Living In Fear
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@taiwan_girl said in Living In Fear:
@Jolly said in Living In Fear:
@taiwan_girl said in Living In Fear:
@Jolly said in Living In Fear:
You shouldn't fly.
You can be exposed to COVID, flying in a pressurized metal tube with strangers.
Why would you risk death?
Because I wear a mask 100% of the time, wear gloves while flying. I practice social distancing.
Words are great, but actions also speak loud. Do you really think that President Trump, by his actions, has set a good example in doing things regarding proper precautions?
Everything ain't about Trump. This is about you.
We both know that no mask is 100% effective. I suspect your glove technique does not equal a trained healthcare provider. There is no way to practice social distancing on an airplane. Most airports have lapses continually in social distancing. And some people are able to spread a virus twenty feet, not six.
Your clothes? Those are contaminated, too. Not to mention your eyes...One of the best experts in infectious disease experts in the U.S. was infected with COVID, most likely through eye exposure. So, I hope you wear form fitting goggles.
Words are great, but actions speak louder than words, AIR? If so, then you have made a conscious and calculated decision to weigh the risks and get on with your life.
Thank you for proving my point.
I think we proved each other point. So, it was a win-win.
There is a risk in everything we do, from driving a car, to crossing a busy street, to living while there is the COVID crisis. We do what we can to minimize the risk.
Imagine two social influencers; Jennifer A and Jennifer B. Both have millions of followers on social media, and for good or bad, people "listen" to them and are influenced by them.
Both take a plane ride
Jennifer A gets on the plane,
- not wearing a mask, no gloves, no glasses/goggles.
- She tries to "high five" other passengers,
- encourages them to crowd together to get a selfie with her,
- rubs her hands along the top luggage boxes
- and for good measure, when she gets to her seat, she drops down the tray and gives it a lick.
- meanwhile she is posting all this on her accounts
Jennifer B gets on the plane
- wearing a mask, gloves and glasses
- walks quickly to her seat
- makes no contact with other passengers
- sits in her seat the whole flight, never taking off her mask, gloves ,etc.
- after the flight, she posts to all her accounts, explaining what she did and why it was best to do it this way
Both took the same flight. Who minimized the risk better? Who set the better example?
All I am saying is that risks can be minimized. Do it smartly and lead by example.
As an FYI, Thailand is a country of 66 million people (about 20% of US). There have been a total of 60 deaths from COVID.
Actually, you haven't made much of a point. Unless you are willing to commit to force, you cannot enforce compliance from other people.
Are you ready to take that step?
Always remember, Operation Valkyrie was an act of sedition.
Warning: I post things that interest me. Read and comment at your own discretion. -
@Jolly said in Living In Fear:
@taiwan_girl said in Living In Fear:
@Jolly said in Living In Fear:
@taiwan_girl said in Living In Fear:
@Jolly said in Living In Fear:
You shouldn't fly.
You can be exposed to COVID, flying in a pressurized metal tube with strangers.
Why would you risk death?
Because I wear a mask 100% of the time, wear gloves while flying. I practice social distancing.
Words are great, but actions also speak loud. Do you really think that President Trump, by his actions, has set a good example in doing things regarding proper precautions?
Everything ain't about Trump. This is about you.
We both know that no mask is 100% effective. I suspect your glove technique does not equal a trained healthcare provider. There is no way to practice social distancing on an airplane. Most airports have lapses continually in social distancing. And some people are able to spread a virus twenty feet, not six.
Your clothes? Those are contaminated, too. Not to mention your eyes...One of the best experts in infectious disease experts in the U.S. was infected with COVID, most likely through eye exposure. So, I hope you wear form fitting goggles.
Words are great, but actions speak louder than words, AIR? If so, then you have made a conscious and calculated decision to weigh the risks and get on with your life.
Thank you for proving my point.
I think we proved each other point. So, it was a win-win.
