The Hamas Actor - Mr. FAFO
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The Brad
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@LuFins-Dad said in The Hamas Actor:
BBC Verify says it’s a real baby…
This is the same BBC that said that Israel bombed a hospital, right?
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@LuFins-Dad said in The Hamas Actor:
BBC Verify says it’s a real baby…
This is the same BBC that said that Israel bombed a hospital, right?
@George-K said in The Hamas Actor:
@LuFins-Dad said in The Hamas Actor:
BBC Verify says it’s a real baby…
This is the same BBC that said that Israel bombed a hospital, right?
Not really. BBC Verify uses a lot of fairly sophisticated but accessible techniques to verify the provenance of photographs. They can use the hidden geo/chrono data that is encoded in digital photos to place the date and time. It’s very much akin to @89th s work in identifying Jon’s hotel rooms and even what floor he was on.
Most of the false images that they have identified have been coming from the pro-Palestine side. But the recurring ones from the Pro-Israel side have been the claims about this baby and Mr. FAFO. Mr. FAFO is a fairly famous Instagram celebrity in the Middle East. He’s kind of a Muslim Sacha Baron Cohen. All of the claims about him and Pallywood are actually from Instagram posts and jokes going back over several years.
As far as the hospital bombing, no, BBC Verify actually put together a pretty comprehensive list of evidence to support the fact that it was a misfired Palestinian rocket.
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@George-K said in The Hamas Actor:
@LuFins-Dad said in The Hamas Actor:
BBC Verify says it’s a real baby…
This is the same BBC that said that Israel bombed a hospital, right?
Not really. BBC Verify uses a lot of fairly sophisticated but accessible techniques to verify the provenance of photographs. They can use the hidden geo/chrono data that is encoded in digital photos to place the date and time. It’s very much akin to @89th s work in identifying Jon’s hotel rooms and even what floor he was on.
Most of the false images that they have identified have been coming from the pro-Palestine side. But the recurring ones from the Pro-Israel side have been the claims about this baby and Mr. FAFO. Mr. FAFO is a fairly famous Instagram celebrity in the Middle East. He’s kind of a Muslim Sacha Baron Cohen. All of the claims about him and Pallywood are actually from Instagram posts and jokes going back over several years.
As far as the hospital bombing, no, BBC Verify actually put together a pretty comprehensive list of evidence to support the fact that it was a misfired Palestinian rocket.
@LuFins-Dad said in The Hamas Actor:
BBC Verify actually put together a pretty comprehensive list of evidence to support the fact that it was a misfired Palestinian rocket...
...eventually.
IIRC, BBC spokespeople were all over the Israeli rocket attack for a while, claiming hundreds were killed.
Look at how the story was framed (Oct 17):
Hundreds of people have been killed by an explosion at a crowded hospital in Gaza City, health officials say.
One doctor condemned what he called "a massacre" at Al-Ahli Arab Hospital, while another spoke of a scene of total devastation.
Palestinian officials say the blast was caused by an Israeli air strike.
But the Israeli military say it was the result of a failed rocket launch by Palestinian Islamic Jihad - an accusation the militant group rejected.
Israeli warplanes and artillery have been bombarding Gaza in response to an unprecedented attack on Israel on 7 October by the main Palestinian militant group, Hamas, which killed 1,400 people.
More than 3,000 people have been reported killed by strikes on Gaza.
The hospital blast is threatening efforts to resolve the humanitarian crisis there, with Jordan cancelling a planned summit on Wednesday between US President Joe Biden, King Abdullah and the Palestinian and Egyptian leaders....
Pictures that emerged from Al-Ahli Arab hospital on Tuesday night show scenes of chaos, with bloodied and maimed casualties being rushed out on stretchers in the darkness. Bodies and wrecked vehicles can be seen lying in the rubble-strewn street outside.
One video appears to show a projectile hitting the area followed by a blast.
- Hundreds killed
- Doctor condemns "massacre"
- Palestinian officials claim
- Israel denies.
- Israel's bombing of Gaza
- 3000 Gazans "reported" killed
- Hospital blast
- Humanitarian crisis.
- Rubble in street, chaos, bodies
- "Projectile."
