Dead Black Males
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wrote on 11 Aug 2020, 14:50 last edited by Mik 8 Nov 2020, 14:52
Can you name any of those contributions? I'm having a hard time thinking of much of anything outside of music. The other thing to consider is that a lot of the attitudes toward women, minorities and gays are still present in current American black culture. It has been somewhat moderated but it is still there.
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Like a lot of articles that are written from the "fringe side", there are some points that "may" be okay, but other things that are so false, it ruins the whole story.
Below is an example of a ridiculous statement:
"..........those dead black males made no practical contribution to the general welfare and betterment of the human race and left behind virtually nothing of significance in any area of human endeavor. "
That kind of ruins anything else in the story.
wrote on 11 Aug 2020, 15:40 last edited by Larry 8 Nov 2020, 16:07@taiwan_girl said in Dead Black Males:
Like a lot of articles that are written from the "fringe side", there are some points that "may" be okay, but other things that are so false, it ruins the whole story.
Below is an example of a ridiculous statement:
"..........those dead black males made no practical contribution to the general welfare and betterment of the human race and left behind virtually nothing of significance in any area of human endeavor. "
That kind of ruins anything else in the story.
I don't think you've grasped the point he is making. He is applying the same standard to "dead black men" that is being applied by many today to "Dead white men". It is supposed to sound offensive. Just as offensive as applying a one size fits all standard to "dead white men". The point he made by saying that, had you understood it, is by no means false.
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wrote on 11 Aug 2020, 15:48 last edited by
Yep.
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Can you name any of those contributions? I'm having a hard time thinking of much of anything outside of music. The other thing to consider is that a lot of the attitudes toward women, minorities and gays are still present in current American black culture. It has been somewhat moderated but it is still there.
wrote on 11 Aug 2020, 15:59 last edited by@Mik said in Dead Black Males:
Can you name any of those contributions? I'm having a hard time thinking of much of anything outside of music.
Well, c'mon.
That's pretty damn big.The other thing to consider is that a lot of the attitudes toward women, minorities and gays are still present in current American black culture. It has been somewhat moderated but it is still there.
Legit point. Good luck bringing that one up, though.
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Can you name any of those contributions? I'm having a hard time thinking of much of anything outside of music. The other thing to consider is that a lot of the attitudes toward women, minorities and gays are still present in current American black culture. It has been somewhat moderated but it is still there.
wrote on 11 Aug 2020, 16:24 last edited by@Mik The way it was written seems to "devalue" an entire society of people. I do not think it is fair to say that.
That would be like saying to me:
"Jennifer, your grandfather made no practical contribution to the general welfare of society and betterment of the human race and left behind virtually nothing of significance in any area of human endeavor."
I would be offended and not very happy if someone said that or wrote that, and I imagine you would feel the same way (maybe not about my grandfather, but about yours. LOL)
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wrote on 11 Aug 2020, 16:38 last edited by
You continue to miss the point. What do you think is happening when we are preached to on the evil of western culture?
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wrote on 11 Aug 2020, 16:39 last edited by
The progress of western civilization is largely due to our political advancements which allowed for our economic advancements which led to our technological advancements. Without the political part of it we'd still all be stuck in what would seem uncivilized times. I bet Xenon has some good thoughts on this sort of thing.
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@Mik The way it was written seems to "devalue" an entire society of people. I do not think it is fair to say that.
That would be like saying to me:
"Jennifer, your grandfather made no practical contribution to the general welfare of society and betterment of the human race and left behind virtually nothing of significance in any area of human endeavor."
I would be offended and not very happy if someone said that or wrote that, and I imagine you would feel the same way (maybe not about my grandfather, but about yours. LOL)
wrote on 11 Aug 2020, 17:09 last edited by@taiwan_girl said in Dead Black Males:
@Mik The way it was written seems to "devalue" an entire society of people. I do not think it is fair to say that.
Societies suck. All societies. The more people contributing, the worse it gets.
Individuals are pretty cool, though. Some are even amazing.
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wrote on 11 Aug 2020, 17:12 last edited by Doctor Phibes 8 Nov 2020, 17:12
@Jolly said in Dead Black Males:
I think the author is Czech. He doesn't know any better...
Central and Eastern Europeans have a different group of atrocities they don't like to talk about. Some of them, in Poland for example, it's actually illegal to talk about.
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wrote on 11 Aug 2020, 17:30 last edited by
Aside from the atrocity of just being Polacks?
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You continue to miss the point. What do you think is happening when we are preached to on the evil of western culture?
wrote on 12 Aug 2020, 01:10 last edited by@Mik said in Dead Black Males:
You continue to miss the point. What do you think is happening when we are preached to on the evil of western culture?
Then the author missed his point with me. Lol
That is not what I understood from the article
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The progress of western civilization is largely due to our political advancements which allowed for our economic advancements which led to our technological advancements. Without the political part of it we'd still all be stuck in what would seem uncivilized times. I bet Xenon has some good thoughts on this sort of thing.
wrote on 12 Aug 2020, 01:43 last edited by@Horace said in Dead Black Males:
The progress of western civilization is largely due to our political advancements which allowed for our economic advancements which led to our technological advancements. Without the political part of it we'd still all be stuck in what would seem uncivilized times. I bet Xenon has some good thoughts on this sort of thing.
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wrote on 12 Aug 2020, 01:58 last edited by
Horace said, "The progress of western civilization is largely due to our political advancements which allowed for our economic advancements which led to our technological advancements."
That's very interesting, and I don't think you were being sarcastic.
I would be interested in how you came to decide the taxonomy or hierarchy, or maybe simply cause-effect.I would have listed technological advancements first (e.g., telescope), then political, then economic.
