Spot the threat to free speech
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wrote on 29 May 2020, 20:10 last edited by jon-nyc
I’ll even take a pragmatic conservative who realizes that whatever administrative rule-making procedures he puts in place will inevitably be hijacked by the woke left.
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wrote on 29 May 2020, 20:11 last edited by
There’s a reason principled conservatives don’t like the administrative state, after all.
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Neither. It's like a biker bar.
But YT and Twitter are more like the market place these days. You can't get heard unless you use them.
wrote on 29 May 2020, 20:17 last edited by@Klaus said in Spot the threat to free speech:
Neither. It's like a biker bar.
Yeah, but for a fat girl we don't sweat much...
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I’ll even take a pragmatic conservative who realizes that whatever administrative rule-making procedures he puts in place will inevitably be hijacked by the woke left.
wrote on 29 May 2020, 20:35 last edited by@jon-nyc said in Spot the threat to free speech:
I’ll even take a pragmatic conservative who realizes that whatever administrative rule-making procedures he puts in place will inevitably be hijacked by the woke left.
I have no firm idea about whether Trump's move is for the best or not. I like the conversation it is initiating though.
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wrote on 29 May 2020, 21:20 last edited by xenon
I think Trump gets one thing right. He's tweeted variations of this a few of times now:
You can't do anything with Section 230 in place. This EO is all fodder for the news cycle.
Section 230 (c) is pretty clear - especially the last bold bit:
(c)Protection for “Good Samaritan” blocking and screening of offensive material
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(1)Treatment of publisher or speaker
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No provider or user of an interactive computer service shall be treated as the publisher or speaker of any information provided by another information content provider.
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(2)Civil liability
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No provider or user of an interactive computer service shall be held liable on account of—
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(A)any action voluntarily taken in good faith to restrict access to or availability of material that the provider or user considers to be obscene, lewd, lascivious, filthy, excessively violent, harassing, or otherwise objectionable, whether or not such material is constitutionally protected; or
"Otherwise objectionable" - doesn't get broader than that.
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wrote on 29 May 2020, 21:21 last edited by xenon
Also from 230:
It is the policy of the United States to preserve the vibrant and competitive free market that presently exists for the Internet and other interactive computer services, unfettered by Federal or State regulation;
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wrote on 29 May 2020, 21:22 last edited by
I don't see how you can Executive Order your way out of this.
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@jon-nyc said in Spot the threat to free speech:
I’ll even take a pragmatic conservative who realizes that whatever administrative rule-making procedures he puts in place will inevitably be hijacked by the woke left.
I have no firm idea about whether Trump's move is for the best or not. I like the conversation it is initiating though.
wrote on 29 May 2020, 21:24 last edited by jon-nyc@Horace said in Spot the threat to free speech:
I have no firm idea about whether Trump's move is for the best or not. I like the conversation it is initiating though.
Yeah, it would be interesting to be a fly on the
wallzoom call during the emergency board meetings Twitter, FB, etc are holding today. -
wrote on 29 May 2020, 21:28 last edited by
Here's how I see it. Leftism has infected 3 areas of influence over the masses:
- Education system
- News media.
- Politics
The education system produces a large number of people who have been taught to think a certain way. The news media is made up of people who are products of our propagandist education system, and they 1. Don't know any better and 2. Want to support and defend what they've been brainwashed to believe. Plus, most of them have never learned how to think for themselves. The political tribe that benefits from this and is in fact responsible for making us a nation filled with morons is the Democrat party. So the all 3 work together for a common cause- destroy the US and replace it with their vision of power.
The only free thought left is that which occurs outside their sphere of influence. That is social media. If social media is allowed to align itself with the other three, it will take a civil war to stop them.
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Here's how I see it. Leftism has infected 3 areas of influence over the masses:
- Education system
- News media.
- Politics
The education system produces a large number of people who have been taught to think a certain way. The news media is made up of people who are products of our propagandist education system, and they 1. Don't know any better and 2. Want to support and defend what they've been brainwashed to believe. Plus, most of them have never learned how to think for themselves. The political tribe that benefits from this and is in fact responsible for making us a nation filled with morons is the Democrat party. So the all 3 work together for a common cause- destroy the US and replace it with their vision of power.
The only free thought left is that which occurs outside their sphere of influence. That is social media. If social media is allowed to align itself with the other three, it will take a civil war to stop them.
wrote on 29 May 2020, 21:36 last edited by xenon@Larry Larry, should Liberty University exercise no censorship or control over the discourse at its campus?
