Did anybody see Jon in line yesterday?
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@Horace said in Did anybody see Jon in line yesterday?:
There might be a chance that a steady diet of hate-messaging against him has warped your view, if you find him to be the most dislikable person on the planet.
There's only one source of information that counts for me: What Trump himself does and says.
For me, he's not a devil, or a fascist, or evil. Maybe he is even the better choice compared to Harris. But he's the opposite of a likeable person. The constant self-aggrandizing alone would make me want to punch him if I'd be at the same party.
@Klaus said in Did anybody see Jon in line yesterday?:
@Horace said in Did anybody see Jon in line yesterday?:
There might be a chance that a steady diet of hate-messaging against him has warped your view, if you find him to be the most dislikable person on the planet.
There's only one source of information that counts for me: What Trump himself does and says.
For me, he's not a devil, or a fascist, or evil. Maybe he is even the better choice compared to Harris. But he's the opposite of a likeable person. The constant self-aggrandizing alone would make me want to punch him if I'd be at the same party.
He was a relatively popular, if clownish, character in his pre-politics career.
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IIRC, the first mention of Trump in TNCR was Larry calling him a clown.
Before he drank the cool aid. Before the cool aid was even poured.
@jon-nyc said in Did anybody see Jon in line yesterday?:
IIRC, the first mention of Trump in TNCR was Larry calling him a clown.
Before he drank the cool aid. Before the cool aid was even poured.
The interesting thing about Trump is how he weaved some sort of (Jacksonian?) magic into the lives of working class white Americans. He inspired them to "take their country back." Trump sion of some vastly rich NYC real estate empire--bonds with coal miners in Appalachia. Who'd a thunk it?
But it's not real. It's a fantasy. And everybody is playing their part in the play. This is really what Post-Structuralism looks like.
You are what you pretend to be.
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@jon-nyc said in Did anybody see Jon in line yesterday?:
IIRC, the first mention of Trump in TNCR was Larry calling him a clown.
Before he drank the cool aid. Before the cool aid was even poured.
The interesting thing about Trump is how he weaved some sort of (Jacksonian?) magic into the lives of working class white Americans. He inspired them to "take their country back." Trump sion of some vastly rich NYC real estate empire--bonds with coal miners in Appalachia. Who'd a thunk it?
But it's not real. It's a fantasy. And everybody is playing their part in the play. This is really what Post-Structuralism looks like.
You are what you pretend to be.
@Tom-K said in Did anybody see Jon in line yesterday?:
@jon-nyc said in Did anybody see Jon in line yesterday?:
IIRC, the first mention of Trump in TNCR was Larry calling him a clown.
Before he drank the cool aid. Before the cool aid was even poured.
The interesting thing about Trump is how he weaved some sort of (Jacksonian?) magic into the lives of working class white Americans. He inspired them to "take their country back." Trump sion of some vastly rich NYC real estate empire--bonds with coal miners in Appalachia. Who'd a thunk it?
But it's not real. It's a fantasy. And everybody is playing their part in the play. This is really what Post-Structuralism looks like.
You are what you pretend to be.
It's as real as anything else in politics. I find the perspective that "Kamala cares more about you" to be extremely unsatisfying.
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@Jolly said in Did anybody see Jon in line yesterday?:
The most fascinating thing about this video is quite literally everyone is fat. Not a single person there is fit.
I know no one here will seriously engage with this post, so go ahead and tell me why noticing this makes me a TDS-addled libtard.
But after you do that, I would invite you to ponder the question. It really is uncanny. It’s one of the most remarkable correlations in political science.
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@Jolly said in Did anybody see Jon in line yesterday?:
The most fascinating thing about this video is quite literally everyone is fat. Not a single person there is fit.
I know no one here will seriously engage with this post, so go ahead and tell me why noticing this makes me a TDS-addled libtard.
But after you do that, I would invite you to ponder the question. It really is uncanny. It’s one of the most remarkable correlations in political science.
@jon-nyc said in Did anybody see Jon in line yesterday?:
@Jolly said in Did anybody see Jon in line yesterday?:
The most fascinating thing about this video is quite literally everyone is fat. Not a single person there is fit.
I know no one here will seriously engage with this post, so go ahead and tell me why noticing this makes me a bad person.
But after you tell me how bad my TDS is, I would invite you to ponder the question. It really is remarkable.
Nobody is going to seriously engage your adolescent fixation on calling people fat? I mean you used to be at least smart enough to understand the concept of overlapping distributions. Just how much of a correlation with your pet hatreds do you think there is with BMI? Or are we supposed to seriously engage with your anecdotal observations instead?
