99.2% of recent Covid deaths are unvaccinated people
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@horace said in 99.2% of recent Covid deaths are unvaccinated people:
@loki said in 99.2% of recent Covid deaths are unvaccinated people:
@jolly said in 99.2% of recent Covid deaths are unvaccinated people:
@loki said in 99.2% of recent Covid deaths are unvaccinated people:
I guess we know the answer now. Remember that the next time you meet an anti-vaxxer and they give you that convoluted spiel and they are so cock sure they are right.
We are in Darwin Award territory.
Joyous bastard, aren't you?
I take no pleasure in people dying. But it's their decision whether to be vaccinated or not. Their decision whether to run the risk of vaccination or run the risk of disease.
Because the "vaccine" does not function as vaccines that we are used to...It does not work the same way, some of the long-term side-effects are unknown and it does not prevent vaccinated people from catching the disease they have been vaccinated against. Or maybe they simply can't take the vaccine.
Variants are going to happen. It's what viruses do. You can vaccinate until Hell freezes over, and since this vaccine does not keep people from getting the disease, some of the most interesting variants will probably arise from the rank of the vaccinated.
Maybe you'll get sick enough to die from one that the vaccine makers never saw coming. Well guess what, that's life. Impractical, improbable and never knowing what tomorrow will bring.
So don't live your life hating other people or cowering in your basement in fear. I made a few changes in my routine, but COVID lockdown didn't change my lifestyle a huge amount. Back when AIDS was first becoming prevalent and we didn't have a clue what it was or how it infected people, we cared for patients who were dying with the disease. That was a pretty good gut check. You eventually realize you just have to live life and what will be, will be.
We are not guaranteed tomorrow. None of us. Do what is practical, do what is right for you and let other people do what they feel is right for them.
The flaw in your assumption is that they have good information. The truth always comes out eventually. Any joy people may perceive is the relief that the bullshit is now exposed, so perhaps the note to self is to have more empathy for bullshit?
Nonsensical anti-vax rhetoric exists, and people who don't get vaccinated exist. I would be careful blaming the former for the existence of the latter though.
I think we all live with fears and we all have unique things we are afraid of so I hear you. Some have said when the FDA moves from emergency authorization to full approval they will take the vaccine. If that’s it, we’ll it’s statistically pretty risky but okay, stay alone and safe like we all did until that day comes.also obviously immunocomprised and young kids are real questions as well.
Conflating a vaccine with liberty and freedom is a huge reveal on the driver of the decision making and is proof of the politics involved.
I can be a centrist or even a conservative and not worry a lick about freedom and liberty when it comes to vaccines. We asked all our healthcare workers and food service people to put their lives at riisk during the height of the pandemic for the good of the nation and now freedom and liberty are at stake? I just can’t even…
@loki said in 99.2% of recent Covid deaths are unvaccinated people:
Conflating a vaccine with liberty and freedom is a huge reveal on the driver of the decision making and is proof of the politics involved.
People are free to get the vaccine or not. If you think people are avoiding the vaccine to make a point about freedom, you should probably try to disentangle their real reasons, or lack thereof. I'm comfortable with "because they don't feel like it", and I feel strongly that people who don't feel like getting the vaccine are not necessarily anti-social imbeciles. I also feel strongly that there should be no law forcing people to get the vaccine.
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@loki said in 99.2% of recent Covid deaths are unvaccinated people:
Conflating a vaccine with liberty and freedom is a huge reveal on the driver of the decision making and is proof of the politics involved.
People are free to get the vaccine or not. If you think people are avoiding the vaccine to make a point about freedom, you should probably try to disentangle their real reasons, or lack thereof. I'm comfortable with "because they don't feel like it", and I feel strongly that people who don't feel like getting the vaccine are not necessarily anti-social imbeciles. I also feel strongly that there should be no law forcing people to get the vaccine.
@horace said in 99.2% of recent Covid deaths are unvaccinated people:
@loki said in 99.2% of recent Covid deaths are unvaccinated people:
Conflating a vaccine with liberty and freedom is a huge reveal on the driver of the decision making and is proof of the politics involved.
People are free to get the vaccine or not. If you think people are avoiding the vaccine to make a point about freedom, you should probably try to disentangle their real reasons, or lack thereof. I'm comfortable with "because they don't feel like it", and I feel strongly that people who don't feel like getting the vaccine are not necessarily anti-social imbeciles. I also feel strongly that there should be no law forcing people to get the vaccine.
