99.2% of recent Covid deaths are unvaccinated people
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@loki said in 99.2% of recent Covid deaths are unvaccinated people:
Conflating a vaccine with liberty and freedom is a huge reveal on the driver of the decision making and is proof of the politics involved.
People are free to get the vaccine or not. If you think people are avoiding the vaccine to make a point about freedom, you should probably try to disentangle their real reasons, or lack thereof. I'm comfortable with "because they don't feel like it", and I feel strongly that people who don't feel like getting the vaccine are not necessarily anti-social imbeciles. I also feel strongly that there should be no law forcing people to get the vaccine.
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@horace said in 99.2% of recent Covid deaths are unvaccinated people:
@loki said in 99.2% of recent Covid deaths are unvaccinated people:
Conflating a vaccine with liberty and freedom is a huge reveal on the driver of the decision making and is proof of the politics involved.
People are free to get the vaccine or not. If you think people are avoiding the vaccine to make a point about freedom, you should probably try to disentangle their real reasons, or lack thereof. I'm comfortable with "because they don't feel like it", and I feel strongly that people who don't feel like getting the vaccine are not necessarily anti-social imbeciles. I also feel strongly that there should be no law forcing people to get the vaccine.
I don’t think there should be a mandatory vaccine either. I do think that as the evidence piles up we should separate fact from fiction. I always said the media should be held accountable for their TDS and exposed for their flagrant lies and mistruths. I am applying the same principle here.
I also don’t want some new variant to be the excuse why every child can’t be in person in our education system this fall. The longer Covid hangs out the more it mutates.
I have one purpose, which I articulated right from the beginning, let’s get this country and our economy operating at normal.
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And 95% were senior citizens… Why aren’t we talking about that number? People need to stop being old!
Fact is, if you are under 50, vaccinated or under vaccinated, you are at little personal risk. Great societal risk, but little personal.
As for autonomy, if it’s taken away whenever necessary for the public good, then it’s not autonomy.
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This thread reminds us of my father. He always prided himself on bringing us up to be independent thinkers. His failing was he assumed that any independent thinker would come to the same conclusions he did and was quite perplexed when all three of us came to wildly different conclusions.
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@loki said in 99.2% of recent Covid deaths are unvaccinated people:
I have one purpose, which I articulated right from the beginning, let’s get this country and our economy operating at normal.
You say that like there is some known way to make the country and economy normal.
If nobody had ever worn a mask covid might be totally gone by now, and everything would be normal.
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@mik said in 99.2% of recent Covid deaths are unvaccinated people:
This thread reminds us of my father. He always prided himself on bringing us up to be independent thinkers. His failing was he assumed that any independent thinker would come to the same conclusions he did and was quite perplexed when all three of us came to wildly different conclusions.
And what is the rational conclusion of people not taking the vaccine other than my body my choice?
Can we just put the evidence up side by side?
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@kluurs said in 99.2% of recent Covid deaths are unvaccinated people:
I got the vaccine as early as possible.. I do know some intelligent people who have chosen not to vax - not for any particular reason other than the "what we don't know, that we don't know" - which I can understand.
A close friend of mine, a surgeon, has refused because he's skeptical of the mRNA technology, and that the vaccines were given "emergency use" approval - which, to his mind means "not completely tested."
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Frankly? If I was 10 years younger, I probably would’ve passed.
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@loki said in 99.2% of recent Covid deaths are unvaccinated people:
@mik said in 99.2% of recent Covid deaths are unvaccinated people:
This thread reminds us of my father. He always prided himself on bringing us up to be independent thinkers. His failing was he assumed that any independent thinker would come to the same conclusions he did and was quite perplexed when all three of us came to wildly different conclusions.
And what is the rational conclusion of people not taking the vaccine other than my body my choice?
Can we just put the evidence up side by side?
Hi, Dad!
You are making the same mistake in assuming everyone will approach the issue on the same evidence basis you do, and even if they do will look at the same evidence. I do, but I also know a lot of people who do not approach it that way and see the vaccine in very different lights.
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@lufins-dad said in 99.2% of recent Covid deaths are unvaccinated people:
Frankly? If I was 10 years younger, I probably would’ve passed.
A close friend of mine is a 30 year old female ultramarathoner and triathlete. Running marathons was a nothing to her. I joked with her about a photo of her at mile 23 of a marathon with her smiling and happy. I noted she looked better late in the race than I did at the start. Her 4 year old brought home Covid from daycare. For the past several months, my friend has struggled to walk a few hundred feet. She has headaches and lost weight she didn't need to lose. Her sense of taste and smell have been affected. Whenever someone tells me how healthy they are - or youthful and thus, clearly invincible from Covid, I think of my friend.
