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The New Coffee Room

  1. TNCR
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  3. Andrew Sullivan: This is very Weimar

Andrew Sullivan: This is very Weimar

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  • jon-nycJ Offline
    jon-nycJ Offline
    jon-nyc
    wrote on last edited by
    #72

    You can’t get through three posts without an insult and I’m the sixteen year old?

    Only non-witches get due process.

    • Cotton Mather, Salem Massachusetts, 1692
    1 Reply Last reply
    • Doctor PhibesD Offline
      Doctor PhibesD Offline
      Doctor Phibes
      wrote on last edited by
      #73

      You two should get a room separate sub-forum.

      I was only joking

      George KG 1 Reply Last reply
      • Doctor PhibesD Doctor Phibes

        You two should get a room separate sub-forum.

        George KG Offline
        George KG Offline
        George K
        wrote on last edited by
        #74

        @Doctor-Phibes said in Andrew Sullivan: This is very Weimar:

        You two should get a room separate sub-forum.

        Jon's a mod. He could probably set it up...

        "Now look here, you Baltic gas passer... " - Mik, 6/14/08

        The saying, "Lite is just one damn thing after another," is a gross understatement. The damn things overlap.

        Doctor PhibesD 1 Reply Last reply
        • George KG George K

          @Doctor-Phibes said in Andrew Sullivan: This is very Weimar:

          You two should get a room separate sub-forum.

          Jon's a mod. He could probably set it up...

          Doctor PhibesD Offline
          Doctor PhibesD Offline
          Doctor Phibes
          wrote on last edited by
          #75

          @George-K said in Andrew Sullivan: This is very Weimar:

          @Doctor-Phibes said in Andrew Sullivan: This is very Weimar:

          You two should get a room separate sub-forum.

          Jon's a mod. He could probably set it up...

          He could, and then not allow Horace posting privileges.

          I was only joking

          1 Reply Last reply
          • HoraceH Offline
            HoraceH Offline
            Horace
            wrote on last edited by
            #76

            jon's already blocked all my great ideas from his mind. It's not dissimilar to blocking me from posting to a private sub forum.

            Education is extremely important.

            1 Reply Last reply
            • jon-nycJ Offline
              jon-nycJ Offline
              jon-nyc
              wrote on last edited by
              #77

              It would be the other way around. I’d set up a subforum for your great ideas and then never go there.

              Only non-witches get due process.

              • Cotton Mather, Salem Massachusetts, 1692
              1 Reply Last reply
              • jon-nycJ jon-nyc

                That’s quite disingenuous as you know full well I blame the far left constantly for the action and the moderate left for the enabling. You participate in threads where I do that all the time.

                Keep in mind all of this is in response to Trump warning us about what Biden’s America might look like by showing us footage of what Trump’s America actually looks like.

                taiwan_girlT Offline
                taiwan_girlT Offline
                taiwan_girl
                wrote on last edited by
                #78

                @jon-nyc said in Andrew Sullivan: This is very Weimar:

                Keep in mind all of this is in response to Trump warning us about what Biden’s America might look like by showing us footage of what Trump’s America actually looks like.

                I have to admit this is kind of funny. President Trump shows videos and talks about what is happening as what would happen under President Biden.

                Wait a second????!!! Who is the president right now? LOL

                1 Reply Last reply
                • jon-nycJ Offline
                  jon-nycJ Offline
                  jon-nyc
                  wrote on last edited by
                  #79

                  Yeah the subtext of the convention was basically ‘if Trump were president none of this would be happening’.

                  Only non-witches get due process.

                  • Cotton Mather, Salem Massachusetts, 1692
                  1 Reply Last reply
                  • HoraceH Offline
                    HoraceH Offline
                    Horace
                    wrote on last edited by
                    #80

                    It makes perfect sense for Trump to point to the riots and run against them. The only people guffawing are the people who don't like him anyway and are only too happy to blame bad stuff on him, no matter how flimsy the connection.

                    Education is extremely important.

                    taiwan_girlT 1 Reply Last reply
                    • HoraceH Horace

                      It makes perfect sense for Trump to point to the riots and run against them. The only people guffawing are the people who don't like him anyway and are only too happy to blame bad stuff on him, no matter how flimsy the connection.

                      taiwan_girlT Offline
                      taiwan_girlT Offline
                      taiwan_girl
                      wrote on last edited by
                      #81

                      @Horace I agree it makes perfect sense, but don’t you see the ironic in what he says?

