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The New Coffee Room

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  3. Trumpenomics

Trumpenomics

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  • L Offline
    L Offline
    LuFins Dad
    wrote on 16 Apr 2025, 15:09 last edited by
    #688

    Bernie, AOC, and Elizabeth Warren have to be concerned as hell right now… The entire country is freaking out and turning against the pro-labor policies that they’ve always advocated for.

    The Brad

    A J 2 Replies Last reply 16 Apr 2025, 16:16
    • H Horace
      16 Apr 2025, 13:57

      His economic mistakes are classically leftist, I think (though the dichotomy probably breaks down). Hopefully the backlash will be towards more capitalism and free markets. Generally, one worries that backlash against Trump will be too far to the left, but this is setting up to be a backlash towards an appreciation of free markets.

      If the party of free markets going forward is the Democrats, so be it, I'll be voting Democrat. But a free market GOP would be preferable.

      D Offline
      D Offline
      Doctor Phibes
      wrote on 16 Apr 2025, 15:11 last edited by Doctor Phibes
      #689

      @Horace said in Trumpenomics:

      His economic mistakes are classically leftist, I think (though the dichotomy probably breaks down). Hopefully the backlash will be towards more capitalism and free markets. Generally, one worries that backlash against Trump will be too far to the left, but this is setting up to be a backlash towards an appreciation of free markets.

      The right-left divide seems to be breaking down. It's all about Trump for both detractors and supporters. People who claim to be conservative are backing protectionism and government intervention, and obviously everybody who is left of center hates his guts so they won't support anything he does.

      I was only joking

      R 1 Reply Last reply 16 Apr 2025, 16:24
      • L LuFins Dad
        16 Apr 2025, 15:09

        Bernie, AOC, and Elizabeth Warren have to be concerned as hell right now… The entire country is freaking out and turning against the pro-labor policies that they’ve always advocated for.

        A Away
        A Away
        Axtremus
        wrote on 16 Apr 2025, 16:16 last edited by
        #690

        @LuFins-Dad said in Trumpenomics:

        The entire country is freaking out and turning against the pro-labor policies that they’ve always advocated for.

        Huh? What are you talking about?

        L 1 Reply Last reply 16 Apr 2025, 18:25
        • D Doctor Phibes
          16 Apr 2025, 15:11

          @Horace said in Trumpenomics:

          His economic mistakes are classically leftist, I think (though the dichotomy probably breaks down). Hopefully the backlash will be towards more capitalism and free markets. Generally, one worries that backlash against Trump will be too far to the left, but this is setting up to be a backlash towards an appreciation of free markets.

          The right-left divide seems to be breaking down. It's all about Trump for both detractors and supporters. People who claim to be conservative are backing protectionism and government intervention, and obviously everybody who is left of center hates his guts so they won't support anything he does.

          R Offline
          R Offline
          Renauda
          wrote on 16 Apr 2025, 16:24 last edited by Renauda
          #691

          @Doctor-Phibes

          Yesterday TomK described Trump as a postmodern icon in this post:

          https://nodebb.the-new-coffee-room.club/post/337049

          I pursued Tom’s statement a bit further and found this article discussing that view. I don’t think it is off the mark. In fact it seems to be a common feature and we see it repeated time and again from Trump cultists.

          For Trump, facts are primarily what one feels is, or should be, true. And what one feels is completely subjective.

          https://thecritic.co.uk/trump-post-modernist/

          Elbows up!

          1 Reply Last reply
          • L LuFins Dad
            16 Apr 2025, 15:09

            Bernie, AOC, and Elizabeth Warren have to be concerned as hell right now… The entire country is freaking out and turning against the pro-labor policies that they’ve always advocated for.

            J Offline
            J Offline
            jon-nyc
            wrote on 16 Apr 2025, 18:00 last edited by
            #692

            @LuFins-Dad said in Trumpenomics:

            Bernie, AOC, and Elizabeth Warren have to be concerned as hell right now… The entire country is freaking out and turning against the pro-labor policies that they’ve always advocated for.

            Win-win, IOW.

            Only non-witches get due process.

