NYT publishes Trump tax returns
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This tells us what we always knew about him, he’s better at playing successful mogul than actually being one.
These aren’t going to be legally interesting on their own in any novel way, the IRS has been auditing them for years.
The legally interesting bit is how all these massive loss claims interact with the various loan documents submitted at the same time. That’s where the fraud potential lies.
@jon-nyc said in NYT publishes Trump tax returns:
This tells us what we always knew about him, he’s better at playing successful mogul than actually being one.
Which is of course why he didn't want to release them. It's never been about legality. It's about his bullshit.
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Well the idea that he was hiding specific tax fraud in his returns never made sense because the Feds obviously had them.
But hiding them from bankers that might have received very different information is certainly in play here. Seems more likely than not given that he was able to get any loans at all.
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I still think the big news is the national security implications of nearly a half billion in personal debt.
Only non-witches get due process.
- Cotton Mather, Salem Massachusetts, 1692
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I still think the big news is the national security implications of nearly a half billion in personal debt.
@jon-nyc said in NYT publishes Trump tax returns:
I still think the big news is the national security implications of nearly a half billion in personal debt.
His supporters won't likely care much - they're going to say he's sticking it to the man, missing the obvious point that he's actually the man, at least for now. His creditors might, as you say.
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Forgot - saw this last night:
Obama Wrote Trump a $73 Million Check:
The New York Times’ big exposé on President Trump’s tax returns flags some things that may be dodgy but mainly it just confirms what everybody (including Trump) has always said — there are a lot of loopholes in the tax code that a savvy operator can exploit. Whose fault is that? The system long predates Trump’s political career. For me, one part of the story really stands out, though: “To turn that long arc of failure into a giant refund check,” says the Times, Trump “relied on some deft accounting footwork and an unwitting gift from an unlikely source — Mr. Obama.”
Huh? Obama’s stimulus policies led to the Obama IRS writing a check to Trump for $73 million. The Times explains that a business loss can be used as a coupon that can be redeemed against a gain in another business.
Until 2009, those coupons could be used to wipe away taxes going back only two years. But that November, the window was more than doubled by a little-noticed provision in a bill Mr. Obama signed as part of the Great Recession recovery effort. Now business owners could request full refunds of taxes paid in the prior four years, and 50 percent of those from the year before that.
Mr. Trump had paid no income taxes in 2008. But the change meant that when he filed his taxes for 2009, he could seek a refund of not just the $13.3 million he had paid in 2007, but also the combined $56.9 million paid in 2005 and 2006, when “The Apprentice” created what was likely the biggest income tax bite of his life.
The records reviewed by The Times indicate that Mr. Trump filed for the first of several tranches of his refund several weeks later, in January 2010. That set off what tax professionals refer to as a “quickie refund,” a check processed in 90 days on a tentative basis, pending an audit by the I.R.S.
His total federal income tax refund would eventually grow to $70.1 million, plus $2,733,184 in interest. He also received $21.2 million in state and local refunds, which often piggyback on federal filings.
Trump may have to pay back that money; an IRS audit and an investigation by the congressional Joint Committee on Taxation are pending. But if he doesn’t, it looks like an alternate headline of the Times story could have been: “Obama Policies Created a $73 Million Tax Refund for Trump.” I trust the Times will next be sending out formal letters of apology to those of us who argued Obama’s stimulus policies were unnecessary, wasteful, and bound to be abused.
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I still think the big news is the national security implications of nearly a half billion in personal debt.
@jon-nyc said in NYT publishes Trump tax returns:
I still think the big news is the national security implications of nearly a half billion in personal debt.
May be the Lincoln Project will make a “call at 3am” ad around this, with the call coming from one of Trump’s creditor demanding a certain veto or executive order.
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The US tax code is written by a big group of sleazy rich people. Why would it be a surprise that it benefits sleazy rich people like DJT?
Still, he's apparently continuing to claim it's all false, and he pays 10's of millions in tax.
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hops in DeLorean
sets dial back to 1995
hits 88 mph
finds 1995 self"In 25 years you will bang more chicks than George Michael and make more money than Donald Trump."
high fives
hops back in DeLorean"Now look here, you Baltic gas passer... " - Mik, 6/14/08
The saying, "Lite is just one damn thing after another," is a gross understatement. The damn things overlap.
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The NYT is saying he appears to be calling employee SS and taxes his taxes.
Debt's a funny thing - I could live the rest of my life on a tiny proportion of what he owes, and yet he's the one with the golden toilet and shower combination.
