NPR interviews author of book who says "Looting is OK."
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Looting should obviously not be part of a protest. Murder should obviously not be part of an arrest. Choose your outrage I guess.
@Aqua-Letifer said in NPR interviews author of book who says "Looting is OK.":
Looting should obviously not be part of a protest. Murder should obviously not be part of an arrest. Choose your outrage I guess.
The aggregate cultural response is that white cops shooting black guys is a symptom of the worst institutionalized evil of our society, while the looting is a regrettable side effect of an otherwise justified response to the evil.
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@Aqua-Letifer said in NPR interviews author of book who says "Looting is OK.":
Looting should obviously not be part of a protest. Murder should obviously not be part of an arrest. Choose your outrage I guess.
The aggregate cultural response is that white cops shooting black guys is a symptom of the worst institutionalized evil of our society, while the looting is a regrettable side effect of an otherwise justified response to the evil.
@Horace said in NPR interviews author of book who says "Looting is OK.":
@Aqua-Letifer said in NPR interviews author of book who says "Looting is OK.":
Looting should obviously not be part of a protest. Murder should obviously not be part of an arrest. Choose your outrage I guess.
The aggregate cultural response is that white cops shooting black guys is a symptom of the worst institutionalized evil of our society, while the looting is a regrettable side effect of an otherwise justified response to the evil.
Righty response is that looters are a symptom of the worst institutionalized evil of our society, while police brutality is a regrettable side effect of an otherwise justified response to the evil.
Both are pretty ridiculous but as I said, it's based on which mental model (protesters or cops) you feel more comfortable with.
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Any appeal to what I personally think is unintentional. I am trying to say what I believe our aggregate cultural response is.
There is no power in claiming both sides are equal, and no particular brilliance in it. Much to the chagrin of everybody who realizes their favorite side is probably more at fault than the other side is.
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@Aqua: Bullshit. Neither are OK. But declaring one a racist evil when facts say otherwise, which is often the case with police violence, does not make it so. There is no similar defense for looting.
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@Aqua: Bullshit. Neither are OK. But declaring one a racist evil when facts say otherwise, which is often the case with police violence, does not make it so. There is no similar defense for looting.
@Mik said in NPR interviews author of book who says "Looting is OK.":
@Aqua: Bullshit. Neither are OK. But declaring one a racist evil when facts say otherwise, which is often the case with police violence, does not make it so. There is no similar defense for looting.
It's not a perfect equality thing like Horace mentioned, but I'm saying that where your outrage lies says a lot about you as a person. The "looting is okay" crap is really troubling. But I find "well, the people who died from police—quick let's find out if they were on drugs or have a record so I don't have to care about their deaths and take a look at that LOOTING" interesting and weird.
Please love yourself.
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I agree that litigating these incidents is more trouble than it's worth. You don't want your position to hinge on the cops not being racist murderers. Maybe they were. Or, more realistically, maybe they can be framed that way sufficiently that questioning out loud whether they were, would be social suicide.
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@Horace said in NPR interviews author of book who says "Looting is OK.":
@Aqua-Letifer said in NPR interviews author of book who says "Looting is OK.":
Looting should obviously not be part of a protest. Murder should obviously not be part of an arrest. Choose your outrage I guess.
The aggregate cultural response is that white cops shooting black guys is a symptom of the worst institutionalized evil of our society, while the looting is a regrettable side effect of an otherwise justified response to the evil.
Righty response is that looters are a symptom of the worst institutionalized evil of our society, while police brutality is a regrettable side effect of an otherwise justified response to the evil.
Both are pretty ridiculous but as I said, it's based on which mental model (protesters or cops) you feel more comfortable with.
@Aqua-Letifer said in NPR interviews author of book who says "Looting is OK.":
@Horace said in NPR interviews author of book who says "Looting is OK.":
@Aqua-Letifer said in NPR interviews author of book who says "Looting is OK.":
Looting should obviously not be part of a protest. Murder should obviously not be part of an arrest. Choose your outrage I guess.
The aggregate cultural response is that white cops shooting black guys is a symptom of the worst institutionalized evil of our society, while the looting is a regrettable side effect of an otherwise justified response to the evil.
Righty response is that looters are a symptom of the worst institutionalized evil of our society, while police brutality is a regrettable side effect of an otherwise justified response to the evil.
Both are pretty ridiculous but as I said, it's based on which mental model (protesters or cops) you feel more comfortable with.
Both are awful. No one tries to sell police brutality quite like looting is okay though.
NPR listeners are struggling today if they had it all wrong and looting is good. Hahahaha.
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@Mik said in NPR interviews author of book who says "Looting is OK.":
@Aqua: Bullshit. Neither are OK. But declaring one a racist evil when facts say otherwise, which is often the case with police violence, does not make it so. There is no similar defense for looting.
It's not a perfect equality thing like Horace mentioned, but I'm saying that where your outrage lies says a lot about you as a person. The "looting is okay" crap is really troubling. But I find "well, the people who died from police—quick let's find out if they were on drugs or have a record so I don't have to care about their deaths and take a look at that LOOTING" interesting and weird.