            • Cotton Mather, Salem Massachusetts, 1692
            1 Reply Last reply
            • A Axtremus
              16 Apr 2025, 16:16

              @LuFins-Dad said in Trumpenomics:

              The entire country is freaking out and turning against the pro-labor policies that they’ve always advocated for.

              Huh? What are you talking about?

              L Offline
              L Offline
              LuFins Dad
              wrote on 16 Apr 2025, 18:25 last edited by
              #693

              @Axtremus said in Trumpenomics:

              @LuFins-Dad said in Trumpenomics:

              The entire country is freaking out and turning against the pro-labor policies that they’ve always advocated for.

              Huh? What are you talking about?

              Protectionism, high tariffs, limited trade, government intervention in the free markets… these are all traditional positions of the “progressive” left and have traditionally been at odds with conservatives.

              The Brad

              1 Reply Last reply
              • 8 Offline
                8 Offline
                89th
                wrote on 16 Apr 2025, 19:47 last edited by
                #694

                The term paleoconservative (is new to me) but certainly is a deviation from traditional and/or neoconservatives.

                Anyway, the market is absolutely ripe for a moderate to come in that is fiscally conservative, moderately social, judiciously conservative, free market, pragmatic regulations, good at communications, and restores respect/honesty to the office.... would this be a new political party, or will one just pounce on the opportunity? I'd imagine the left will find someone reasonable (not AOC, not bernie, not gavin....well maybe gavin) that tries to fit into that moderate mold that'll win over the country, at least enough to win office. Oh... and if they can shore up some of the latino vote, then we might see them in power for a while.

                Trump is absolutely shooting the GOP in the foot, per Mik's note about 2026 earlier...

                L D J 3 Replies Last reply 16 Apr 2025, 20:00
                • 8 89th
                  16 Apr 2025, 19:47

                  The term paleoconservative (is new to me) but certainly is a deviation from traditional and/or neoconservatives.

                  Anyway, the market is absolutely ripe for a moderate to come in that is fiscally conservative, moderately social, judiciously conservative, free market, pragmatic regulations, good at communications, and restores respect/honesty to the office.... would this be a new political party, or will one just pounce on the opportunity? I'd imagine the left will find someone reasonable (not AOC, not bernie, not gavin....well maybe gavin) that tries to fit into that moderate mold that'll win over the country, at least enough to win office. Oh... and if they can shore up some of the latino vote, then we might see them in power for a while.

                  Trump is absolutely shooting the GOP in the foot, per Mik's note about 2026 earlier...

                  L Offline
                  L Offline
                  LuFins Dad
                  wrote on 16 Apr 2025, 20:00 last edited by
                  #695

                  @89th said in Trumpenomics:

                  I'd imagine the left will find someone reasonable (not AOC, not bernie, not gavin....well maybe gavin) that tries to fit into that moderate mold that'll win over the country, at least enough to win office. Oh... and if they can shore up some of the latino vote, then we might see them in power for a while.

                  Wrong. AOC is absolutely winning the polling right now.

                  The Brad

                  1 Reply Last reply
                  • 8 89th
                    16 Apr 2025, 19:47

                    The term paleoconservative (is new to me) but certainly is a deviation from traditional and/or neoconservatives.

                    Anyway, the market is absolutely ripe for a moderate to come in that is fiscally conservative, moderately social, judiciously conservative, free market, pragmatic regulations, good at communications, and restores respect/honesty to the office.... would this be a new political party, or will one just pounce on the opportunity? I'd imagine the left will find someone reasonable (not AOC, not bernie, not gavin....well maybe gavin) that tries to fit into that moderate mold that'll win over the country, at least enough to win office. Oh... and if they can shore up some of the latino vote, then we might see them in power for a while.

                    Trump is absolutely shooting the GOP in the foot, per Mik's note about 2026 earlier...

                    D Offline
                    D Offline
                    Doctor Phibes
                    wrote on 16 Apr 2025, 21:21 last edited by
                    #696

                    @89th said in Trumpenomics:

                    Trump is absolutely shooting the GOP in the foot, per Mik's note about 2026 earlier...

                    The question is, does he really give a shit?