There is a risk in everything we do, from driving a car, to crossing a busy street, to living while there is the COVID crisis. We do what we can to minimize the risk.
Imagine two social influencers; Jennifer A and Jennifer B. Both have millions of followers on social media, and for good or bad, people "listen" to them and are influenced by them.
Both take a plane ride
Jennifer A gets on the plane,
- not wearing a mask, no gloves, no glasses/goggles.
- She tries to "high five" other passengers,
- encourages them to crowd together to get a selfie with her,
- rubs her hands along the top luggage boxes
- and for good measure, when she gets to her seat, she drops down the tray and gives it a lick.
- meanwhile she is posting all this on her accounts
Jennifer B gets on the plane
- wearing a mask, gloves and glasses
- walks quickly to her seat
- makes no contact with other passengers
- sits in her seat the whole flight, never taking off her mask, gloves ,etc.
- after the flight, she posts to all her accounts, explaining what she did and why it was best to do it this way
Both took the same flight. Who minimized the risk better? Who set the better example?
All I am saying is that risks can be minimized. Do it smartly and lead by example.
As an FYI, Thailand is a country of 66 million people (about 20% of US). There have been a total of 60 deaths from COVID.
Actually, you haven't made much of a point. Unless you are willing to commit to force, you cannot enforce compliance from other people.
Are you ready to take that step?
I am not ready.
But, a leader can lead by example, do you at least agree with that?
It is a very thin line that President Trump has to do with teh virus. I do not envy him at all. On one hand, he needs to make sure that it does not get out of hand. On the other, he cannot create so much fear that everyone shelters in place for the rest of their life.
I just do not think he has found the proper middle ground. Period. I think that there are/were some very minor things he could have promoted that would have helped. (My opinion) is that he could have taken some minor steps which would have helped.
It is impossible to prove a negative, so for me to say that if he would have from the beginning promoted mask wearing, things would be so much better in the US cannot be said. I think it would have.
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@Jolly said in Living In Fear:
@taiwan_girl said in Living In Fear:
@Jolly said in Living In Fear:
@taiwan_girl said in Living In Fear:
@Jolly said in Living In Fear:
You shouldn't fly.
You can be exposed to COVID, flying in a pressurized metal tube with strangers.
Why would you risk death?
Because I wear a mask 100% of the time, wear gloves while flying. I practice social distancing.
Words are great, but actions also speak loud. Do you really think that President Trump, by his actions, has set a good example in doing things regarding proper precautions?
Everything ain't about Trump. This is about you.
We both know that no mask is 100% effective. I suspect your glove technique does not equal a trained healthcare provider. There is no way to practice social distancing on an airplane. Most airports have lapses continually in social distancing. And some people are able to spread a virus twenty feet, not six.
Your clothes? Those are contaminated, too. Not to mention your eyes...One of the best experts in infectious disease experts in the U.S. was infected with COVID, most likely through eye exposure. So, I hope you wear form fitting goggles.
Words are great, but actions speak louder than words, AIR? If so, then you have made a conscious and calculated decision to weigh the risks and get on with your life.
Thank you for proving my point.
I think we proved each other point. So, it was a win-win.
There is a risk in everything we do, from driving a car, to crossing a busy street, to living while there is the COVID crisis. We do what we can to minimize the risk.
Imagine two social influencers; Jennifer A and Jennifer B. Both have millions of followers on social media, and for good or bad, people "listen" to them and are influenced by them.
Both take a plane ride
Jennifer A gets on the plane,
- not wearing a mask, no gloves, no glasses/goggles.
- She tries to "high five" other passengers,
- encourages them to crowd together to get a selfie with her,
- rubs her hands along the top luggage boxes
- and for good measure, when she gets to her seat, she drops down the tray and gives it a lick.
- meanwhile she is posting all this on her accounts
Jennifer B gets on the plane
- wearing a mask, gloves and glasses
- walks quickly to her seat
- makes no contact with other passengers
- sits in her seat the whole flight, never taking off her mask, gloves ,etc.
