Trump fine GoFundMe
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So, if someone kills someone with a fly swatter and that has never been done before, should the person still be prosecuted?
@taiwan_girl said in Trump fine GoFundMe:
So, if someone kills someone with a fly swatter and that has never been done before, should the person still be prosecuted?
The analogy would be if fly swatter killings were not uncommon, but never prosecuted until now.
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There is a first for everything. LOL. Again, if you broke the law and it has not been prosecuted before doesn't make you less guilty.
(I should say that I do not know the details of this cases whether he should have been found guilty of not. But the excuse that nobody else has been prosecuted for this is pretty week in my opinion. I have in the recent past there was a first time prosecution for crypto currency fraud. Claiming that you are innocent because others have been doing crypto currency fraud but not prosecuted........
Kind of like when the IRS prosecutes some high profile celebrity on a tax charge that "everybody is doing".)
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There is a first for everything. LOL. Again, if you broke the law and it has not been prosecuted before doesn't make you less guilty.
(I should say that I do not know the details of this cases whether he should have been found guilty of not. But the excuse that nobody else has been prosecuted for this is pretty week in my opinion. I have in the recent past there was a first time prosecution for crypto currency fraud. Claiming that you are innocent because others have been doing crypto currency fraud but not prosecuted........
Kind of like when the IRS prosecutes some high profile celebrity on a tax charge that "everybody is doing".)
@taiwan_girl said in Trump fine GoFundMe:
There is a first for everything. LOL. Again, if you broke the law and it has not been prosecuted before doesn't make you less guilty.
(I should say that I do not know the details of this cases whether he should have been found guilty of not. But the excuse that nobody else has been prosecuted for this is pretty week in my opinion. I have in the recent past there was a first time prosecution for crypto currency fraud. Claiming that you are innocent because others have been doing crypto currency fraud but not prosecuted........
Kind of like when the IRS prosecutes some high profile celebrity on a tax charge that "everybody is doing".)
Give me a week and intense scrutiny, and a good prosecutor could put you in jail.
And you might well be guilty. Of something.
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Probably . But usually prosecutors will try to get the most "bang for buck", targeting someone who will give them the maximum publicity and exposure.
I am guessing that this case may cause others to think again before giving a false value of real estate.
Was that the reason here? No - I am sure it was political, but it may have the consequence of stopping others from doing the same thing.
As I mentioned above, like the IRS going after people. Lets say I knowingly do an illegal tax "write off". Everybody is doing it. Will the IRS come after me (or you) or go after celebrity XX? Even though they did not come after me, I would probably think again before doing the tax write-off
(For example, this just came up)
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Probably . But usually prosecutors will try to get the most "bang for buck", targeting someone who will give them the maximum publicity and exposure.
I am guessing that this case may cause others to think again before giving a false value of real estate.
Was that the reason here? No - I am sure it was political, but it may have the consequence of stopping others from doing the same thing.
As I mentioned above, like the IRS going after people. Lets say I knowingly do an illegal tax "write off". Everybody is doing it. Will the IRS come after me (or you) or go after celebrity XX? Even though they did not come after me, I would probably think again before doing the tax write-off
(For example, this just came up)
@taiwan_girl said in Trump fine GoFundMe:
Probably . But usually prosecutors will try to get the most "bang for buck", targeting someone who will give them the maximum publicity and exposure.
I am guessing that this case may cause others to think again before giving a false value of real estate.
Was that the reason here? No - I am sure it was political, but it may have the consequence of stopping others from doing the same thing.
As I mentioned above, like the IRS going after people. Lets say I knowingly do an illegal tax "write off". Everybody is doing it. Will the IRS come after me (or you) or go after celebrity XX? Even though they did not come after me, I would probably think again before doing the tax write-off
(For example, this just came up)
So it's your contention that Trump is being targeted because he's famous, and in turn, that's because this is the best way for those targeting him, to cut down on false reports of property value?
Or is there just some large part of your brain that becomes satisfied when you can weave a narrative that sounds good, even while other parts of your brain know the narrative is false?
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@89th said in Trump fine GoFundMe:
@Jolly said in Trump fine GoFundMe:
It's not that everybody does it, it's that AFAIK, nobody has ever been prosecuted just this way under this statute, and NOBODY has received a fine such as this.