                    I was only joking

                    1 Reply Last reply
                    • 8 89th
                      16 Apr 2025, 19:47

                      The term paleoconservative (is new to me) but certainly is a deviation from traditional and/or neoconservatives.

                      Anyway, the market is absolutely ripe for a moderate to come in that is fiscally conservative, moderately social, judiciously conservative, free market, pragmatic regulations, good at communications, and restores respect/honesty to the office.... would this be a new political party, or will one just pounce on the opportunity? I'd imagine the left will find someone reasonable (not AOC, not bernie, not gavin....well maybe gavin) that tries to fit into that moderate mold that'll win over the country, at least enough to win office. Oh... and if they can shore up some of the latino vote, then we might see them in power for a while.

                      Trump is absolutely shooting the GOP in the foot, per Mik's note about 2026 earlier...

                      J Offline
                      J Offline
                      Jolly
                      wrote on 17 Apr 2025, 02:04 last edited by
                      #697

                      @89th said in Trumpenomics:

                      The term paleoconservative (is new to me) but certainly is a deviation from traditional and/or neoconservatives.

                      Anyway, the market is absolutely ripe for a moderate to come in that is fiscally conservative, moderately social, judiciously conservative, free market, pragmatic regulations, good at communications, and restores respect/honesty to the office.... would this be a new political party, or will one just pounce on the opportunity? I'd imagine the left will find someone reasonable (not AOC, not bernie, not gavin....well maybe gavin) that tries to fit into that moderate mold that'll win over the country, at least enough to win office. Oh... and if they can shore up some of the latino vote, then we might see them in power for a while.

                      Trump is absolutely shooting the GOP in the foot, per Mik's note about 2026 earlier...

                      Generic question: Is what is good for the stock market the same thing as what is good for the country?

                      “Cry havoc and let slip the DOGE of war!”

                      Those who cheered as J-6 American prisoners were locked in solitary for 18 months without trial, now suddenly fight tooth and nail for foreign terrorists’ "due process". — Buck Sexton

                      H J 2 Replies Last reply 17 Apr 2025, 02:15
                      • J Jolly
                        17 Apr 2025, 02:04

                        @89th said in Trumpenomics:

                        The term paleoconservative (is new to me) but certainly is a deviation from traditional and/or neoconservatives.

                        Anyway, the market is absolutely ripe for a moderate to come in that is fiscally conservative, moderately social, judiciously conservative, free market, pragmatic regulations, good at communications, and restores respect/honesty to the office.... would this be a new political party, or will one just pounce on the opportunity? I'd imagine the left will find someone reasonable (not AOC, not bernie, not gavin....well maybe gavin) that tries to fit into that moderate mold that'll win over the country, at least enough to win office. Oh... and if they can shore up some of the latino vote, then we might see them in power for a while.

                        Trump is absolutely shooting the GOP in the foot, per Mik's note about 2026 earlier...

                        Generic question: Is what is good for the stock market the same thing as what is good for the country?

                        H Offline
                        H Offline
                        Horace
                        wrote on 17 Apr 2025, 02:15 last edited by
                        #698

                        @Jolly said in Trumpenomics:

                        @89th said in Trumpenomics:

                        The term paleoconservative (is new to me) but certainly is a deviation from traditional and/or neoconservatives.

                        Anyway, the market is absolutely ripe for a moderate to come in that is fiscally conservative, moderately social, judiciously conservative, free market, pragmatic regulations, good at communications, and restores respect/honesty to the office.... would this be a new political party, or will one just pounce on the opportunity? I'd imagine the left will find someone reasonable (not AOC, not bernie, not gavin....well maybe gavin) that tries to fit into that moderate mold that'll win over the country, at least enough to win office. Oh... and if they can shore up some of the latino vote, then we might see them in power for a while.

                        Trump is absolutely shooting the GOP in the foot, per Mik's note about 2026 earlier...

                        Generic question: Is what is good for the stock market the same thing as what is good for the country?

                        I don't think that's the way 89th used the word "market".

                        But the answer to the question is pretty close to "yes". It gives everybody with some income and ability to save, the opportunity to participate in the miracle of compound interest. That way lies the American dream, and there is no more accessible path to it.

                        How do you suppose Dave Ramsey would answer that question?