What's the takeaway from that reporting?
"A lie makes its way around the world before the truth even gets its trousers on."
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@LuFins-Dad said in The Hamas Actor:
BBC Verify actually put together a pretty comprehensive list of evidence to support the fact that it was a misfired Palestinian rocket...
...eventually.
IIRC, BBC spokespeople were all over the Israeli rocket attack for a while, claiming hundreds were killed.
Look at how the story was framed (Oct 17):
Hundreds of people have been killed by an explosion at a crowded hospital in Gaza City, health officials say.
One doctor condemned what he called "a massacre" at Al-Ahli Arab Hospital, while another spoke of a scene of total devastation.
Palestinian officials say the blast was caused by an Israeli air strike.
But the Israeli military say it was the result of a failed rocket launch by Palestinian Islamic Jihad - an accusation the militant group rejected.
Israeli warplanes and artillery have been bombarding Gaza in response to an unprecedented attack on Israel on 7 October by the main Palestinian militant group, Hamas, which killed 1,400 people.
More than 3,000 people have been reported killed by strikes on Gaza.
The hospital blast is threatening efforts to resolve the humanitarian crisis there, with Jordan cancelling a planned summit on Wednesday between US President Joe Biden, King Abdullah and the Palestinian and Egyptian leaders....
Pictures that emerged from Al-Ahli Arab hospital on Tuesday night show scenes of chaos, with bloodied and maimed casualties being rushed out on stretchers in the darkness. Bodies and wrecked vehicles can be seen lying in the rubble-strewn street outside.
One video appears to show a projectile hitting the area followed by a blast.
- Hundreds killed
- Doctor condemns "massacre"
- Palestinian officials claim
- Israel denies.
- Israel's bombing of Gaza
- 3000 Gazans "reported" killed
- Hospital blast
- Humanitarian crisis.
- Rubble in street, chaos, bodies
- "Projectile."
What's the takeaway from that reporting?
"A lie makes its way around the world before the truth even gets its trousers on."
@George-K said in The Hamas Actor:
@LuFins-Dad said in The Hamas Actor:
BBC Verify actually put together a pretty comprehensive list of evidence to support the fact that it was a misfired Palestinian rocket...
...eventually.
IIRC, BBC spokespeople were all over the Israeli rocket attack for a while, claiming hundreds were killed.
Look at how the story was framed (Oct 17):
Hundreds of people have been killed by an explosion at a crowded hospital in Gaza City, health officials say.
One doctor condemned what he called "a massacre" at Al-Ahli Arab Hospital, while another spoke of a scene of total devastation.
Palestinian officials say the blast was caused by an Israeli air strike.
But the Israeli military say it was the result of a failed rocket launch by Palestinian Islamic Jihad - an accusation the militant group rejected.
Israeli warplanes and artillery have been bombarding Gaza in response to an unprecedented attack on Israel on 7 October by the main Palestinian militant group, Hamas, which killed 1,400 people.
More than 3,000 people have been reported killed by strikes on Gaza.
The hospital blast is threatening efforts to resolve the humanitarian crisis there, with Jordan cancelling a planned summit on Wednesday between US President Joe Biden, King Abdullah and the Palestinian and Egyptian leaders....
Pictures that emerged from Al-Ahli Arab hospital on Tuesday night show scenes of chaos, with bloodied and maimed casualties being rushed out on stretchers in the darkness. Bodies and wrecked vehicles can be seen lying in the rubble-strewn street outside.
One video appears to show a projectile hitting the area followed by a blast.
- Hundreds killed
- Doctor condemns "massacre"
- Palestinian officials claim
- Israel denies.
- Israel's bombing of Gaza
- 3000 Gazans "reported" killed
- Hospital blast
- Humanitarian crisis.
- Rubble in street, chaos, bodies
- "Projectile."
What's the takeaway from that reporting?
"A lie makes its way around the world before the truth even gets its trousers on."
And here was BBC Verify’s initial reporting -
https://www.bbc.com/news/world-middle-east-67144061We asked whether the available evidence - including the size of the explosion and the sounds heard beforehand - could be used to determine the cause of the hospital blast.