I don’t think there should be a mandatory vaccine either. I do think that as the evidence piles up we should separate fact from fiction. I always said the media should be held accountable for their TDS and exposed for their flagrant lies and mistruths. I am applying the same principle here.
I also don’t want some new variant to be the excuse why every child can’t be in person in our education system this fall. The longer Covid hangs out the more it mutates.
I have one purpose, which I articulated right from the beginning, let’s get this country and our economy operating at normal.
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And 95% were senior citizens… Why aren’t we talking about that number? People need to stop being old!
Fact is, if you are under 50, vaccinated or under vaccinated, you are at little personal risk. Great societal risk, but little personal.
As for autonomy, if it’s taken away whenever necessary for the public good, then it’s not autonomy.
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@jolly said in 99.2% of recent Covid deaths are unvaccinated people:
‘They who can give up essential liberty to obtain a little temporary safety, deserve neither liberty nor safety.’ - Benjamin Franklin
I think it’s fair to say that the least educated on both left and right are the ones who don’t want the vaccine. I’m quite sure Ben Franklin would have something to say about that.
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This thread reminds us of my father. He always prided himself on bringing us up to be independent thinkers. His failing was he assumed that any independent thinker would come to the same conclusions he did and was quite perplexed when all three of us came to wildly different conclusions.
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@horace said in 99.2% of recent Covid deaths are unvaccinated people:
@loki said in 99.2% of recent Covid deaths are unvaccinated people:
Conflating a vaccine with liberty and freedom is a huge reveal on the driver of the decision making and is proof of the politics involved.
People are free to get the vaccine or not. If you think people are avoiding the vaccine to make a point about freedom, you should probably try to disentangle their real reasons, or lack thereof. I'm comfortable with "because they don't feel like it", and I feel strongly that people who don't feel like getting the vaccine are not necessarily anti-social imbeciles. I also feel strongly that there should be no law forcing people to get the vaccine.
I don’t think there should be a mandatory vaccine either. I do think that as the evidence piles up we should separate fact from fiction. I always said the media should be held accountable for their TDS and exposed for their flagrant lies and mistruths. I am applying the same principle here.
I also don’t want some new variant to be the excuse why every child can’t be in person in our education system this fall. The longer Covid hangs out the more it mutates.
I have one purpose, which I articulated right from the beginning, let’s get this country and our economy operating at normal.
@loki said in 99.2% of recent Covid deaths are unvaccinated people:
I have one purpose, which I articulated right from the beginning, let’s get this country and our economy operating at normal.
You say that like there is some known way to make the country and economy normal.
If nobody had ever worn a mask covid might be totally gone by now, and everything would be normal.
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This thread reminds us of my father. He always prided himself on bringing us up to be independent thinkers. His failing was he assumed that any independent thinker would come to the same conclusions he did and was quite perplexed when all three of us came to wildly different conclusions.
@mik said in 99.2% of recent Covid deaths are unvaccinated people:
This thread reminds us of my father. He always prided himself on bringing us up to be independent thinkers. His failing was he assumed that any independent thinker would come to the same conclusions he did and was quite perplexed when all three of us came to wildly different conclusions.
And what is the rational conclusion of people not taking the vaccine other than my body my choice?
Can we just put the evidence up side by side?
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I got the vaccine as early as possible. I think many/most anti-vax people are being foolish (the Bill Gates chip people, government mind control, etc.); however, I do know some intelligent people who have chosen not to vax - not for any particular reason other than the "what we don't know, that we don't know" - which I can understand.
@kluurs said in 99.2% of recent Covid deaths are unvaccinated people:
I got the vaccine as early as possible.. I do know some intelligent people who have chosen not to vax - not for any particular reason other than the "what we don't know, that we don't know" - which I can understand.
A close friend of mine, a surgeon, has refused because he's skeptical of the mRNA technology, and that the vaccines were given "emergency use" approval - which, to his mind means "not completely tested."
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Frankly? If I was 10 years younger, I probably would’ve passed.
The Brad
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@mik said in 99.2% of recent Covid deaths are unvaccinated people:
This thread reminds us of my father. He always prided himself on bringing us up to be independent thinkers. His failing was he assumed that any independent thinker would come to the same conclusions he did and was quite perplexed when all three of us came to wildly different conclusions.