                        I am sure we can all stipulate that the stock market does not matter to people who do not save for their futures, and that they are people too, and that their lives matter. Maybe Trump's plans will be good for them, but then you'd be up against the difficult task of explaining how.

                        Education is extremely important.

                        1 Reply Last reply
                        • J Offline
                          J Offline
                          Jolly
                          wrote on 17 Apr 2025, 02:21 last edited by
                          #699

                          Enjoy!

                          When Lindell goes under, 1600 Americans lose their jobs.

                          “Cry havoc and let slip the DOGE of war!”

                          Those who cheered as J-6 American prisoners were locked in solitary for 18 months without trial, now suddenly fight tooth and nail for foreign terrorists’ "due process". — Buck Sexton

                          1 Reply Last reply
                          • J Jolly
                            17 Apr 2025, 02:04

                            @89th said in Trumpenomics:

                            The term paleoconservative (is new to me) but certainly is a deviation from traditional and/or neoconservatives.

                            Anyway, the market is absolutely ripe for a moderate to come in that is fiscally conservative, moderately social, judiciously conservative, free market, pragmatic regulations, good at communications, and restores respect/honesty to the office.... would this be a new political party, or will one just pounce on the opportunity? I'd imagine the left will find someone reasonable (not AOC, not bernie, not gavin....well maybe gavin) that tries to fit into that moderate mold that'll win over the country, at least enough to win office. Oh... and if they can shore up some of the latino vote, then we might see them in power for a while.

                            Trump is absolutely shooting the GOP in the foot, per Mik's note about 2026 earlier...

                            Generic question: Is what is good for the stock market the same thing as what is good for the country?

                            J Offline
                            J Offline
                            jon-nyc
                            wrote on 17 Apr 2025, 07:22 last edited by
                            #700

                            @Jolly said in Trumpenomics:

                            @89th said in Trumpenomics:

                            The term paleoconservative (is new to me) but certainly is a deviation from traditional and/or neoconservatives.

                            Anyway, the market is absolutely ripe for a moderate to come in that is fiscally conservative, moderately social, judiciously conservative, free market, pragmatic regulations, good at communications, and restores respect/honesty to the office.... would this be a new political party, or will one just pounce on the opportunity? I'd imagine the left will find someone reasonable (not AOC, not bernie, not gavin....well maybe gavin) that tries to fit into that moderate mold that'll win over the country, at least enough to win office. Oh... and if they can shore up some of the latino vote, then we might see them in power for a while.

                            Trump is absolutely shooting the GOP in the foot, per Mik's note about 2026 earlier...

                            Generic question: Is what is good for the stock market the same thing as what is good for the country?

                            This is true even the minority of the country with no direct exposure to the market. The market is a measure of health of the companies that employ a lot of people who may not own any stock.

                            Only non-witches get due process.

                            • Cotton Mather, Salem Massachusetts, 1692
                            1 Reply Last reply
                            • J Offline
                              J Offline
                              Jolly
                              wrote on 17 Apr 2025, 11:52 last edited by
                              #701

                              Was WW2 good or bad for the U.S.?

                              “Cry havoc and let slip the DOGE of war!”

                              Those who cheered as J-6 American prisoners were locked in solitary for 18 months without trial, now suddenly fight tooth and nail for foreign terrorists’ "due process". — Buck Sexton

                              1 Reply Last reply
                              • D Offline
                                D Offline
                                Doctor Phibes
                                wrote on 17 Apr 2025, 12:24 last edited by Doctor Phibes
                                #702

                                Too soon to tell.

                                Was the War of Western Aggression Independence good or bad for the U.S.?

                                I was only joking

                                J 1 Reply Last reply 17 Apr 2025, 12:50
                                • D Doctor Phibes
                                  17 Apr 2025, 12:24

                                  Too soon to tell.

                                  Was the War of Western Aggression Independence good or bad for the U.S.?

                                  J Offline
                                  J Offline
                                  Jolly
                                  wrote on 17 Apr 2025, 12:50 last edited by
                                  #703

                                  @Doctor-Phibes said in Trumpenomics:

                                  Too soon to tell.