Personally, I think it's unconstitutional.
I guess we'll find out.
I’d imagine there have been countless of similar cases prosecuted for such type of fraud and ill gotten gains. Not sure where to search and find that info, though.
Give me one, besides Trump.
@Jolly said in Trump fine GoFundMe:
@89th said in Trump fine GoFundMe:
@Jolly said in Trump fine GoFundMe:
It's not that everybody does it, it's that AFAIK, nobody has ever been prosecuted just this way under this statute, and NOBODY has received a fine such as this.
Personally, I think it's unconstitutional.
I guess we'll find out.
I’d imagine there have been countless of similar cases prosecuted for such type of fraud and ill gotten gains. Not sure where to search and find that info, though.
Give me one, besides Trump.
Looks like there's been an average of about 300 per year, where this code is the top charge against a defendant.
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@Jolly said in Trump fine GoFundMe:
@89th said in Trump fine GoFundMe:
@Jolly said in Trump fine GoFundMe:
It's not that everybody does it, it's that AFAIK, nobody has ever been prosecuted just this way under this statute, and NOBODY has received a fine such as this.
Personally, I think it's unconstitutional.
I guess we'll find out.
I’d imagine there have been countless of similar cases prosecuted for such type of fraud and ill gotten gains. Not sure where to search and find that info, though.
Give me one, besides Trump.
Looks like there's been an average of about 300 per year, where this code is the top charge against a defendant.
@89th said in Trump fine GoFundMe:
@Jolly said in Trump fine GoFundMe:
@89th said in Trump fine GoFundMe:
@Jolly said in Trump fine GoFundMe:
It's not that everybody does it, it's that AFAIK, nobody has ever been prosecuted just this way under this statute, and NOBODY has received a fine such as this.
Personally, I think it's unconstitutional.
I guess we'll find out.
I’d imagine there have been countless of similar cases prosecuted for such type of fraud and ill gotten gains. Not sure where to search and find that info, though.
Give me one, besides Trump.
Looks like there's been an average of about 300 per year, where this code is the top charge against a defendant.
I don't think the question is whether the statute had never been used before for any reason.
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The question was whether anyone besides Trump has been tried in NY for falsifying business documents and gaining money from the fraud. Apparently about 300 a year it seems. Although admittedly most of the amounts were not bigly, like Trump's.
@89th said in Trump fine GoFundMe:
The question was whether anyone besides Trump has been tried in NY for falsifying business documents and gaining money from the fraud.
So, it's your contention that anybody here thinks nobody has ever been prosecuted for falsifying documents and gaining money from fraud?
It's not more reasonable to try to understand the actual claims being made? Just dunk on an obviously absurd claim that one would have to be a moron to believe?
We're all better than that here, and now that I've been the target of death threats by mentally ill Trump haters, I think we all realize just how serious these discussions are. This is a matter of life and death, and we simply must elevate our understanding and compassion. I am terrified.
Education is extremely important.
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Again, how many times in NY has someone been prosecuted for fraud in a long-concluded business venture where everyone profited? How many New Yorkers have been the target of prosecutions like this that were brought to them by journalists whose singular goal was to harm those being investigated? How many DAs have run on the promise of prosecuting a named individual?
"The intelligent man who is proud of his intelligence is like the condemned man who is proud of his large cell." Simone Weil
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@89th said in Trump fine GoFundMe:
The question was whether anyone besides Trump has been tried in NY for falsifying business documents and gaining money from the fraud.
So, it's your contention that anybody here thinks nobody has ever been prosecuted for falsifying documents and gaining money from fraud?
It's not more reasonable to try to understand the actual claims being made? Just dunk on an obviously absurd claim that one would have to be a moron to believe?
We're all better than that here, and now that I've been the target of death threats by mentally ill Trump haters, I think we all realize just how serious these discussions are. This is a matter of life and death, and we simply must elevate our understanding and compassion. I am terrified.
@Horace said in Trump fine GoFundMe:
@89th said in Trump fine GoFundMe:
The question was whether anyone besides Trump has been tried in NY for falsifying business documents and gaining money from the fraud.