So far, the findings are inconclusive. Three experts we spoke to say it is not consistent with what you would expect from a typical Israeli air strike with a large munition.
J Andres Gannon, an assistant professor at Vanderbilt University, in the US, says the ground explosions appeared to be small, meaning that the heat generated from the impact may have been caused by leftover rocket fuel rather than an explosion from a warhead.
Justin Bronk, senior research fellow at the UK-based Royal United Services Institute, agrees. While it is difficult to be sure at such an early stage, he says, the evidence looks like the explosion was caused by a failed rocket section hitting the car park and causing a fuel and propellant fire.
Mr Gannon says it is not possible to determine whether the projectile struck its intended target from the footage he has seen. He adds that the flashes in the sky likely indicate the projectile was a rocket with an engine that overheated and stopped working.
Valeria Scuto, lead Middle East analyst at Sibylline, a risk assessment company, notes that Israel has the capacity to carry out other forms of air strike by drone, where they might use Hellfire missiles. These missiles generate a significant amount of heat but would not necessarily leave a large crater. But she says uncorroborated footage shows a pattern of fires at the hospital site that was not consistent with this explanation.
Some have suggested that the lack of a large crater could be explained by the use of an "air burst" munition - a weapon set to explode above the ground. But the experts we spoke to said the blast scene was not consistent with this.BBC Verify is not strictly BBC. Yes, tye BBC has shown a very distinct Anti-Israel bias, but that’s not what BBC Verifys job is. They aren’t really reporters, they are technicians and are simply reporting their findings, which are generally verifiable. Mr. FAFO, for instance.
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@George-K said in The Hamas Actor:
@LuFins-Dad said in The Hamas Actor:
BBC Verify actually put together a pretty comprehensive list of evidence to support the fact that it was a misfired Palestinian rocket...
...eventually.
IIRC, BBC spokespeople were all over the Israeli rocket attack for a while, claiming hundreds were killed.
Look at how the story was framed (Oct 17):
Hundreds of people have been killed by an explosion at a crowded hospital in Gaza City, health officials say.
One doctor condemned what he called "a massacre" at Al-Ahli Arab Hospital, while another spoke of a scene of total devastation.
Palestinian officials say the blast was caused by an Israeli air strike.
But the Israeli military say it was the result of a failed rocket launch by Palestinian Islamic Jihad - an accusation the militant group rejected.
Israeli warplanes and artillery have been bombarding Gaza in response to an unprecedented attack on Israel on 7 October by the main Palestinian militant group, Hamas, which killed 1,400 people.
More than 3,000 people have been reported killed by strikes on Gaza.
The hospital blast is threatening efforts to resolve the humanitarian crisis there, with Jordan cancelling a planned summit on Wednesday between US President Joe Biden, King Abdullah and the Palestinian and Egyptian leaders....
Pictures that emerged from Al-Ahli Arab hospital on Tuesday night show scenes of chaos, with bloodied and maimed casualties being rushed out on stretchers in the darkness. Bodies and wrecked vehicles can be seen lying in the rubble-strewn street outside.
One video appears to show a projectile hitting the area followed by a blast.
- Hundreds killed
- Doctor condemns "massacre"
- Palestinian officials claim
- Israel denies.
- Israel's bombing of Gaza
- 3000 Gazans "reported" killed
- Hospital blast
- Humanitarian crisis.
- Rubble in street, chaos, bodies
- "Projectile."
What's the takeaway from that reporting?
"A lie makes its way around the world before the truth even gets its trousers on."
And here was BBC Verify’s initial reporting -
https://www.bbc.com/news/world-middle-east-67144061We asked whether the available evidence - including the size of the explosion and the sounds heard beforehand - could be used to determine the cause of the hospital blast.
So far, the findings are inconclusive. Three experts we spoke to say it is not consistent with what you would expect from a typical Israeli air strike with a large munition.
J Andres Gannon, an assistant professor at Vanderbilt University, in the US, says the ground explosions appeared to be small, meaning that the heat generated from the impact may have been caused by leftover rocket fuel rather than an explosion from a warhead.