                      Doctor PhibesD 1 Reply Last reply
                      • HoraceH Offline
                        HoraceH Offline
                        Horace
                        wrote on last edited by
                        #82

                        Yes, I understand why you think it is ironic.

                        Education is extremely important.

                        1 Reply Last reply
                        • RainmanR Offline
                          RainmanR Offline
                          Rainman
                          wrote on last edited by
                          #83

                          Jon said somewhere above:

                          What I am doing is saying that
                          (1) his general divisiveness feeds this
                          (2) his words and deeds have served to fan the flames
                          (3). Different words and deeds could have cooled the flames or at least fanned them less

                          Funny, that's EXACTLY what I thought about Obama. I remember times (e.g., black college prof breaking into his own house, police showed up) as well as other times when Obama actually invited the issue (person) to the White House.
                          And, I remember thinking how he smiles and acts all superior-like with his lofty intellectualism, where it was obvious what he was doing was fanning the flames to deteriorate race relations. I still think Obama does the same thing: pretend to unite while actually working to divide, the guy in general doesn't like white people.

                          So we're back to Sweep Under Your Own Porch land.

                          1 Reply Last reply
                          • MikM Mik

                            @jon-nyc said in Andrew Sullivan: This is very Weimar:

                            @Horace said in Andrew Sullivan: This is very Weimar:

                            point to the riots and say "this is Trump's America". Even jon buys into that tribal mantra. As ideas go, it is not a rational one.

                            Well, to be fair I use that phrase to point out the absurdity of Trump calling it ‘Biden’s America’.

                            Having said that, surely presidents will differ in where they fall on the (as W might put it) “uniter vs divider’ scale. Surely presidents differ in how they respond to widespread protests, from taking steps to lower the pressure on one hand to publicly antagonizing and threatening on the other.

                            Honestly I think people here say to themselves “but these rioters aren’t by and large Trump supporters” and from that facile comment completely absolve him from any causal role.

                            OK, I'll go there with you. Show me how Trump has a causal role in the current situation. What has he done to cause or increase police brutality toward blacks? To diminish civil rights? To my eyes these riots and protests started before he even took office. If you want to say that it is because some people do not like Trump and don't want him to be president, fine. But it's not as far as I can see attributable to anything he has actually done.

                            JollyJ Offline
                            JollyJ Offline
                            Jolly
                            wrote on last edited by
                            #84

                            @Mik said in Andrew Sullivan: This is very Weimar:

                            @jon-nyc said in Andrew Sullivan: This is very Weimar:

                            @Horace said in Andrew Sullivan: This is very Weimar:

                            point to the riots and say "this is Trump's America". Even jon buys into that tribal mantra. As ideas go, it is not a rational one.

                            Well, to be fair I use that phrase to point out the absurdity of Trump calling it ‘Biden’s America’.

                            Having said that, surely presidents will differ in where they fall on the (as W might put it) “uniter vs divider’ scale. Surely presidents differ in how they respond to widespread protests, from taking steps to lower the pressure on one hand to publicly antagonizing and threatening on the other.

                            Honestly I think people here say to themselves “but these rioters aren’t by and large Trump supporters” and from that facile comment completely absolve him from any causal role.

                            OK, I'll go there with you. Show me how Trump has a causal role in the current situation. What has he done to cause or increase police brutality toward blacks? To diminish civil rights? To my eyes these riots and protests started before he even took office. If you want to say that it is because some people do not like Trump and don't want him to be president, fine. But it's not as far as I can see attributable to anything he has actually done.

                            Nah, Ferguson didn't happen. Nor did either of the Los Angeles riots. Or the absolute clusterfuck that happened in Detroit. Or the murder rate in certain sections of Chicago. Or the challenge that I double-dog dare John to stroll down MLK Boulevard in New Orleans at 3 AM.

                            Let's call a spade a spade, shall we?