So, it's your contention that anybody here thinks nobody has ever been prosecuted for falsifying documents and gaining money from fraud?
It's not more reasonable to try to understand the actual claims being made? Just dunk on an obviously absurd claim that one would have to be a moron to believe?
I was just replying to this request:
We're all better than that here
Speak for yourself! I am certainly not above a literal reply.
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Again, how many times in NY has someone been prosecuted for fraud in a long-concluded business venture where everyone profited? How many New Yorkers have been the target of prosecutions like this that were brought to them by journalists whose singular goal was to harm those being investigated? How many DAs have run on the promise of prosecuting a named individual?
@Mik said in Trump fine GoFundMe:
Again, how many times in NY has someone been prosecuted for fraud in a long-concluded business venture where everyone profited? How many New Yorkers have been the target of prosecutions like this that were brought to them by journalists whose singular goal was to harm those being investigated? How many DAs have run on the promise of prosecuting a named individual?
I am totally with you on this. I really am.
That being said, I do not have a problem if someone committed fraud years ago, profited hundreds of millions of dollars from it, and later were exposed and fined. Could be Biden. Could be my neighbor. It was so blatantly illegal and fraudulent. If exposed, so be it. Don't to the crime if you can't afford the fine.
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@Horace said in Trump fine GoFundMe:
@89th said in Trump fine GoFundMe:
The question was whether anyone besides Trump has been tried in NY for falsifying business documents and gaining money from the fraud.
So, it's your contention that anybody here thinks nobody has ever been prosecuted for falsifying documents and gaining money from fraud?
It's not more reasonable to try to understand the actual claims being made? Just dunk on an obviously absurd claim that one would have to be a moron to believe?
I was just replying to this request:
We're all better than that here
Speak for yourself! I am certainly not above a literal reply.
@89th said in Trump fine GoFundMe:
@Horace said in Trump fine GoFundMe:
@89th said in Trump fine GoFundMe:
The question was whether anyone besides Trump has been tried in NY for falsifying business documents and gaining money from the fraud.
So, it's your contention that anybody here thinks nobody has ever been prosecuted for falsifying documents and gaining money from fraud?
It's not more reasonable to try to understand the actual claims being made? Just dunk on an obviously absurd claim that one would have to be a moron to believe?
I was just replying to this request:
We're all better than that here
Speak for yourself! I am certainly not above a literal reply.
So, "such type" can be interpreted broadly enough to make the claim imbecilic, or spefically enough to make it reasonably open to question.
The broad interpretation would be that this "type" of prosecution was over false documents and fraud.
A more specific interpretation might be loan paperwork with misrepresented property values from long ago, for a loan which was granted and subsequently repaid with all appropriate interest.
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@Mik said in Trump fine GoFundMe:
Again, how many times in NY has someone been prosecuted for fraud in a long-concluded business venture where everyone profited? How many New Yorkers have been the target of prosecutions like this that were brought to them by journalists whose singular goal was to harm those being investigated? How many DAs have run on the promise of prosecuting a named individual?
I am totally with you on this. I really am.
That being said, I do not have a problem if someone committed fraud years ago, profited hundreds of millions of dollars from it, and later were exposed and fined. Could be Biden. Could be my neighbor. It was so blatantly illegal and fraudulent. If exposed, so be it. Don't to the crime if you can't afford the fine.
@89th said in Trump fine GoFundMe:
@Mik said in Trump fine GoFundMe:
Again, how many times in NY has someone been prosecuted for fraud in a long-concluded business venture where everyone profited? How many New Yorkers have been the target of prosecutions like this that were brought to them by journalists whose singular goal was to harm those being investigated? How many DAs have run on the promise of prosecuting a named individual?
I am totally with you on this. I really am.
That being said, I do not have a problem if someone committed fraud years ago, profited hundreds of millions of dollars from it, and later were exposed and fined. Could be Biden. Could be my neighbor. It was so blatantly illegal and fraudulent. If exposed, so be it. Don't to the crime if you can't afford the fine.
But it wasn't anybody. It was a specifically targeted individual simply because some folks don't like him and will do anything to harm him.