Justin Bronk, senior research fellow at the UK-based Royal United Services Institute, agrees. While it is difficult to be sure at such an early stage, he says, the evidence looks like the explosion was caused by a failed rocket section hitting the car park and causing a fuel and propellant fire.
Mr Gannon says it is not possible to determine whether the projectile struck its intended target from the footage he has seen. He adds that the flashes in the sky likely indicate the projectile was a rocket with an engine that overheated and stopped working.
Valeria Scuto, lead Middle East analyst at Sibylline, a risk assessment company, notes that Israel has the capacity to carry out other forms of air strike by drone, where they might use Hellfire missiles. These missiles generate a significant amount of heat but would not necessarily leave a large crater. But she says uncorroborated footage shows a pattern of fires at the hospital site that was not consistent with this explanation.
Some have suggested that the lack of a large crater could be explained by the use of an "air burst" munition - a weapon set to explode above the ground. But the experts we spoke to said the blast scene was not consistent with this.BBC Verify is not strictly BBC. Yes, tye BBC has shown a very distinct Anti-Israel bias, but that’s not what BBC Verifys job is. They aren’t really reporters, they are technicians and are simply reporting their findings, which are generally verifiable. Mr. FAFO, for instance.
@LuFins-Dad said in The Hamas Actor:
they are technicians and are simply reporting their findings, which are generally verifiable
Yeah, I get it. Nevertheless, the "verify" came out two days after the BBC reporting. Probably got around the world twice.
BBC has shown a very distinct Anti-Israel bias
And that's what people see. Once the story's out - they don't look for the "Vertify." They don't care.
"I heard it on the Beeb..." and that's where the thinking stops.
(too lazy, and only one coffee so far)
Did the Beeb actually retract and/or correct the story, or did they leave it to "Verify" for people to seek it out?
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@LuFins-Dad said in The Hamas Actor:
they are technicians and are simply reporting their findings, which are generally verifiable
Yeah, I get it. Nevertheless, the "verify" came out two days after the BBC reporting. Probably got around the world twice.
BBC has shown a very distinct Anti-Israel bias
And that's what people see. Once the story's out - they don't look for the "Vertify." They don't care.
"I heard it on the Beeb..." and that's where the thinking stops.
(too lazy, and only one coffee so far)
Did the Beeb actually retract and/or correct the story, or did they leave it to "Verify" for people to seek it out?
@George-K said in The Hamas Actor:
@LuFins-Dad said in The Hamas Actor:
they are technicians and are simply reporting their findings, which are generally verifiable
Yeah, I get it. Nevertheless, the "verify" came out two days after the BBC reporting. Probably got around the world twice.
BBC has shown a very distinct Anti-Israel bias
And that's what people see. Once the story's out - they don't look for the "Vertify." They don't care.
"I heard it on the Beeb..." and that's where the thinking stops.
(too lazy, and only one coffee so far)
Did the Beeb actually retract and/or correct the story, or did they leave it to "Verify" for people to seek it out?
I’m sure the regular reporters thought their reporting was perfectly even handed and simply represented the facts that were relevant at the time. No need for a retraction…
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@George-K said in The Hamas Actor:
@LuFins-Dad said in The Hamas Actor:
they are technicians and are simply reporting their findings, which are generally verifiable
Yeah, I get it. Nevertheless, the "verify" came out two days after the BBC reporting. Probably got around the world twice.
BBC has shown a very distinct Anti-Israel bias
And that's what people see. Once the story's out - they don't look for the "Vertify." They don't care.
"I heard it on the Beeb..." and that's where the thinking stops.
(too lazy, and only one coffee so far)
Did the Beeb actually retract and/or correct the story, or did they leave it to "Verify" for people to seek it out?
I’m sure the regular reporters thought their reporting was perfectly even handed and simply represented the facts that were relevant at the time. No need for a retraction…
@LuFins-Dad said in The Hamas Actor:
reporters thought their reporting was perfectly even handed
Hundreds killed
Doctor condemns "massacre"
Palestinian officials claim
Israel denies.
Israel's bombing of Gaza
3000 Gazans reported killed
Hospital blast
Humanitarian crisis.
Rubble in street, chaos, bodies
"Projectile."