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@kluurs said in 99.2% of recent Covid deaths are unvaccinated people:
@lufins-dad said in 99.2% of recent Covid deaths are unvaccinated people:
Frankly? If I was 10 years younger, I probably would’ve passed.
A close friend of mine is a 30 year old female ultramarathoner and triathlete. Running marathons was a nothing to her. I joked with her about a photo of her at mile 23 of a marathon with her smiling and happy. I noted she looked better late in the race than I did at the start. Her 4 year old brought home Covid from daycare. For the past several months, my friend has struggled to walk a few hundred feet. She has headaches and lost weight she didn't need to lose. Her sense of taste and smell have been affected. Whenever someone tells me how healthy they are - or youthful and thus, clearly invincible from Covid, I think of my friend.
But that's because the disease is predictable, but not predictable. There will be outliers...And in my limited observations, mostly genetic.
For the vast majority, though, the age/wellness/mortality metric has held quite well.
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The difference between the possible 1000 deaths a day in the US in 2022 and near zero if everyone got the vaccine is something I’m sure some people will talk around, just like this thread.
If we climb back to a thousand a day should we let of all them know what awesome freedom fighters they were and their deaths were not in vain?
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BTW, the ENT's are swamped down here. As COVID has gone down, strep, flu, RSV, etc., are on the rise.
That's interesting...
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@loki said in 99.2% of recent Covid deaths are unvaccinated people:
The difference between the possible 1000 deaths a day in the US in 2022 and near zero if everyone got the vaccine is something I’m sure some people will talk around, just like this thread.
If we climb back to a thousand a day should we let of all them know what awesome freedom fighters they were and their deaths were not in vain?
Might want to find a better source than Newsweak....
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@jolly said in 99.2% of recent Covid deaths are unvaccinated people:
@loki said in 99.2% of recent Covid deaths are unvaccinated people:
The difference between the possible 1000 deaths a day in the US in 2022 and near zero if everyone got the vaccine is something I’m sure some people will talk around, just like this thread.
If we climb back to a thousand a day should we let of all them know what awesome freedom fighters they were and their deaths were not in vain?
Might want to find a better source than Newsweak....
Better yet we will look at the statistics a year from now. I’m done but will circle back and see what happened.
Looking forward to that.
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@kluurs said in 99.2% of recent Covid deaths are unvaccinated people:
Whenever someone tells me how healthy they are - or youthful and thus, clearly invincible from Covid, I think of my friend.
@jolly said:
But that's because the disease is predictable, but not predictable.
Carlson had some guy on his show last week who decided to not vax. "If I get it, it'll be the flu, and my family will be fine.
Idiot.
Tell that to D2.
There will be outliers...And in my limited observations, mostly genetic.
Saw a report that 25% of COVID-19 patients develop persistent symtptoms. 25% is not an outlier - it's just a bit more than one standard deviation from the mean.
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To be honest, I do believe my opinion will remain the same.
Got a call this morning. An elderly friend of mine died. I saw her a couple of days ago in the hospital...She was a CHF patient and lived years longer than she had any right to. She curtailed a few things for COVID, but not much. Life was to be lived.
She fell at a nearby Burger KIng a couple of weeks ago. Broke her patella and her femur in two places. She died with Terminal Delirium...If you don't know what that is, look it up, because you might would rather die with COVID.
Ain't no telling how long she might have lived, if she had just taken the COVID vaccine...
I'm not going to tell other people how to live their lives...Not in the matter of personal decisions. Not in the matter of a vaccine that cannot protect you from catching the disease. That's their choice.
Me? I'll take care of me.
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@jolly said in 99.2% of recent Covid deaths are unvaccinated people:
@kluurs said in 99.2% of recent Covid deaths are unvaccinated people:
I got the vaccine as early as possible. I think many/most anti-vax people are being foolish (the Bill Gates chip people, government mind control, etc.); however, I do know some intelligent people who have chosen not to vax - not for any particular reason other than the "what we don't know, that we don't know" - which I can understand.
One of the people I know that has so far refused to be vaccinated has a PhD from Northwestern. I don't consider her to be unintelligent.
Normally, you describe people with advanced degrees who do stupid shit as 'educated beyond their intelligence'.
Personally, I know plenty of people with doctorates who are fucking nutters. Sometimes I think it's a prerequisite.
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God forbid the delta variant and whatever the next possible mutation might do. Worrying signs are abound.
Check out cases and deaths trends in South Africa, all Delta variant inspired. Israel now says Pfizer is merely 70% protective from Delta infection and even serious effects have increased.
Tons of hubris here, something we will have to reflect on in the future.
