Biden "Forcefully" defends Afghan withdrawal
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@improviso said in Biden "Forcefully" defends Afghan withdrawal:
This debacle ultimately falls on the 80+ million people who elected these idiots.
The press has been brutal, to be sure.
However, Trump, and Obama before him, made noise about withdrawing. I don't know if it would have been different had they done it. Perhaps it might have been slower, but the actual result would have been pretty much the same.
wrote on 16 Aug 2021, 12:45 last edited by@george-k said in Biden "Forcefully" defends Afghan withdrawal:
Trump, and Obama before him, made noise about withdrawing. I don't know if it would have been different had they done it. Perhaps it might have been slower, but the actual result would have been pretty much the same.
How could it have been otherwise? Mik said the key thing IMO: "There are only two possible outcomes - we stay or we go. Was there any possibility of a positive outcome by staying or had all that could be accomplished been done? It's been 20 years."
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@george-k said in Biden "Forcefully" defends Afghan withdrawal:
Trump, and Obama before him, made noise about withdrawing. I don't know if it would have been different had they done it. Perhaps it might have been slower, but the actual result would have been pretty much the same.
How could it have been otherwise? Mik said the key thing IMO: "There are only two possible outcomes - we stay or we go. Was there any possibility of a positive outcome by staying or had all that could be accomplished been done? It's been 20 years."
wrote on 16 Aug 2021, 12:48 last edited byThe issue is not the withdrawal but the manner in which it was executed. Piss poor planning or lack of ANY planning. Probably the latter.
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The issue is not the withdrawal but the manner in which it was executed. Piss poor planning or lack of ANY planning. Probably the latter.
wrote on 16 Aug 2021, 12:53 last edited by@improviso I'm way out of my wheelhouse when I ask this; how should it have been done in your estimation? I ask not to set up a debate, but because I really don't know. Daddy never taught me how to evacuate from a country.
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wrote on 16 Aug 2021, 12:53 last edited by
@george-k said in Biden "Forcefully" defends Afghan withdrawal:
Gotta wonder what our allies, the Pakistanis think of all this.
Haha... Pakistanis, our allies???
I wouldn't trust the Pakistanis any further than I could throw Oprah.
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wrote on 16 Aug 2021, 12:53 last edited by
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wrote on 16 Aug 2021, 13:05 last edited by
@catseye3 said in Biden "Forcefully" defends Afghan withdrawal:
how should it have been done in your estimation?
Just off the top of my head...
First and foremost, I would not have telegraphed our intention to leave in 3 months as Biden did. First rule of war: Never tell the enemy what you intend to do.
I would have placed the 5000 troops at the airport to secure it first, rather than deploy them as the Taliban were entering the city.
I would have waited until the winter when the Taliban retreat to Pakistan, rather than in prime fighting season.
I would have had all the visa's ready for all the Afghan's that helped us.
I would have had just a skeleton crew at the Embassy, not the full compliment of Americans as usual.
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@catseye3 said in Biden "Forcefully" defends Afghan withdrawal:
how should it have been done in your estimation?
Just off the top of my head...
First and foremost, I would not have telegraphed our intention to leave in 3 months as Biden did. First rule of war: Never tell the enemy what you intend to do.
I would have placed the 5000 troops at the airport to secure it first, rather than deploy them as the Taliban were entering the city.
I would have waited until the winter when the Taliban retreat to Pakistan, rather than in prime fighting season.
I would have had all the visa's ready for all the Afghan's that helped us.
I would have had just a skeleton crew at the Embassy, not the full compliment of Americans as usual.
wrote on 16 Aug 2021, 13:15 last edited by@improviso said in Biden "Forcefully" defends Afghan withdrawal:
First and foremost, I would not have telegraphed our intention to leave in 3 months as Biden did.
This sounds so sensible as to be self evident!
I've been wondering: Where were the White House military advisors in all this? Where were the experienced Pentagon voices that would have been able to plan this better? The people whose job it is to provide advice and guidance? Could the decision have been so impulsive and sudden that the smart heads were caught off guard?
I would have placed the 5000 troops at the airport to secure it first, rather than deploy them as the Taliban were entering the city.
I would have had all the visa's ready for all the Afghan's that helped us.
Tough to do all this secretly, though . . .
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wrote on 16 Aug 2021, 13:22 last edited by Jolly
Folks, Biden is an old man, who cannot work a forty-hour week. He's never been known as an intellectual politician or much of a leader.
The economy, the border crisis, China, Afghanistan...Bless his heart, he's in over his head.
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wrote on 16 Aug 2021, 13:29 last edited by
One of the leaders of the Taliban spent 7 years in Guantanamo and was released by Obama.
