a hockey analogy is considered inclusive in this den of iniquity.
wrote on 29 Jan 2021, 20:16 last edited by@renauda said in No Equality in America:
Phibes! Two minutes for using an historical reference to make your point.
I hope a hockey analogy is considered inclusive in this den of iniquity.
If one wants to establish racism (specifically white-on-black racism) through history, be my guest shooting those fish in that barrel. But current america ain't that barrel. It's about social ideas. Not human nature.
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@lufins-dad said in No Equality in America:
@doctor-phibes said in No Equality in America:
If there's one thing that stands out about American history, and Western history in general, it's the total lack of winning experienced by white men, presumably due to the completely level playing field experienced by all.
Meritocracy is a "white thing". As is (are? @Aqua-Letifer ) punctuality and work ethic. That's according to the National Museum of African American History and Culture.
That explains why Glenn Miller made so much more money than Count Basie. He showed up on time. Obviously, his work ethic wasn't in question. Anybody with that level of talent is always going to work hard.
wrote on 29 Jan 2021, 20:18 last edited by@doctor-phibes said in No Equality in America:
@lufins-dad said in No Equality in America:
@doctor-phibes said in No Equality in America:
If there's one thing that stands out about American history, and Western history in general, it's the total lack of winning experienced by white men, presumably due to the completely level playing field experienced by all.
Meritocracy is a "white thing". As is (are? @Aqua-Letifer ) punctuality and work ethic. That's according to the National Museum of African American History and Culture.
That explains why Glenn Miller made so much more money than Count Basie. He showed up on time. Obviously, his work ethic wasn't in question. Anybody with that level of talent is always going to work hard.
I profess ignorance on the subject, which is why I am glad that I had the National Museum of African American History and Culture to instruct me on "Whiteness" and it's value system.
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@doctor-phibes said in No Equality in America:
Glenn Miller made so much more money than Count Basie
Thanks for the reference from before any of us were born.
I don't think we're unaware that racism has been a thing through human existence. We're trying pretty hard to counteract it these days, specifically in the west, and it's up to you to decide whether to give any credit for that whatsoever. There are plenty of countries left that really don't care what you think about it.
wrote on 29 Jan 2021, 20:19 last edited by@horace said in No Equality in America:
@doctor-phibes said in No Equality in America:
Glenn Miller made so much more money than Count Basie
Thanks for the reference from before any of us were born.
I don't think we're unaware that racism has been a thing through human existence. We're trying pretty hard to counteract it these days, specifically in the west, and it's up to you to decide whether to give any credit for that whatsoever. There are plenty of countries left that really don't care what you think about it.
I was just trying to provide a little light relief from the white guys complaining about how tough they have it.
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@horace said in No Equality in America:
@doctor-phibes said in No Equality in America:
Glenn Miller made so much more money than Count Basie
Thanks for the reference from before any of us were born.
I don't think we're unaware that racism has been a thing through human existence. We're trying pretty hard to counteract it these days, specifically in the west, and it's up to you to decide whether to give any credit for that whatsoever. There are plenty of countries left that really don't care what you think about it.
I was just trying to provide a little light relief from the white guys complaining about how tough they have it.
wrote on 29 Jan 2021, 20:19 last edited by@doctor-phibes said in No Equality in America:
@horace said in No Equality in America:
@doctor-phibes said in No Equality in America:
Glenn Miller made so much more money than Count Basie
Thanks for the reference from before any of us were born.
I don't think we're unaware that racism has been a thing through human existence. We're trying pretty hard to counteract it these days, specifically in the west, and it's up to you to decide whether to give any credit for that whatsoever. There are plenty of countries left that really don't care what you think about it.
I was just trying to provide a little light relief from the white guys complaining about how tough they have it.
Which ones of us have ever done that again?
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@renauda said in No Equality in America:
Phibes! Two minutes for using an historical reference to make your point.
I hope a hockey analogy is considered inclusive in this den of iniquity.
If one wants to establish racism (specifically white-on-black racism) through history, be my guest shooting those fish in that barrel. But current america ain't that barrel. It's about social ideas. Not human nature.
wrote on 29 Jan 2021, 20:32 last edited by RenaudaWhat has a hockey analogy got to do with social ideas? Plenty of systemic racism in all countries, not just in the USA. Not just limited to whites and blacks, but I imagine you already knew that.
The truth is USA get first billing internationally because of what the country represents globally and how it wishes others to perceive it. It can no more shed itself of its past which defined people by race than Europe can shed itself of its past that defined people by their class and to a lesser extent, their religion.
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What has a hockey analogy got to do with social ideas? Plenty of systemic racism in all countries, not just in the USA. Not just limited to whites and blacks, but I imagine you already knew that.