- after the flight, she posts to all her accounts, explaining what she did and why it was best to do it this way
Both took the same flight. Who minimized the risk better? Who set the better example?
All I am saying is that risks can be minimized. Do it smartly and lead by example.
As an FYI, Thailand is a country of 66 million people (about 20% of US). There have been a total of 60 deaths from COVID.
Actually, you haven't made much of a point. Unless you are willing to commit to force, you cannot enforce compliance from other people.
Are you ready to take that step?
We could all get on with our lives better if we didn't have to bicker so much about compliance for others. It's nicer to drive when others follow the rules of the road.
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Personally I can't really muster a shit what anyone thinks of my own safety measures. Fucking hell, go back to playing neighborhood I Spy with HOA violations, Karen.
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Here too, Aqua. We do what we think makes sense for us. It's a balancing act. It's going to be tough not going out to eat once the weather gets cold, but today it is beautiful. I'm smoking a whole local chicken, cooking the last of the local corn and having a friend over for dinner on the deck.
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I haven't flown since March, and it's been a big deal for me for a number of reasons. I walk the dog and cycle without a mask as I can socially distance, I wear a mask when I go shopping. I work from home.
I'm not scared, but I'm pretty cautious. I must admit it did piss me off when a neighbour last weekend had this massive party - there were 17 cars parked up the street, and an obnoxious amount of noise. Nobody I could see was wearing a mask.
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I think all of our lives would be better if we agreed what a simple "new normal" looked like until this somehow resolves.
For example, I'm completely comfortable going into places that enforce masks and social distancing.
I think there would be more economic activity if people reliably did the basics, and left everything else up to chance.
It's like a nudist who wears clothes in public. It doesn't matter if the nudist doesn't believe in clothes - sometimes you just have to do the minimum to make everyone else feel comfortable.
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@taiwan_girl said in Living In Fear:
@Jolly said in Living In Fear:
@taiwan_girl said in Living In Fear:
@Jolly said in Living In Fear:
@taiwan_girl said in Living In Fear:
@Jolly said in Living In Fear:
You shouldn't fly.
You can be exposed to COVID, flying in a pressurized metal tube with strangers.
Why would you risk death?
Because I wear a mask 100% of the time, wear gloves while flying. I practice social distancing.
Words are great, but actions also speak loud. Do you really think that President Trump, by his actions, has set a good example in doing things regarding proper precautions?
Everything ain't about Trump. This is about you.
We both know that no mask is 100% effective. I suspect your glove technique does not equal a trained healthcare provider. There is no way to practice social distancing on an airplane. Most airports have lapses continually in social distancing. And some people are able to spread a virus twenty feet, not six.
Your clothes? Those are contaminated, too. Not to mention your eyes...One of the best experts in infectious disease experts in the U.S. was infected with COVID, most likely through eye exposure. So, I hope you wear form fitting goggles.
Words are great, but actions speak louder than words, AIR? If so, then you have made a conscious and calculated decision to weigh the risks and get on with your life.
Thank you for proving my point.
I think we proved each other point. So, it was a win-win.
There is a risk in everything we do, from driving a car, to crossing a busy street, to living while there is the COVID crisis. We do what we can to minimize the risk.
Imagine two social influencers; Jennifer A and Jennifer B. Both have millions of followers on social media, and for good or bad, people "listen" to them and are influenced by them.
Both take a plane ride
Jennifer A gets on the plane,
- not wearing a mask, no gloves, no glasses/goggles.
- She tries to "high five" other passengers,
- encourages them to crowd together to get a selfie with her,
- rubs her hands along the top luggage boxes
- and for good measure, when she gets to her seat, she drops down the tray and gives it a lick.