I would like for my kids to go to a university that truly believes in Free Speech and fosters unfettered access to viewpoints no matter how fringe or foul.
But I also understand that there are institutions that wouldn't want that.
There are many places on the internet where you can go and say whatever you want without moderation - are you saying that there can be no privately-run platforms online that moderate content?
Now - for this particular example. I think this is a value-destroying move by Twitter, but that's a different topic.
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wrote on 29 May 2020, 21:46 last edited by
Interesting take from Bret Weinstein:
I wish the people who believe the President didn't intend to threaten to shoot people would talk to the people who think he did intend to threaten to shoot people and that it's a good idea. If the former were correct, the President needs to address the problem posed by the latter
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wrote on 29 May 2020, 21:50 last edited by
Meanwhile it's neither fringe nor particularly noteworthy that in response to violent riots, violence is spoken openly of as a potential control measure.
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Neither. It's like a biker bar.
But YT and Twitter are more like the market place these days. You can't get heard unless you use them.
wrote on 29 May 2020, 21:52 last edited by@Klaus said in Spot the threat to free speech:
Neither. It's like a biker bar.
I think it's more of a triker bar.
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Meanwhile it's neither fringe nor particularly noteworthy that in response to violent riots, violence is spoken openly of as a potential control measure.
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wrote on 29 May 2020, 21:57 last edited by
Well down with that sort of thing then. Do not speak openly of violence against non-violent looters, looting in the middle of a chaotic violent riot.
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wrote on 29 May 2020, 21:58 last edited by
At the very least cut off their hands, right?
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@Klaus said in Spot the threat to free speech:
Neither. It's like a biker bar.
I think it's more of a triker bar.
wrote on 29 May 2020, 21:59 last edited by@Doctor-Phibes said in Spot the threat to free speech:
@Klaus said in Spot the threat to free speech:
Neither. It's like a biker bar.
I think it's more of a triker bar.
Or possibly a (short) bus stop.
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@Doctor-Phibes said in Spot the threat to free speech:
@Klaus said in Spot the threat to free speech:
Neither. It's like a biker bar.
I think it's more of a triker bar.
Or possibly a (short) bus stop.
wrote on 29 May 2020, 22:00 last edited by@Doctor-Phibes said in Spot the threat to free speech:
@Doctor-Phibes said in Spot the threat to free speech:
@Klaus said in Spot the threat to free speech:
Neither. It's like a biker bar.
I think it's more of a triker bar.
Or possibly a (short) bus stop.
Where crazies talk to themselves. I know what you mean.
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wrote on 29 May 2020, 22:02 last edited by
@xenon said in Spot the threat to free speech:
At the very least cut off their hands, right?
Surgically respond to them in exactly the same way the authorities may respond to a shoplifting call on a quiet Sunday afternoon at the local Walgreens.
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@Larry Larry, should Liberty University exercise no censorship or control over the discourse at its campus?
I would like for my kids to go to a university that truly believes in Free Speech and fosters unfettered access to viewpoints no matter how fringe or foul.
But I also understand that there are institutions that wouldn't want that.
There are many places on the internet where you can go and say whatever you want without moderation - are you saying that there can be no privately-run platforms online that moderate content?
Now - for this particular example. I think this is a value-destroying move by Twitter, but that's a different topic.
wrote on 30 May 2020, 01:25 last edited by@xenon said in Spot the threat to free speech:
@Larry Larry, should Liberty University exercise no censorship or control over the discourse at its campus?
I would like for my kids to go to a university that truly believes in Free Speech and fosters unfettered access to viewpoints no matter how fringe or foul.
But I also understand that there are institutions that wouldn't want that.
There are many places on the internet where you can go and say whatever you want without moderation - are you saying that there can be no privately-run platforms online that moderate content?
Now - for this particular example. I think this is a value-destroying move by Twitter, but that's a different topic.
Liberty university is not a communications platform. It is a private university not funded by taxpayer money, and it has a known set of standards. If you don't like those standards, no one forces you to go there, public discoyrse is not affected by Liberty University's stated goals. That said, i would like to attend a speech by Ben Shapiro on the Berkley campus. I do believe that school is publicly funded by tax dollars. Should Berkley change it's policy of rioting if a conservative tries to speak? You're proving my point,
Secondly, that you can find "many places on the internet" is beside the point. Twitter is a major point of public discourse. It is like a "public square". So your comparison with the internet at large doesn't work.