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The New Coffee Room

  1. TNCR
  2. General Discussion
  3. What’s with the prioritization of “essential” workers?

What’s with the prioritization of “essential” workers?

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  • AxtremusA Offline
    AxtremusA Offline
    Axtremus
    wrote on last edited by
    #16

    Maybe there is a class of workers who the nation cannot do without if, say, more than x% of them have to not work on any given day. Then you vaccinate them to the extent that you are actuarially comfortable that not more more than x% of them will be forced off work on any given day.

    I think that would still preserve the usual definition of the term "essential".

    Beyond that, I would intersect 'frontline' and 'essential' to prioritize, basically for people who (1) have to do essential work and (2) have to do it in a way or an environment that makes them interact with lots of other people.

    Doctor PhibesD 1 Reply Last reply
    • jon-nycJ jon-nyc

      I’m talking about vaccine prioritization only.

      There seems to be this idea that there’s a thing called “essentialness” with the property such that the more of it you have the higher up you are in the queue.

      I think that needs to be defended, and would be hard to defend if anyone tried.

      I haven’t even see anyone try.

      I have seen a lot of pieces arguing who has more “essentialness” than whom. But none arguing why vaccine prioritization should be based on it.

      L Offline
      L Offline
      Loki
      wrote on last edited by Loki
      #17

      @jon-nyc said in What’s with the prioritization of “essential” workers?:

      I’m talking about vaccine prioritization only.

      There seems to be this idea that there’s a thing called “essentialness” with the property such that the more of it you have the higher up you are in the queue.

      I think that needs to be defended, and would be hard to defend if anyone tried.

      I haven’t even see anyone try.

      I have seen a lot of pieces arguing who has more “essentialness” than whom. But none arguing why vaccine prioritization should be based on it.

      As a practical matter I think they sent most to hospitals for distribution just to get started. Most hospitals are doing only employees now and by tier. Covid unit, Covid patients first and then possibility of Covid exposure second.

      The logistics in doing this is amazing. First you create Health record, then you schedule, then you administer, then you schedule the second and all the while you have to keep track of all this stuf including supply. Oh and all your vaccinating locations need to be certified by the state and maybe the immunization registry.

      1 Reply Last reply
      • AxtremusA Axtremus

        Maybe there is a class of workers who the nation cannot do without if, say, more than x% of them have to not work on any given day. Then you vaccinate them to the extent that you are actuarially comfortable that not more more than x% of them will be forced off work on any given day.

        I think that would still preserve the usual definition of the term "essential".

        Beyond that, I would intersect 'frontline' and 'essential' to prioritize, basically for people who (1) have to do essential work and (2) have to do it in a way or an environment that makes them interact with lots of other people.

        Doctor PhibesD Offline
        Doctor PhibesD Offline
        Doctor Phibes
        wrote on last edited by
        #18

        A number of my customers have managed to designate themselves as 'essential'. If you knew them, you'd laugh. I know I did.

        I was only joking

        HoraceH 1 Reply Last reply
        • Doctor PhibesD Doctor Phibes

          A number of my customers have managed to designate themselves as 'essential'. If you knew them, you'd laugh. I know I did.

          HoraceH Online
          HoraceH Online
          Horace
          wrote on last edited by
          #19

          As far as I'm aware, all several thousand employees of the company I work for are considered essential.

          Education is extremely important.

          1 Reply Last reply
          • Doctor PhibesD Doctor Phibes

            Maybe the argument would be that "essential workers" are obliged to continue working, and therefore put themselves at higher risk of infection?

            It's sounds like bollocks to me.

            jon-nycJ Offline
            jon-nycJ Offline
            jon-nyc
            wrote on last edited by
            #20

            @doctor-phibes said in What’s with the prioritization of “essential” workers?:

            Maybe the argument would be that "essential workers" are obliged to continue working, and therefore put themselves at higher risk of infection?

            It's sounds like bollocks to me.

            I think that’s the intuition behind it, but note that’s just a justification for why the (political) decision was made.

            Only non-witches get due process.

            • Cotton Mather, Salem Massachusetts, 1692
            1 Reply Last reply
            • George KG Offline
              George KG Offline
              George K
              wrote on last edited by
              #21

              I disagree with her on many things, but she's always struck me as being a reasonable person:

              "Now look here, you Baltic gas passer... " - Mik, 6/14/08

              The saying, "Lite is just one damn thing after another," is a gross understatement. The damn things overlap.