There's also a good chance I was reading more or less than you intended. But you do tend to state things which I find very interesting to contemplate. It just depends on whether you were being trite, or very serious I guess.
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@Horace said in Dead Black Males:
The progress of western civilization is largely due to our political advancements which allowed for our economic advancements which led to our technological advancements. Without the political part of it we'd still all be stuck in what would seem uncivilized times. I bet Xenon has some good thoughts on this sort of thing.
wrote on 12 Aug 2020, 02:09 last edited by@xenon said in Dead Black Males:
@Horace said in Dead Black Males:
The progress of western civilization is largely due to our political advancements which allowed for our economic advancements which led to our technological advancements. Without the political part of it we'd still all be stuck in what would seem uncivilized times. I bet Xenon has some good thoughts on this sort of thing.
I wasn't being sarcastic, it seems like the sort of thing you'd have some well developed thoughts about.
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Horace said, "The progress of western civilization is largely due to our political advancements which allowed for our economic advancements which led to our technological advancements."
That's very interesting, and I don't think you were being sarcastic.
I would be interested in how you came to decide the taxonomy or hierarchy, or maybe simply cause-effect.I would have listed technological advancements first (e.g., telescope), then political, then economic.
There's also a good chance I was reading more or less than you intended. But you do tend to state things which I find very interesting to contemplate. It just depends on whether you were being trite, or very serious I guess.
wrote on 12 Aug 2020, 02:12 last edited by@Rainman said in Dead Black Males:
Horace said, "The progress of western civilization is largely due to our political advancements which allowed for our economic advancements which led to our technological advancements."
That's very interesting, and I don't think you were being sarcastic.
I would be interested in how you came to decide the taxonomy or hierarchy, or maybe simply cause-effect.I would have listed technological advancements first (e.g., telescope), then political, then economic.
There's also a good chance I was reading more or less than you intended. But you do tend to state things which I find very interesting to contemplate. It just depends on whether you were being trite, or very serious I guess.
I'm sure it's a big stew of causality but it would seem that meritocratic markets, allowed for by politics, are a necessary precondition to the explosion of efficiency technology has given us.
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@Mik said in Dead Black Males:
You continue to miss the point. What do you think is happening when we are preached to on the evil of western culture?
Then the author missed his point with me. Lol
That is not what I understood from the article
wrote on 12 Aug 2020, 02:14 last edited by@taiwan_girl said in Dead Black Males:
@Mik said in Dead Black Males:
You continue to miss the point. What do you think is happening when we are preached to on the evil of western culture?
Then the author missed his point with me. Lol
That is not what I understood from the article
Why would you blame the author for something that was your fault?
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wrote on 12 Aug 2020, 02:30 last edited by
Here we go again, talking about the Bible.
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@xenon said in Dead Black Males:
@Horace said in Dead Black Males:
The progress of western civilization is largely due to our political advancements which allowed for our economic advancements which led to our technological advancements. Without the political part of it we'd still all be stuck in what would seem uncivilized times. I bet Xenon has some good thoughts on this sort of thing.
I wasn't being sarcastic, it seems like the sort of thing you'd have some well developed thoughts about.
wrote on 12 Aug 2020, 13:09 last edited by jon-nyc 8 Dec 2020, 13:10@Horace said in Dead Black Males:
@xenon said in Dead Black Males:
@Horace said in Dead Black Males:
The progress of western civilization is largely due to our political advancements which allowed for our economic advancements which led to our technological advancements. Without the political part of it we'd still all be stuck in what would seem uncivilized times. I bet Xenon has some good thoughts on this sort of thing.
I wasn't being sarcastic, it seems like the sort of thing you'd have some well developed thoughts about.
Note however he neither confirmed nor denied the charge of assholery.
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@Rainman said in Dead Black Males:
Horace said, "The progress of western civilization is largely due to our political advancements which allowed for our economic advancements which led to our technological advancements."
That's very interesting, and I don't think you were being sarcastic.
I would be interested in how you came to decide the taxonomy or hierarchy, or maybe simply cause-effect.I would have listed technological advancements first (e.g., telescope), then political, then economic.
There's also a good chance I was reading more or less than you intended. But you do tend to state things which I find very interesting to contemplate. It just depends on whether you were being trite, or very serious I guess.
I'm sure it's a big stew of causality but it would seem that meritocratic markets, allowed for by politics, are a necessary precondition to the explosion of efficiency technology has given us.
wrote on 12 Aug 2020, 17:23 last edited by@Horace said in Dead Black Males:
@Rainman said in Dead Black Males:
Horace said, "The progress of western civilization is largely due to our political advancements which allowed for our economic advancements which led to our technological advancements."
That's very interesting, and I don't think you were being sarcastic.
I would be interested in how you came to decide the taxonomy or hierarchy, or maybe simply cause-effect.I would have listed technological advancements first (e.g., telescope), then political, then economic.
There's also a good chance I was reading more or less than you intended. But you do tend to state things which I find very interesting to contemplate. It just depends on whether you were being trite, or very serious I guess.
I'm sure it's a big stew of causality but it would seem that meritocratic markets, allowed for by politics, are a necessary precondition to the explosion of efficiency technology has given us.
My first thought was that the causality was reversed. Technological->Economic->political (as in let's say planting seeds/agriculture->surplus food->administration/stratification of society.
But it keeps going around in circles. Having a stratified society and administration is the precondition for more complicated inventions to come about.
While economic and technological progress can be rapid, politics takes time to develop.
As for the race and gender of who drove the progress? That's a bit of an asinine discussion. I guess it's interesting that almost all human societies decided to organize themselves primarily as a patriarchy up until very recently. That's not a white thing.
As for white - white countries invented industrialization and the constructs of a modern government first. So the people who specifically invented them were white. That's not much of an insight or a remarkable thing to say.