"The intelligent man who is proud of his intelligence is like the condemned man who is proud of his large cell." Simone Weil
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@Horace said in Trump fine GoFundMe:
@89th said in Trump fine GoFundMe:
The question was whether anyone besides Trump has been tried in NY for falsifying business documents and gaining money from the fraud.
So, it's your contention that anybody here thinks nobody has ever been prosecuted for falsifying documents and gaining money from fraud?
It's not more reasonable to try to understand the actual claims being made? Just dunk on an obviously absurd claim that one would have to be a moron to believe?
I was just replying to this request:
We're all better than that here
Speak for yourself! I am certainly not above a literal reply.
@89th said in Trump fine GoFundMe:
@Horace said in Trump fine GoFundMe:
@89th said in Trump fine GoFundMe:
The question was whether anyone besides Trump has been tried in NY for falsifying business documents and gaining money from the fraud.
So, it's your contention that anybody here thinks nobody has ever been prosecuted for falsifying documents and gaining money from fraud?
It's not more reasonable to try to understand the actual claims being made? Just dunk on an obviously absurd claim that one would have to be a moron to believe?
I was just replying to this request:
We're all better than that here
Speak for yourself! I am certainly not above a literal reply.
You still haven't given me one. None of those prosecutions are similar to Trump's.
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@89th said in Trump fine GoFundMe:
@Mik said in Trump fine GoFundMe:
Again, how many times in NY has someone been prosecuted for fraud in a long-concluded business venture where everyone profited? How many New Yorkers have been the target of prosecutions like this that were brought to them by journalists whose singular goal was to harm those being investigated? How many DAs have run on the promise of prosecuting a named individual?
I am totally with you on this. I really am.
That being said, I do not have a problem if someone committed fraud years ago, profited hundreds of millions of dollars from it, and later were exposed and fined. Could be Biden. Could be my neighbor. It was so blatantly illegal and fraudulent. If exposed, so be it. Don't to the crime if you can't afford the fine.
But it wasn't anybody. It was a specifically targeted individual simply because some folks don't like him and will do anything to harm him.
@Mik said in Trump fine GoFundMe:
@89th said in Trump fine GoFundMe:
@Mik said in Trump fine GoFundMe:
Again, how many times in NY has someone been prosecuted for fraud in a long-concluded business venture where everyone profited? How many New Yorkers have been the target of prosecutions like this that were brought to them by journalists whose singular goal was to harm those being investigated? How many DAs have run on the promise of prosecuting a named individual?
I am totally with you on this. I really am.
That being said, I do not have a problem if someone committed fraud years ago, profited hundreds of millions of dollars from it, and later were exposed and fined. Could be Biden. Could be my neighbor. It was so blatantly illegal and fraudulent. If exposed, so be it. Don't to the crime if you can't afford the fine.
But it wasn't anybody. It was a specifically targeted individual simply because some folks don't like him and will do anything to harm him.
A politician who ran on a platform of targeting a single person.
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@89th said in Trump fine GoFundMe:
@Mik said in Trump fine GoFundMe:
Again, how many times in NY has someone been prosecuted for fraud in a long-concluded business venture where everyone profited? How many New Yorkers have been the target of prosecutions like this that were brought to them by journalists whose singular goal was to harm those being investigated? How many DAs have run on the promise of prosecuting a named individual?
I am totally with you on this. I really am.
That being said, I do not have a problem if someone committed fraud years ago, profited hundreds of millions of dollars from it, and later were exposed and fined. Could be Biden. Could be my neighbor. It was so blatantly illegal and fraudulent. If exposed, so be it. Don't to the crime if you can't afford the fine.
But it wasn't anybody. It was a specifically targeted individual simply because some folks don't like him and will do anything to harm him.
@Mik said in Trump fine GoFundMe:
But it wasn't anybody. It was a specifically targeted individual simply because some folks don't like him and will do anything to harm him.
Which folks, the DA or the journalists who investigated Trump’s business dealings? I can’t speak for the DA but it’s hard not to open a case once the details of the investigative journalism was published.
Btw I fully admit I have no problem watching Trump get punished for past fraud or crimes, IF they are legit charges, which they seem to be in this case. Refusing to accept your presidential re-election loss is a CARDINAL SIN when it comes to our nation, I don’t care what political party is involved.