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@jon-nyc said in Did anybody see Jon in line yesterday?:
@Jolly said in Did anybody see Jon in line yesterday?:
The most fascinating thing about this video is quite literally everyone is fat. Not a single person there is fit.
I know no one here will seriously engage with this post, so go ahead and tell me why noticing this makes me a bad person.
But after you tell me how bad my TDS is, I would invite you to ponder the question. It really is remarkable.
Nobody is going to seriously engage your adolescent fixation on calling people fat? I mean you used to be at least smart enough to understand the concept of overlapping distributions. Just how much of a correlation with your pet hatreds do you think there is with BMI? Or are we supposed to seriously engage with your anecdotal observations instead?
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@jon-nyc said in Did anybody see Jon in line yesterday?:
Ok yes we can stipulate that I’m a TDS addled librard.
Now why are Trump supporters so fat? Which way does the causal relationship run?
I actually asked you to specify the sort of correlation we're discussing. Do you have some numbers, or just anecdotal observations? I'm honestly not sure. But I am sure of your pet hatreds, and your fixation on all things considered cool or uncool by adolescents. Of course it's not surprising if you think you've uncovered a connection between them. I mean please feel free to write a paper about it, your insights might be valuable. Or if not a paper, maybe a post. Get into why you think the connection exists.
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Is there a correlation between BMI and political affiliation among whites?
Yes, some research has shown a correlation between Body Mass Index (BMI) and political affiliation among white Americans, though it’s complex and context-dependent. Studies have indicated that higher BMI is sometimes more common among white individuals who identify as politically conservative, compared to those who identify as liberal. However, these findings are nuanced and may be influenced by various cultural, economic, and geographic factors.
The relationship between BMI and political affiliation has been suggested to stem partly from lifestyle differences associated with political subcultures in the United States. For example, conservatives may be more likely to live in rural areas where obesity rates tend to be higher due to factors such as limited access to health resources, food deserts, and lifestyle differences. Liberals, in contrast, are more likely to live in urban areas where there might be greater access to health-conscious food options and fitness facilities. However, these are general trends, and individual BMI varies widely within any political group.
How about Trump supporters? They’re not necessarily conservative but they seem to skew towards obesity.
Research has indicated that, on average, Trump supporters have higher obesity rates compared to supporters of other political candidates. However, this trend is influenced by a range of factors that go beyond political preference. Demographic and geographic patterns among Trump supporters—such as a higher likelihood of living in rural or suburban areas, where obesity rates tend to be higher—contribute to this trend. Additionally, lower income levels, educational disparities, and lifestyle factors prevalent in these regions can also contribute to higher average BMIs among these groups.
This correlation does not imply that being a Trump supporter causes higher BMI, but rather that many Trump supporters come from demographics and regions where obesity is more prevalent. Individual health behaviors and resources available in these areas, like access to nutritious food and healthcare, also play a significant role in shaping these health trends.
Can you share data that has been published?
Data suggests a notable correlation between higher BMI and support for Donald Trump, particularly in states with large rural populations where obesity rates tend to be higher. A Reddit analysis found a positive correlation (r=0.717) between Trump voter proportions and higher BMI rates in U.S. states. This trend can be linked to demographic factors, as many Trump supporters reside in regions with limited access to healthy food options and fewer resources for health and fitness, commonly associated with rural and working-class areas. Additionally, Trump supporters have higher reported rates of chronic conditions like high blood pressure and joint pain, likely influenced by the age distribution among these voters, as older adults also have higher obesity rates  .
The link between BMI and political affiliation is complex and influenced by socioeconomic and geographic factors, suggesting lifestyle and environmental factors play a substantial role. This data doesn’t imply that political affiliation causes obesity but rather that many Trump supporters belong to demographics more affected by high BMI and health challenges..
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Yes it seems to come out in the numbers. You've asked others to opine about the reasons for that, but curiously you're the only one super interested in it. Maybe it's on you to establish your insightful analysis here. I'm sure we'll all love to see a minor rewording of your long-standing opinion that angry losers are drawn to Trump support. It'll be just as interesting when you say it this time, as it was when you've said it before.
I wonder what the two bell curve distributions of BMI actually look like, drawn on top of one another. You know these sorts of studies with large sample sizes can uncover meaningful correlations that, when presented graphically, seem silly to take very seriously.
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@jon-nyc said in Did anybody see Jon in line yesterday?:
“Why are you interested in this?”
Thats the main pushback Charles Murray gets.
Well you're a real public intellectual then. Bravely forging ahead into taboo truths. This is definitely not you getting excited over anecdotal confirmation of your long standing opinion that Trump supporters are fat ugly losers. Edgy stuff.
Education is extremely important.
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Here you are, jon, cleanse your palate with the fit and socio-economically successful Victor Davis Hanson, supporting Trump for 80 minutes.