              RenaudaR 1 Reply Last reply
              • Aqua LetiferA Offline
                Aqua LetiferA Offline
                Aqua Letifer
                wrote on last edited by
                #22

                E3936BEA-1368-4ABA-A5B2-B20829DF833F.jpeg

                Please love yourself.

                ? 1 Reply Last reply
                • AxtremusA Offline
                  AxtremusA Offline
                  Axtremus
                  wrote on last edited by Axtremus
                  #23

                  https://www.politico.com/news/2020/12/22/fauci-azar-receive-coronavirus-vaccines-449845

                  Anthony Fauci and Alex Azar just got their vaccines.

                  Do they need to be in front of the line so far ahead of @jon-nyc?

                  1 Reply Last reply
                  • HoraceH Online
                    HoraceH Online
                    Horace
                    wrote on last edited by
                    #24

                    I don’t really think any white male is morally eligible for a vaccine. It is time we, as a country, make some courageous and justified decisions to redress the horrible damage done by those people.

                    Education is extremely important.

                    CopperC 1 Reply Last reply
                    • HoraceH Horace

                      I don’t really think any white male is morally eligible for a vaccine. It is time we, as a country, make some courageous and justified decisions to redress the horrible damage done by those people.

                      CopperC Online
                      CopperC Online
                      Copper
                      wrote on last edited by
                      #25

                      @horace said in What’s with the prioritization of “essential” workers?:

                      white male is morally eligible for a vaccine.

                      I think some might be morally eligible for the vaccine.

                      Not all, of course

                      1 Reply Last reply
                      • MikM Offline
                        MikM Offline
                        Mik
                        wrote on last edited by
                        #26

                        Sure as hell not Jon. 😆

                        “I am fond of pigs. Dogs look up to us. Cats look down on us. Pigs treat us as equals.” ~Winston S. Churchill

                        1 Reply Last reply
                        • L Offline
                          L Offline
                          Loki
                          wrote on last edited by
                          #27

                          2/3 of Howard University Hospital workers won’t take the vaccine. Apparently our racist past is the cause of distrust.

                          Ergo no one should get the vaccine. Which is the way we felt about it until one week after the election anyway.

                          Don’t trust the vaccine was the mantra and now we have people all over the map on it. I guess that was Trumps fault too.

                          1 Reply Last reply
                          • jon-nycJ Offline
                            jon-nycJ Offline
                            jon-nyc
                            wrote on last edited by
                            #28

                            Sweet. Let’s hope most of these essential workers don’t trust it so we can get to the people at greater risk and save more lives.

                            Only non-witches get due process.

                            • Cotton Mather, Salem Massachusetts, 1692
                            1 Reply Last reply
                            • jon-nycJ Offline
                              jon-nycJ Offline
                              jon-nyc
                              wrote on last edited by
                              #29

                              Only non-witches get due process.

                              • Cotton Mather, Salem Massachusetts, 1692
                              AxtremusA 1 Reply Last reply
                              • CopperC Online
                                CopperC Online
                                Copper
                                wrote on last edited by
                                #30

                                Anti-vax kook

                                1 Reply Last reply
                                • George KG Offline
                                  George KG Offline
                                  George K
                                  wrote on last edited by
                                  #31

                                  https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-9070555/Half-states-want-prioritize-black-Hispanic-people-vaccine-rollout.html

                                  Every single US state is being advised to consider ethnic minorities as critical groups for vaccination with HALF prioritizing black and Hispanic residents over white...

                                  As a result, half of the nation's states have outlined plans that now prioritize black, Hispanic and indigenous residents over white people in some way, as the vaccine rollout begins.

                                  According to our analysis, 25 states have committed to a focus on racial and ethnic communities as they decided which groups should be prioritized in receiving a coronavirus vaccine dose.

                                  These include New Mexico, where collaboration with Native Americans is being prioritized; California, which has committed to ensuring black and Hispanic people have greater access to the vaccine; and Oregon, where health officials have said that ethnic minorities with have 'equitable access' to the shot.

                                  Some states have made even more specific plans to prioritize communities of color, with 12 states specifically mentioning efforts to partner with healthcare providers in areas with a large minority population to reach 'diverse populations', according to Kaiser Family Foundation.

                                  The CDC has also issued guidance on its Social Vulnerability Index (SVI) that uses 15 U.S. census variables to help local officials identify communities that may need support.

                                  It is being used in states such as Michigan where minority status and language spoken could be taken into consideration when deciding how high a priority you are for receiving a vaccine.