@Aqua-Letifer said in NPR interviews author of book who says "Looting is OK.":
@Mik said in NPR interviews author of book who says "Looting is OK.":
@Aqua: Bullshit. Neither are OK. But declaring one a racist evil when facts say otherwise, which is often the case with police violence, does not make it so. There is no similar defense for looting.
It's not a perfect equality thing like Horace mentioned, but I'm saying that where your outrage lies says a lot about you as a person. The "looting is okay" crap is really troubling. But I find "well, the people who died from police—quick let's find out if they were on drugs or have a record so I don't have to care about their deaths and take a look at that LOOTING" interesting and weird.
No one is saying that. What is being done is looking at the entire picture, not through the lens of desired outrage situation. The recent incidents can in no coherent way be connected to racism other than it was a black person who died. The racism part is simply assumed.
I'm not comfortable with any of it. What I am interested in is seeing if there are ways to reduce these events. The problem with that approach is you have to hold both parties accountable for their actions and that is not being done in any meaningful way.
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@Aqua-Letifer said in NPR interviews author of book who says "Looting is OK.":
@Mik said in NPR interviews author of book who says "Looting is OK.":
@Aqua: Bullshit. Neither are OK. But declaring one a racist evil when facts say otherwise, which is often the case with police violence, does not make it so. There is no similar defense for looting.
It's not a perfect equality thing like Horace mentioned, but I'm saying that where your outrage lies says a lot about you as a person. The "looting is okay" crap is really troubling. But I find "well, the people who died from police—quick let's find out if they were on drugs or have a record so I don't have to care about their deaths and take a look at that LOOTING" interesting and weird.
No one is saying that. What is being done is looking at the entire picture, not through the lens of desired outrage situation. The recent incidents can in no coherent way be connected to racism other than it was a black person who died. The racism part is simply assumed.
I'm not comfortable with any of it. What I am interested in is seeing if there are ways to reduce these events. The problem with that approach is you have to hold both parties accountable for their actions and that is not being done in any meaningful way.
@Mik said in NPR interviews author of book who says "Looting is OK.":
What is being done is looking at the entire picture, not through the lens of desired outrage situation. The recent incidents can in no coherent way be connected to racism other than it was a black person who died. The racism part is simply assumed.
Oh yeah well I'm not talking about that. I think everyone on this board is smart enough to know "the police" don't hate black people. (Heck I think we all know better than to believe in a concept of "the police" anyway.) It's a stupid narrative.
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Then how is the conversation not centered around ways to defeat that narrative? That narrative is the fuel of the fire, is it not?
@Horace said in NPR interviews author of book who says "Looting is OK.":
Then how is the conversation not centered around ways to defeat that narrative? That narrative is the fuel of the fire, is it not?
I think it beats out Trump's possible contest of the election results as the biggest threat to stability we face today. But there's no beating it, I don't think. There aren't enough people out there trying to figure out where the truth is. You have lefties ginning up incidents that could get violent, experimenting with anarchy, and you have Trump's side doing whatever you might call it, and a whole bunch of people in the middle paying attention to how the tide's moving. But I don't think enough people are seeking facts, I think that's done.
You got any ideas? All I have is trying to call bullshit where one sees it, and as a fallback plan buying ammo and making sure your passport's still valid.
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Well no I think the racism narrative has been carefully cultivated as the most powerful cultural cudgel. You won't get people who see it as their path to power, not to use it. They spent their lives forging that weapon, they're not just going to hang it over the hearth and enjoy a nice quiet peaceful life. I don't see any way that it won't remain the most important cultural idea in America for the rest of our lives. But like you, we can all call BS when we see it. I mean, to the extent that we can do so without sacrificing our economic lives.
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@Mik said in NPR interviews author of book who says "Looting is OK.":
@Aqua: Bullshit. Neither are OK. But declaring one a racist evil when facts say otherwise, which is often the case with police violence, does not make it so. There is no similar defense for looting.
It's not a perfect equality thing like Horace mentioned, but I'm saying that where your outrage lies says a lot about you as a person. The "looting is okay" crap is really troubling. But I find "well, the people who died from police—quick let's find out if they were on drugs or have a record so I don't have to care about their deaths and take a look at that LOOTING" interesting and weird.
@Aqua-Letifer said in NPR interviews author of book who says "Looting is OK.":
"well, the people who died from police—quick let's find out if they were on drugs or have a record so I don't have to care about their deaths and take a look at that LOOTING" interesting and weird.
No need to be quick, as long as justice is served in the end.
Have we found a guy yet who was shot and was clean?
No need to look that up, I still wouldn't care all that much. I'm really more interested in finding the police department that has a policy that says it is OK to shoot unarmed people. Without that we don't have much to be fixed.
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Apparently the book is more about legitimizing violence in general, not just looting.
https://www.theatlantic.com/ideas/archive/2020/09/there-no-defense-looting/615925/