Link to video -
@jon-nyc said in Did anybody see Jon in line yesterday?:
“Why are you interested in this?”
Thats the main pushback Charles Murray gets.
Well you're a real public intellectual then. Bravely forging ahead into taboo truths. This is definitely not you getting excited over anecdotal confirmation of your long standing opinion that Trump supporters are fat ugly losers. Edgy stuff.
@Horace said in Did anybody see Jon in line yesterday?:
@jon-nyc said in Did anybody see Jon in line yesterday?:
“Why are you interested in this?”
Thats the main pushback Charles Murray gets.
Well you're a real public intellectual then.
You’re the only person here who claims public intellectual status. I don’t get the same pushback as Murray because of who I am, rather because my noticing unnerves so many.
Note I don’t get any - and I mean none - pushback on the actual facts. Y’all have noticed too. I get pushback for mentioning it. That makes me the problem.
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@Horace said in Did anybody see Jon in line yesterday?:
@jon-nyc said in Did anybody see Jon in line yesterday?:
“Why are you interested in this?”
Thats the main pushback Charles Murray gets.
Well you're a real public intellectual then.
You’re the only person here who claims public intellectual status. I don’t get the same pushback as Murray because of who I am, rather because my noticing unnerves so many.
Note I don’t get any - and I mean none - pushback on the actual facts. Y’all have noticed too. I get pushback for mentioning it. That makes me the problem.
@jon-nyc said in Did anybody see Jon in line yesterday?:
@Horace said in Did anybody see Jon in line yesterday?:
@jon-nyc said in Did anybody see Jon in line yesterday?:
“Why are you interested in this?”
Thats the main pushback Charles Murray gets.
Well you're a real public intellectual then.
You’re the only person here who claims public intellectual status. I don’t get the same pushback as Murray because of who I am, rather because my noticing unnerves so many.
Note I don’t get any - and I mean none - pushback on the observation. Y’all have noticed too. I get pushback for mentioning it. That makes me the problem.
It comes out in the numbers, but your anecdotal slam dunk seems overplayed. Of more value in terms of insights were my points about what overlapping distributions with “large statistically meaningful differences” actually look like (generally not impressive), and my note about your interesting fixation with the things adolescents find cool and uncool.
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@jon-nyc said in Did anybody see Jon in line yesterday?:
@Horace said in Did anybody see Jon in line yesterday?:
@jon-nyc said in Did anybody see Jon in line yesterday?:
“Why are you interested in this?”
Thats the main pushback Charles Murray gets.
Well you're a real public intellectual then.
You’re the only person here who claims public intellectual status. I don’t get the same pushback as Murray because of who I am, rather because my noticing unnerves so many.
Note I don’t get any - and I mean none - pushback on the observation. Y’all have noticed too. I get pushback for mentioning it. That makes me the problem.
It comes out in the numbers, but your anecdotal slam dunk seems overplayed. Of more value in terms of insights were my points about what overlapping distributions with “large statistically meaningful differences” actually look like (generally not impressive), and my note about your interesting fixation with the things adolescents find cool and uncool.
@Horace said in Did anybody see Jon in line yesterday?:
Of more value in terms of insights were my points about what overlapping distributions with “large statistically meaningful differences” actually look like (generally not impressive),
Again, until your lying eyes actually watch footage of a Trump rally.
Only non-witches get due process.
- Cotton Mather, Salem Massachusetts, 1692
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@Horace said in Did anybody see Jon in line yesterday?:
Of more value in terms of insights were my points about what overlapping distributions with “large statistically meaningful differences” actually look like (generally not impressive),
Again, until your lying eyes actually watch footage of a Trump rally.
@jon-nyc said in Did anybody see Jon in line yesterday?:
@Horace said in Did anybody see Jon in line yesterday?:
Of more value in terms of insights were my points about what overlapping distributions with “large statistically meaningful differences” actually look like (generally not impressive),
Again, until your lying eyes actually watch footage of a Trump rally.
There's no way that's the first Trump rally footage you've seen. It's special this time precisely because it confirms a cherished belief you have. Here's how you'd test it. Develop specific, measurable predictions, that you'll be able to test against other Trump rallies. Go find footage of other Trump rallies, at random. Watch them, and test your prediction against reality.
Science is not easy, but this is apparently an important conclusion to you, so you should do the work.
After the work is done, we can begin wondering whether rallies are a representative sample of Trump voters. Whether this matters, will depend on how you precisely formulate your predictions and conclusions. That is up to you, and I would never presume to guess at your exact wording.
As I recall, the firefighter who got murdered at Trump's rally in PA, was a fit guy. But that's just anecdata. Ashley Babbitt was fit, too. And the shaman.