The truth is USA get first billing internationally because of what the country represents globally and how it wishes others to perceive it. It can no more shed itself of its past which defined people by race than Europe can shed itself of its past that defined people by their class and to a lesser extent, their religion.
wrote on 29 Jan 2021, 20:36 last edited by@renauda said in No Equality in America:
What has a hockey analogy got to do with social ideas? Plenty of systemic racism in all countries, not just in the USA. Not just limited to whites and blacks, but I imagine you already knew that.
The truth is USA get first billing internationally because of what the country represents globally and how it wishes others to perceive it. It can no more shed itself of its past which defined people by race than Europe can shed itself its past that defined people by their class and to a lesser extent, their religion.
Yes, humans want to win. It's how we survive as individuals. I personally never lose sight of that, regardless of what other people tell me about their virtue.
Those who've already won and who have a bunkered winning position sometimes present themselves as our most virtuous. Those are the ones I have issue with, mostly.
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@doctor-phibes said in No Equality in America:
If there's one thing that stands out about American history, and Western history in general, it's the total lack of winning experienced by white men, presumably due to the completely level playing field experienced by all.
Meritocracy is a "white thing". As is (are? @Aqua-Letifer ) punctuality and work ethic. That's according to the National Museum of African American History and Culture.
wrote on 29 Jan 2021, 20:56 last edited by@lufins-dad said in No Equality in America:
@doctor-phibes said in No Equality in America:
If there's one thing that stands out about American history, and Western history in general, it's the total lack of winning experienced by white men, presumably due to the completely level playing field experienced by all.
Meritocracy is a "white thing". As is (are? @Aqua-Letifer ) punctuality and work ethic. That's according to the National Museum of African American History and Culture.
As are, yeah.
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@renauda said in No Equality in America:
What has a hockey analogy got to do with social ideas? Plenty of systemic racism in all countries, not just in the USA. Not just limited to whites and blacks, but I imagine you already knew that.
The truth is USA get first billing internationally because of what the country represents globally and how it wishes others to perceive it. It can no more shed itself of its past which defined people by race than Europe can shed itself its past that defined people by their class and to a lesser extent, their religion.
Yes, humans want to win. It's how we survive as individuals. I personally never lose sight of that, regardless of what other people tell me about their virtue.
Those who've already won and who have a bunkered winning position sometimes present themselves as our most virtuous. Those are the ones I have issue with, mostly.
wrote on 29 Jan 2021, 21:32 last edited by@horace said in No Equality in America:
Those who've already won and who have a bunkered winning position sometimes present themselves as our most virtuous. Those are the ones I have issue with, mostly.
Okay although I am not sure what exactly you mean. Are you referring to wealthy elites with influence or simply members of the intelligentsia? In any case, what is the root of your issue with them? The fact that they might have influence in society? Acting above their respective station?
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@horace said in No Equality in America:
Those who've already won and who have a bunkered winning position sometimes present themselves as our most virtuous. Those are the ones I have issue with, mostly.
Okay although I am not sure what exactly you mean. Are you referring to wealthy elites with influence or simply members of the intelligentsia? In any case, what is the root of your issue with them? The fact that they might have influence in society? Acting above their respective station?
wrote on 29 Jan 2021, 21:39 last edited by@renauda said in No Equality in America:
@horace said in No Equality in America:
Those who've already won and who have a bunkered winning position sometimes present themselves as our most virtuous. Those are the ones I have issue with, mostly.
Okay although I am not sure what exactly you mean. Are you referring to wealthy elites with influence or simply members of the intelligentsia? In any case, what is the root of your issue with them? The fact that they might have influence in society? Acting above their respective station?
I have never liked the idea that one could say they are virtuous, caring for the disadvantaged, after realizing they will never have to care about themselves in that way.
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@renauda said in No Equality in America:
@horace said in No Equality in America:
Those who've already won and who have a bunkered winning position sometimes present themselves as our most virtuous. Those are the ones I have issue with, mostly.
Okay although I am not sure what exactly you mean. Are you referring to wealthy elites with influence or simply members of the intelligentsia? In any case, what is the root of your issue with them? The fact that they might have influence in society? Acting above their respective station?
I have never liked the idea that one could say they are virtuous, caring for the disadvantaged, after realizing they will never have to care about themselves in that way.
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@horace Still doesn't answer my question. Who considers themselves virtuous? Philanthropists? Elites? Educated people? Ordinary folks who do volunteer work for specific causes and charities?
wrote on 29 Jan 2021, 22:19 last edited by@renauda said in No Equality in America:
@horace Still doesn't answer my question. Who considers themselves virtuous? Philanthropists? Elites? Educated people? Ordinary folks who do volunteer work for specific causes and charities?
That's a good question. I can't answer it, it's not logical, only preceptional.
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@renauda said in No Equality in America:
@horace Still doesn't answer my question. Who considers themselves virtuous? Philanthropists? Elites? Educated people? Ordinary folks who do volunteer work for specific causes and charities?
That's a good question. I can't answer it, it's not logical, only preceptional.