- meanwhile she is posting all this on her accounts
Jennifer B gets on the plane
- wearing a mask, gloves and glasses
- walks quickly to her seat
- makes no contact with other passengers
- sits in her seat the whole flight, never taking off her mask, gloves ,etc.
- after the flight, she posts to all her accounts, explaining what she did and why it was best to do it this way
Both took the same flight. Who minimized the risk better? Who set the better example?
All I am saying is that risks can be minimized. Do it smartly and lead by example.
As an FYI, Thailand is a country of 66 million people (about 20% of US). There have been a total of 60 deaths from COVID.
Actually, you haven't made much of a point. Unless you are willing to commit to force, you cannot enforce compliance from other people.
Are you ready to take that step?
I am not ready.
But, a leader can lead by example, do you at least agree with that?
It is a very thin line that President Trump has to do with teh virus. I do not envy him at all. On one hand, he needs to make sure that it does not get out of hand. On the other, he cannot create so much fear that everyone shelters in place for the rest of their life.
I just do not think he has found the proper middle ground. Period. I think that there are/were some very minor things he could have promoted that would have helped. (My opinion) is that he could have taken some minor steps which would have helped.
It is impossible to prove a negative, so for me to say that if he would have from the beginning promoted mask wearing, things would be so much better in the US cannot be said. I think it would have.
Here's the deal, Lucille.
The country cannot stay closed. If it does, our economy suffers permanent damage. All these Zoom warriors and work-from-home folks will be wondering about their rent or mortgage payments with the rest of the poor working schlubs.
In a nutshell, that's what the President is getting at...The country cannot live in fear, it must get back to work. Yes, there are mitigation steps people should probably follow. Trump did not tell people to run around without a mask or to not socially distance themselves.
But as I said in a previous post, unless you want to commit to violence to enforce those rules, everybody will not comply. Virus or no virus, ask yourself what kind of country you wish to live in?
Furthermore, something misunderstood about the President, is his approach to the pandemic. He looks at this as the states and the feds having some clearly defined roles. He'd hectored some governors he thought may have not done what he thought was proper, but has never tried to override a governor's authority that I know of.
So, get your panties out of a wad and understand that Trump had no nefarious message other than COVID can be beaten and is not to be irrationally feared.
Look, I only work part-time, but I haven't missed a scheduled day of work since this crap started. I have comorbidities, maybe enough to kill me. And unlike most of you, I'm sometimes in full PPE swabbing suspected COVID patients or working with an infected patient for a difficult venipuncture or art stick. Take what precautions you can, but go live your life. God never promises you tomorrow on this old rock. He does promise you that he will be with you alway and that ought to be good enough.
Do not live in fear.
Always remember, Operation Valkyrie was an act of sedition.
Warning: I post things that interest me. Read and comment at your own discretion. -
@Jolly said in Living In Fear:
Do not live in fear.
How do you define that? By anyone who's doing more than you are?
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Personally, I think an abundance of caution isn't a bad thing.
Sitting in a house with 35 other people getting drunk on a Saturday night doesn't seem like a smart move to me.
Then again, I can't abide house parties at the best of time. My small talk generally offends about 75% of any given room.
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@LuFins-Dad said in Living In Fear:
Appropriate for the thread, I had a store employee show up on Sunday not feeling great. Sent him home immediately. One of the other employees that worked with him on Saturday immediately started having panic attacks and I home. That evening he sent out an email announcing that he has a 103 degree fever. You would have thought it was the end of the world. The employee having panic attacks nearly had to be hospitalized and has had 2 different tests (despite my reminding that person that they needed to wait 4-5 days before there would be enough time for any infection to grow enough to show up on a test) and nearly everyone has been in a panic.
Out of an abundance of caution, I shut down the store for three days and have repeatedly had to intervene with other employees panic attacks. I have even had to remind people about HIPAA requirements and it’s generally been 72 hours of hell.
As it turns out, the guy had a 24 hour bug, all tests have come back negative, there has been no symptoms or fever since Sunday.