                                  Maine, in particular, has developed a 'Racial/Ethnic Minority COVID-19 Vaccination Plan' in an attempt to give a preference to groups that 'have experienced rates of disease that far exceed their representation in the population as a whole'.

                                  Just a reminder....
                                  Screen Shot 2020-12-23 at 7.04.26 AM.png Screen Shot 2020-12-23 at 7.04.01 AM.png

                                  "Now look here, you Baltic gas passer... " - Mik, 6/14/08

                                  The saying, "Lite is just one damn thing after another," is a gross understatement. The damn things overlap.

                                  CopperC 1 Reply Last reply
                                  • George KG George K

                                    https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-9070555/Half-states-want-prioritize-black-Hispanic-people-vaccine-rollout.html

                                    Every single US state is being advised to consider ethnic minorities as critical groups for vaccination with HALF prioritizing black and Hispanic residents over white...

                                    As a result, half of the nation's states have outlined plans that now prioritize black, Hispanic and indigenous residents over white people in some way, as the vaccine rollout begins.

                                    According to our analysis, 25 states have committed to a focus on racial and ethnic communities as they decided which groups should be prioritized in receiving a coronavirus vaccine dose.

                                    These include New Mexico, where collaboration with Native Americans is being prioritized; California, which has committed to ensuring black and Hispanic people have greater access to the vaccine; and Oregon, where health officials have said that ethnic minorities with have 'equitable access' to the shot.

                                    Some states have made even more specific plans to prioritize communities of color, with 12 states specifically mentioning efforts to partner with healthcare providers in areas with a large minority population to reach 'diverse populations', according to Kaiser Family Foundation.

                                    The CDC has also issued guidance on its Social Vulnerability Index (SVI) that uses 15 U.S. census variables to help local officials identify communities that may need support.

                                    It is being used in states such as Michigan where minority status and language spoken could be taken into consideration when deciding how high a priority you are for receiving a vaccine.

                                    Maine, in particular, has developed a 'Racial/Ethnic Minority COVID-19 Vaccination Plan' in an attempt to give a preference to groups that 'have experienced rates of disease that far exceed their representation in the population as a whole'.

                                    Just a reminder....
                                    Screen Shot 2020-12-23 at 7.04.26 AM.png Screen Shot 2020-12-23 at 7.04.01 AM.png

                                    CopperC Online
                                    CopperC Online
                                    Copper
                                    wrote on last edited by
                                    #32

                                    @george-k said in What’s with the prioritization of “essential” workers?:

                                    The CDC has also issued guidance on its Social Vulnerability Index (SVI) that uses 15 U.S. census variables to help local officials identify communities that may need support.

                                    I hope you guys remembered to identify as vulnerable person when you completed your census form.

                                    1 Reply Last reply
                                    • jon-nycJ Offline
                                      jon-nycJ Offline
                                      jon-nyc
                                      wrote on last edited by
                                      #33

                                      I was a little surprised that Trump’s plan did this too.

                                      Only non-witches get due process.

                                      • Cotton Mather, Salem Massachusetts, 1692
                                      jon-nycJ 1 Reply Last reply
                                      • LuFins DadL Offline
                                        LuFins DadL Offline
                                        LuFins Dad
                                        wrote on last edited by
                                        #34

                                        In all fairness, it seems that minorities are at a greater health risk for the disease and it is also spreading faster through their communities.

                                        As for the politicians, I understand the optics, but continuity and a functioning government are vital to beating this disease (too bad we haven’t had a functioning government in decades...) and 1000 vaccines going to officials is s drop in the bucket. If it’s causing a delay, it can be measured by the hour, not by days or weeks...

                                        The Brad

                                        1 Reply Last reply
                                        • jon-nycJ Offline
                                          jon-nycJ Offline
                                          jon-nyc
                                          wrote on last edited by jon-nyc
                                          #35

                                          That's true LD, but two points:

                                          1. It's worse for men than women. You don't even hear discussion about that in terms of prioritization, it's not eve brought up and knocked down.

                                          2. DO we really know if race is an actual risk factor? Or is it a correlate of true risk factors? IOW they're more likely to live in dense areas, take more risks, not be able to work from home, etc.

                                          I'm guessing its the latter. In which case prioritizing based on actual risk factors should 'make them whole'.

                                          Only non-witches get due process.

                                          • Cotton Mather, Salem Massachusetts, 1692
                                          LuFins DadL 1 Reply Last reply
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