And what is the rational conclusion of people not taking the vaccine other than my body my choice?
Can we just put the evidence up side by side?
@loki said in 99.2% of recent Covid deaths are unvaccinated people:
@mik said in 99.2% of recent Covid deaths are unvaccinated people:
This thread reminds us of my father. He always prided himself on bringing us up to be independent thinkers. His failing was he assumed that any independent thinker would come to the same conclusions he did and was quite perplexed when all three of us came to wildly different conclusions.
And what is the rational conclusion of people not taking the vaccine other than my body my choice?
Can we just put the evidence up side by side?
Hi, Dad!
You are making the same mistake in assuming everyone will approach the issue on the same evidence basis you do, and even if they do will look at the same evidence. I do, but I also know a lot of people who do not approach it that way and see the vaccine in very different lights.
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Frankly? If I was 10 years younger, I probably would’ve passed.
@lufins-dad said in 99.2% of recent Covid deaths are unvaccinated people:
Frankly? If I was 10 years younger, I probably would’ve passed.
A close friend of mine is a 30 year old female ultramarathoner and triathlete. Running marathons was a nothing to her. I joked with her about a photo of her at mile 23 of a marathon with her smiling and happy. I noted she looked better late in the race than I did at the start. Her 4 year old brought home Covid from daycare. For the past several months, my friend has struggled to walk a few hundred feet. She has headaches and lost weight she didn't need to lose. Her sense of taste and smell have been affected. Whenever someone tells me how healthy they are - or youthful and thus, clearly invincible from Covid, I think of my friend.
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@lufins-dad said in 99.2% of recent Covid deaths are unvaccinated people:
Frankly? If I was 10 years younger, I probably would’ve passed.
A close friend of mine is a 30 year old female ultramarathoner and triathlete. Running marathons was a nothing to her. I joked with her about a photo of her at mile 23 of a marathon with her smiling and happy. I noted she looked better late in the race than I did at the start. Her 4 year old brought home Covid from daycare. For the past several months, my friend has struggled to walk a few hundred feet. She has headaches and lost weight she didn't need to lose. Her sense of taste and smell have been affected. Whenever someone tells me how healthy they are - or youthful and thus, clearly invincible from Covid, I think of my friend.
@kluurs said in 99.2% of recent Covid deaths are unvaccinated people:
@lufins-dad said in 99.2% of recent Covid deaths are unvaccinated people:
Frankly? If I was 10 years younger, I probably would’ve passed.
A close friend of mine is a 30 year old female ultramarathoner and triathlete. Running marathons was a nothing to her. I joked with her about a photo of her at mile 23 of a marathon with her smiling and happy. I noted she looked better late in the race than I did at the start. Her 4 year old brought home Covid from daycare. For the past several months, my friend has struggled to walk a few hundred feet. She has headaches and lost weight she didn't need to lose. Her sense of taste and smell have been affected. Whenever someone tells me how healthy they are - or youthful and thus, clearly invincible from Covid, I think of my friend.
But that's because the disease is predictable, but not predictable. There will be outliers...And in my limited observations, mostly genetic.
For the vast majority, though, the age/wellness/mortality metric has held quite well.
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The difference between the possible 1000 deaths a day in the US in 2022 and near zero if everyone got the vaccine is something I’m sure some people will talk around, just like this thread.
If we climb back to a thousand a day should we let of all them know what awesome freedom fighters they were and their deaths were not in vain?
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The difference between the possible 1000 deaths a day in the US in 2022 and near zero if everyone got the vaccine is something I’m sure some people will talk around, just like this thread.
If we climb back to a thousand a day should we let of all them know what awesome freedom fighters they were and their deaths were not in vain?
@loki said in 99.2% of recent Covid deaths are unvaccinated people:
The difference between the possible 1000 deaths a day in the US in 2022 and near zero if everyone got the vaccine is something I’m sure some people will talk around, just like this thread.
If we climb back to a thousand a day should we let of all them know what awesome freedom fighters they were and their deaths were not in vain?
Might want to find a better source than Newsweak....
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@loki said in 99.2% of recent Covid deaths are unvaccinated people:
The difference between the possible 1000 deaths a day in the US in 2022 and near zero if everyone got the vaccine is something I’m sure some people will talk around, just like this thread.