So tell me which impacted my life and livelihood more this week, the virus or fear of the virus?
This panic has to stop.
Man has a point.
Rebuttal, anyone?
Always remember, Operation Valkyrie was an act of sedition.
Warning: I post things that interest me. Read and comment at your own discretion. -
@Jolly said in Living In Fear:
@LuFins-Dad said in Living In Fear:
Appropriate for the thread, I had a store employee show up on Sunday not feeling great. Sent him home immediately. One of the other employees that worked with him on Saturday immediately started having panic attacks and I home. That evening he sent out an email announcing that he has a 103 degree fever. You would have thought it was the end of the world. The employee having panic attacks nearly had to be hospitalized and has had 2 different tests (despite my reminding that person that they needed to wait 4-5 days before there would be enough time for any infection to grow enough to show up on a test) and nearly everyone has been in a panic.
Out of an abundance of caution, I shut down the store for three days and have repeatedly had to intervene with other employees panic attacks. I have even had to remind people about HIPAA requirements and it’s generally been 72 hours of hell.
As it turns out, the guy had a 24 hour bug, all tests have come back negative, there has been no symptoms or fever since Sunday.
So tell me which impacted my life and livelihood more this week, the virus or fear of the virus?
This panic has to stop.
Man has a point.
Rebuttal, anyone?
The employee that worked with the sick guy (the panicky guy) - would you have wanted him to come in contact with you before you knew original sick guy (103 fever dude) didn't have Covid?
Now - the panic attacks obviously seems a bit much, and sucks for him - but you wouldn't have done anything different without the drama, correct? (Except not deal with drama)
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@Jolly said in Living In Fear:
Man has a point.
Rebuttal, anyone?I already asked you how you define "living in fear." No one here advocates for that idea, it's stupid. The problem is a definition discrepancy, not a disagreement of ideals.
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Some people have a lot of ideals in their definition.
What is your definition?
Always remember, Operation Valkyrie was an act of sedition.
Warning: I post things that interest me. Read and comment at your own discretion. -
@Jolly said in Living In Fear:
Some people have a lot of ideals in their definition.
What is your definition?
You're the one with the sermon, I think the onus is on you to tell us what you mean.
But yeah okay, sure, why not: there's a difference between making accommodations to keep your family safe from a pandemic, and letting the pandemic define your life for you. In other words, your life's meaning shouldn't be altered by the pandemic. That would be living in fear. So, don't do that.
As for how that shakes out in terms of particulars, everyone's got their own values and what they're trying to do with themselves, so interpretation needs to be up to the individual.
And also, look, on top of that, wear a mask and wash your damn hands. It can only help.
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Now - the panic attacks obviously seems a bit much, and sucks for him - but you wouldn't have done anything different without the drama, correct? (Except not deal with drama)
Dealing with the drama became the job for three days. Being closed for three days is no big deal. Most of my work is done over the phone and by email these days. I could have-should have been just fine working from home. Instead, most of that time was unproductive. Not just for me, but for the rest of the staff as well.
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BTW, Ronna McDaniel (RNC Chair) is giving her first interview since coming down with COVID. She got it from a family member.
That's how a lot of people get it.
Always remember, Operation Valkyrie was an act of sedition.
Warning: I post things that interest me. Read and comment at your own discretion. -
@Jolly said in Living In Fear:
BTW, Ronna McDaniel (RNC Chair) is giving her first interview since coming down with COVID. She got it from a family member.
That's how a lot of people get it.
Which is why we're keeping our distance from family members who swear up and down they're staying safe while they continue to work in bars, unmasked, and event arenas, unmasked. If that's living in fear I don't give a shit, find someone else to browbeat because I'm not changing my decision.
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@LuFins-Dad said in Living In Fear:
I have even had to remind people about HIPAA requirements and it’s generally been 72 hours of hell.
None of you are subject to HIPPA laws. That's one less thing to fear.