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One of the leaders of the Taliban spent 7 years in Guantanamo and was released by Obama.
wrote on 16 Aug 2021, 13:31 last edited by@lufins-dad said in Biden "Forcefully" defends Afghan withdrawal:
One of the leaders of the Taliban spent 7 years in Guantanamo and was released by Obama.
Good thing you posted that here.
If you posted it on Twitter, you'd be banned for life.
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wrote on 16 Aug 2021, 13:33 last edited by George K
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@improviso said in Biden "Forcefully" defends Afghan withdrawal:
First and foremost, I would not have telegraphed our intention to leave in 3 months as Biden did.
This sounds so sensible as to be self evident!
I've been wondering: Where were the White House military advisors in all this? Where were the experienced Pentagon voices that would have been able to plan this better? The people whose job it is to provide advice and guidance? Could the decision have been so impulsive and sudden that the smart heads were caught off guard?
I would have placed the 5000 troops at the airport to secure it first, rather than deploy them as the Taliban were entering the city.
I would have had all the visa's ready for all the Afghan's that helped us.
Tough to do all this secretly, though . . .
wrote on 16 Aug 2021, 13:40 last edited by@catseye3 said in Biden "Forcefully" defends Afghan withdrawal:
This sounds so sensible as to be self evident!
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@improviso said in Biden "Forcefully" defends Afghan withdrawal:
First and foremost, I would not have telegraphed our intention to leave in 3 months as Biden did.
This sounds so sensible as to be self evident!
I've been wondering: Where were the White House military advisors in all this? Where were the experienced Pentagon voices that would have been able to plan this better? The people whose job it is to provide advice and guidance? Could the decision have been so impulsive and sudden that the smart heads were caught off guard?
I would have placed the 5000 troops at the airport to secure it first, rather than deploy them as the Taliban were entering the city.
I would have had all the visa's ready for all the Afghan's that helped us.
Tough to do all this secretly, though . . .
wrote on 16 Aug 2021, 13:40 last edited by George K@catseye3 said in Biden "Forcefully" defends Afghan withdrawal:
Where were the White House military advisors in all this?
Go to 36:00
Link to video -
wrote on 16 Aug 2021, 14:03 last edited by
I suspect he wanted to get it done as far from November 22 as possible.
I heard yesterday something that made sense to me from one of the ,military advisors over there. We built an army for a nation that doesn’t really exist, at least not as we know if. Afghanistan is fractious, tribal and the levers and centers of power are not that of a modern nation.
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wrote on 16 Aug 2021, 14:10 last edited by
The left has fun too...
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wrote on 16 Aug 2021, 14:13 last edited by
Perhaps the devil you know..
I wonder his thoughts on China.
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wrote on 16 Aug 2021, 14:18 last edited by
Best line of the day, so far: We (the American people) traded mean tweets for gross incompetence.
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wrote on 16 Aug 2021, 14:21 last edited by kluurs
The tragedy of the good Afghan folks who supported us - and for the young women allowed education and career opportunities - what a rug to be pulled out from under them. The Taliban don't feel a need for compromise as they have both religious fervor and the power to implement the rules they want - a theocracy. Respect for individual liberty or a diversity of ideas - not so much a priority.
For all of our intelligence capabilities, it seems clear that we missed the mark by a long stretch in predicting the speed of the fall. Trump was criticized for his negotiations directly with the Taliban. I've not heard anything about this administration having direct contact with them. It would have been advantageous to negotiate a more orderly withdrawal - though it is certainly possible that we just gave them the middle finger.
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The tragedy of the good Afghan folks who supported us - and for the young women allowed education and career opportunities - what a rug to be pulled out from under them. The Taliban don't feel a need for compromise as they have both religious fervor and the power to implement the rules they want - a theocracy. Respect for individual liberty or a diversity of ideas - not so much a priority.
For all of our intelligence capabilities, it seems clear that we missed the mark by a long stretch in predicting the speed of the fall. Trump was criticized for his negotiations directly with the Taliban. I've not heard anything about this administration having direct contact with them. It would have been advantageous to negotiate a more orderly withdrawal - though it is certainly possible that we just gave them the middle finger.
wrote on 16 Aug 2021, 14:54 last edited by@kluurs said in Biden "Forcefully" defends Afghan withdrawal:
For all of our intelligence capabilities, it seems clear that we missed the mark by a long stretch
Again. Our "intelligence" community (and I say that with a huge dose of irony) looks like the Keystone Kops - but not as funny.
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wrote on 16 Aug 2021, 14:56 last edited by
@kluurs said in Biden "Forcefully" defends Afghan withdrawal:
The left has fun too...
We can play that game all day. How many Talibs were released in exchange for Bowe Bergdahl, five?
"Now look here, you Baltic gas passer... " - Mik, 6/14/08
The saying, "Lite is just one damn thing after another," is a gross understatement. The damn things overlap.