If we climb back to a thousand a day should we let of all them know what awesome freedom fighters they were and their deaths were not in vain?
Might want to find a better source than Newsweak....
@jolly said in 99.2% of recent Covid deaths are unvaccinated people:
@loki said in 99.2% of recent Covid deaths are unvaccinated people:
The difference between the possible 1000 deaths a day in the US in 2022 and near zero if everyone got the vaccine is something I’m sure some people will talk around, just like this thread.
If we climb back to a thousand a day should we let of all them know what awesome freedom fighters they were and their deaths were not in vain?
Might want to find a better source than Newsweak....
Better yet we will look at the statistics a year from now. I’m done but will circle back and see what happened.
Looking forward to that.
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@lufins-dad said in 99.2% of recent Covid deaths are unvaccinated people:
Frankly? If I was 10 years younger, I probably would’ve passed.
A close friend of mine is a 30 year old female ultramarathoner and triathlete. Running marathons was a nothing to her. I joked with her about a photo of her at mile 23 of a marathon with her smiling and happy. I noted she looked better late in the race than I did at the start. Her 4 year old brought home Covid from daycare. For the past several months, my friend has struggled to walk a few hundred feet. She has headaches and lost weight she didn't need to lose. Her sense of taste and smell have been affected. Whenever someone tells me how healthy they are - or youthful and thus, clearly invincible from Covid, I think of my friend.
@kluurs said in 99.2% of recent Covid deaths are unvaccinated people:
Whenever someone tells me how healthy they are - or youthful and thus, clearly invincible from Covid, I think of my friend.
@jolly said:
But that's because the disease is predictable, but not predictable.
Carlson had some guy on his show last week who decided to not vax. "If I get it, it'll be the flu, and my family will be fine.
Idiot.
Tell that to D2.
There will be outliers...And in my limited observations, mostly genetic.
Saw a report that 25% of COVID-19 patients develop persistent symtptoms. 25% is not an outlier - it's just a bit more than one standard deviation from the mean.
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To be honest, I do believe my opinion will remain the same.
Got a call this morning. An elderly friend of mine died. I saw her a couple of days ago in the hospital...She was a CHF patient and lived years longer than she had any right to. She curtailed a few things for COVID, but not much. Life was to be lived.
She fell at a nearby Burger KIng a couple of weeks ago. Broke her patella and her femur in two places. She died with Terminal Delirium...If you don't know what that is, look it up, because you might would rather die with COVID.
Ain't no telling how long she might have lived, if she had just taken the COVID vaccine...
I'm not going to tell other people how to live their lives...Not in the matter of personal decisions. Not in the matter of a vaccine that cannot protect you from catching the disease. That's their choice.
Me? I'll take care of me.
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@kluurs said in 99.2% of recent Covid deaths are unvaccinated people:
I got the vaccine as early as possible. I think many/most anti-vax people are being foolish (the Bill Gates chip people, government mind control, etc.); however, I do know some intelligent people who have chosen not to vax - not for any particular reason other than the "what we don't know, that we don't know" - which I can understand.
One of the people I know that has so far refused to be vaccinated has a PhD from Northwestern. I don't consider her to be unintelligent.
@jolly said in 99.2% of recent Covid deaths are unvaccinated people:
@kluurs said in 99.2% of recent Covid deaths are unvaccinated people:
I got the vaccine as early as possible. I think many/most anti-vax people are being foolish (the Bill Gates chip people, government mind control, etc.); however, I do know some intelligent people who have chosen not to vax - not for any particular reason other than the "what we don't know, that we don't know" - which I can understand.
One of the people I know that has so far refused to be vaccinated has a PhD from Northwestern. I don't consider her to be unintelligent.
Normally, you describe people with advanced degrees who do stupid shit as 'educated beyond their intelligence'.
Personally, I know plenty of people with doctorates who are fucking nutters. Sometimes I think it's a prerequisite.
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God forbid the delta variant and whatever the next possible mutation might do. Worrying signs are abound.
Check out cases and deaths trends in South Africa, all Delta variant inspired. Israel now says Pfizer is merely 70% protective from Delta infection and even serious effects have increased.
Tons of hubris here, something we will have to reflect on in the future.