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hops in DeLorean
sets dial back to 1995
hits 88 mph
finds 1995 self"In 25 years you will bang more chicks than George Michael and make more money than Donald Trump."
high fives
hops back in DeLorean@George-K said in NYT publishes Trump tax returns:
hops in DeLorean
sets dial back to 1995
hits 88 mph
finds 1995 self
"In 25 years you will bang more chicks than George Michael and make more money than Donald Trump."
high fives
hops back in DeLoreanLol
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I don't expect Ax to have sense enough to understand this, but Jon certainly knows better.
I looked it up - just the golf courses alone generated 1.9 billion dollars in profit during his first 3 years in office. Now this will come as a shock to Ax, but it shouldn't surprise Jon... all his various businesses arent just piled together and reported on his personal income taxes. Each one of them will be its own corporation, with its own tax filing. A single golf course most likely will be several corporations. A hypothetical example might be.. golf course A is a corporation. There are golf carts for rent, so there would be a golf cart rental corporation that owns and maintains the golf carts, and the golf course rents space to the golf cart corporation. The cart corporation files taxes on cart rental revenue, the rent it pays the course is shown as an expense on the cart corporation's taxes, and shown as income on the course corporation. But until Trump writes himself a check none of that money gets reported on Trumps personal tax filing as income. They have a club. It should be a separate corporati9n. The club sells alcoholic beverages - the liquor and beer licenses belong to another corporation. They sell food. The restaurant will be another corporation, and so on. A single golf course could have a couple of dozen separate corporations, each one filing it's own separate taxes, and combined that one course could generate ten of millions of dollars in profits, but if Trump doesn't transfer any of it to his personal bank account, not one red cent will show up on his tax filing.
This is perfectly legal, and perfectly normal. Each of those corporations have the legal right to depreciation schedules to lessen their taxes , and all the other deductions that any other corporation gets to take. Next, suppose that over the last 20 years you had paid taxes on and banked a million dollars each year. That's 20 million in the bank with the taxes already paid on it, not subject to more taxes. This year you didn't pay yourself a single penny, but paid your personal expenses out of that 20 million. You would not owe a penny in taxes, even if you spent the entire 20 million.
That's why this "bombshell story" is ridiculous, and doesn't tell you a single thing about the man's income. Where will he get the 400 million, you ask? By simply writing himself a paycheck out of one of his corporations. He will then owe income taxes on it, but there will be deductions available to lessen the taxable portion, and of course he can simply write it as a loan and owe no taxes on it.
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The big scandal is the fact that he spent $70,000 on hair-styling.
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I don't expect Ax to have sense enough to understand this, but Jon certainly knows better.
I looked it up - just the golf courses alone generated 1.9 billion dollars in profit during his first 3 years in office. Now this will come as a shock to Ax, but it shouldn't surprise Jon... all his various businesses arent just piled together and reported on his personal income taxes. Each one of them will be its own corporation, with its own tax filing. A single golf course most likely will be several corporations. A hypothetical example might be.. golf course A is a corporation. There are golf carts for rent, so there would be a golf cart rental corporation that owns and maintains the golf carts, and the golf course rents space to the golf cart corporation. The cart corporation files taxes on cart rental revenue, the rent it pays the course is shown as an expense on the cart corporation's taxes, and shown as income on the course corporation. But until Trump writes himself a check none of that money gets reported on Trumps personal tax filing as income. They have a club. It should be a separate corporati9n. The club sells alcoholic beverages - the liquor and beer licenses belong to another corporation. They sell food. The restaurant will be another corporation, and so on. A single golf course could have a couple of dozen separate corporations, each one filing it's own separate taxes, and combined that one course could generate ten of millions of dollars in profits, but if Trump doesn't transfer any of it to his personal bank account, not one red cent will show up on his tax filing.
This is perfectly legal, and perfectly normal. Each of those corporations have the legal right to depreciation schedules to lessen their taxes , and all the other deductions that any other corporation gets to take. Next, suppose that over the last 20 years you had paid taxes on and banked a million dollars each year. That's 20 million in the bank with the taxes already paid on it, not subject to more taxes. This year you didn't pay yourself a single penny, but paid your personal expenses out of that 20 million. You would not owe a penny in taxes, even if you spent the entire 20 million.
That's why this "bombshell story" is ridiculous, and doesn't tell you a single thing about the man's income. Where will he get the 400 million, you ask? By simply writing himself a paycheck out of one of his corporations. He will then owe income taxes on it, but there will be deductions available to lessen the taxable portion, and of course he can simply write it as a loan and owe no taxes on it.
@Larry said in NYT publishes Trump tax returns:
I looked it up - just the golf courses alone generated 1.9 billion dollars in profit during his first 3 years in office.
Nonsense.
Only non-witches get due process.
- Cotton Mather, Salem Massachusetts, 1692