                            The fact is that a large percentage of the black community are nothing but a pile of do-nothing, go nowhere, drug-dealing, violent, low-life muthafuckers. And we ought to be proud, because we helped make them that way. Take away a man's dignity and you have less of a man. Take away his responsibilities and you have less of a man. Take away his pride and you have less of a man. Reinforce his expectations of inadequacy and feed him a steady stream from the government teat and marvel in what the Do-gooders have created...A permanent class of gibmedats.The

                            God save us from the Do-gooders.

                            Give the black man a shot at a good education or training. Give him access to business planning and teach him how to use a receptive banking system to grow his business. And his dreams. Then, if he fails, he fails. There is no one to feel pity for and no one to blame.

                            “Cry havoc and let slip the DOGE of war!”

                            Those who cheered as J-6 American prisoners were locked in solitary for 18 months without trial, now suddenly fight tooth and nail for foreign terrorists’ "due process". — Buck Sexton

                            1 Reply Last reply
                            • taiwan_girlT taiwan_girl

                              @Horace I agree it makes perfect sense, but don’t you see the ironic in what he says?

                              Doctor PhibesD Offline
                              Doctor PhibesD Offline
                              Doctor Phibes
                              wrote on last edited by
                              #85

                              @taiwan_girl said in Andrew Sullivan: This is very Weimar:

                              @Horace I agree it makes perfect sense, but don’t you see the ironic in what he says?

                              He's blamed the last four years on Obama, he can blame the next four on Biden.

                              I was only joking

                              1 Reply Last reply
                              • MikM Mik

                                @jon-nyc said in Andrew Sullivan: This is very Weimar:

                                @Horace said in Andrew Sullivan: This is very Weimar:

                                point to the riots and say "this is Trump's America". Even jon buys into that tribal mantra. As ideas go, it is not a rational one.

                                Well, to be fair I use that phrase to point out the absurdity of Trump calling it ‘Biden’s America’.

                                Having said that, surely presidents will differ in where they fall on the (as W might put it) “uniter vs divider’ scale. Surely presidents differ in how they respond to widespread protests, from taking steps to lower the pressure on one hand to publicly antagonizing and threatening on the other.

                                Honestly I think people here say to themselves “but these rioters aren’t by and large Trump supporters” and from that facile comment completely absolve him from any causal role.

                                OK, I'll go there with you. Show me how Trump has a causal role in the current situation. What has he done to cause or increase police brutality toward blacks? To diminish civil rights? To my eyes these riots and protests started before he even took office. If you want to say that it is because some people do not like Trump and don't want him to be president, fine. But it's not as far as I can see attributable to anything he has actually done.

                                AxtremusA Away
                                AxtremusA Away
                                Axtremus
                                wrote on last edited by Axtremus
                                #86

                                @Mik said in Andrew Sullivan: This is very Weimar:

                                @jon-nyc said in Andrew Sullivan: This is very Weimar:

                                @Horace said in Andrew Sullivan: This is very Weimar:

                                point to the riots and say "this is Trump's America". Even jon buys into that tribal mantra. As ideas go, it is not a rational one.

                                Well, to be fair I use that phrase to point out the absurdity of Trump calling it ‘Biden’s America’.

                                OK, I'll go there with you. Show me how Trump has a causal role in the current situation.

                                A Vox article by Matthew Yglesias showing what @Mik asked:

                                https://www.vox.com/21408085/donald-trump-america-rioting

                                Mr. Yglesias's main points seem to be:

                                • Trump is defunding the police
                                • Trump encourages bad policing
                                • (this one is on sin of omission) Trump makes no effort at working out police reform package with the legislative branch
                                1 Reply Last reply
                                • jon-nycJ jon-nyc

                                  Both of you are essentially arguing that he couldn’t have prevented the outbreak of protests ergo how they ran their course was out of his hands.

                                  Like nothing else he could do or say could matter in how the protests/riots unfolded.

                                  KincaidK Offline
                                  KincaidK Offline
                                  Kincaid
                                  wrote on last edited by
                                  #87

                                  @jon-nyc said in Andrew Sullivan: This is very Weimar:

                                  Both of you are essentially arguing that he couldn’t have prevented the outbreak of protests ergo how they ran their course was out of his hands.

                                  Like nothing else he could do or say could matter in how the protests/riots unfolded.

                                  I agree. Trump should have come out after Floyd was killed and said, "If I had a son, he'd look like George. I mean, if I had banged Omarosa."

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