                                  Was the War of Western Aggression Independence good or bad for the U.S.?

                                  Was there an American stock market at the time?

                                  “Cry havoc and let slip the DOGE of war!”

                                  Those who cheered as J-6 American prisoners were locked in solitary for 18 months without trial, now suddenly fight tooth and nail for foreign terrorists’ "due process". — Buck Sexton

                                  H 1 Reply Last reply 17 Apr 2025, 13:19
                                  • J Offline
                                    J Offline
                                    jon-nyc
                                    wrote on 17 Apr 2025, 12:57 last edited by
                                    #704

                                    Not until 1792.

                                    Only non-witches get due process.

                                    • Cotton Mather, Salem Massachusetts, 1692
                                    1 Reply Last reply
                                    • J Jolly
                                      17 Apr 2025, 12:50

                                      @Doctor-Phibes said in Trumpenomics:

                                      Too soon to tell.

                                      Was the War of Western Aggression Independence good or bad for the U.S.?

                                      Was there an American stock market at the time?

                                      H Offline
                                      H Offline
                                      Horace
                                      wrote on 17 Apr 2025, 13:19 last edited by
                                      #705

                                      @Jolly said in Trumpenomics:

                                      @Doctor-Phibes said in Trumpenomics:

                                      Too soon to tell.

                                      Was the War of Western Aggression Independence good or bad for the U.S.?

                                      Was there an American stock market at the time?

                                      Part of your lore here is that second career you had helping indigents with financial stuff, and all of that surely involved the stock market. But now you're a newborn babe when it comes to questions about whether the stock market actually matters to real America.

                                      Education is extremely important.

                                      D 1 Reply Last reply 17 Apr 2025, 13:27
                                      • H Horace
                                        17 Apr 2025, 13:19

                                        @Jolly said in Trumpenomics:

                                        @Doctor-Phibes said in Trumpenomics:

                                        Too soon to tell.

                                        Was the War of Western Aggression Independence good or bad for the U.S.?

                                        Was there an American stock market at the time?

                                        Part of your lore here is that second career you had helping indigents with financial stuff, and all of that surely involved the stock market. But now you're a newborn babe when it comes to questions about whether the stock market actually matters to real America.

                                        D Offline
                                        D Offline
                                        Doctor Phibes
                                        wrote on 17 Apr 2025, 13:27 last edited by Doctor Phibes
                                        #706

                                        @Horace said in Trumpenomics:

                                        @Jolly said in Trumpenomics:

                                        @Doctor-Phibes said in Trumpenomics:

                                        Too soon to tell.

                                        Was the War of Western Aggression Independence good or bad for the U.S.?

                                        Was there an American stock market at the time?

                                        Part of your lore here is that second career you had helping indigents with financial stuff, and all of that surely involved the stock market. But now you're a newborn babe when it comes to questions about whether the stock market actually matters to real America.

                                        Honestly, is that even a serious question? Does anybody ask whether a highway network is good for the U.S. because after all things were so much better back in the Victorian age?

                                        Obviously, the only reason we're hearing the question is because of who's crashed the market. If it was a Democrat, it would be a completely different story.

                                        I was only joking

                                        1 Reply Last reply
                                        • J Offline
                                          J Offline
                                          Jolly
                                          wrote on 17 Apr 2025, 13:57 last edited by Jolly
                                          #707

                                          Just musing...The market (Dow) was losing money in the prelude to WW2 (approx 1938) and actually fell below those levels in 1942. It did not return to the 1939 level, until 1947. Starting in the 1950's, people made money in the market, with a bit of a dip in the 58 recession.

                                          My point is that WW2 was good for America, despite the loss and carnage of war at a size never seen before. America emerged as the Leader of the Free World, the war lifted thousands out of poverty and enlarged the middle class, advanced civil rights and the war set off an economic boom and a baby boom.

                                          So, you have the juxtaposition of a market that really did not like WW2, but the war on many levels had a positive effect upon the country.

                                          “Cry havoc and let slip the DOGE of war!”

                                          Those who cheered as J-6 American prisoners were locked in solitary for 18 months without trial, now suddenly fight tooth and nail for foreign terrorists’ "due process". — Buck Sexton

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