If Trump is elected...
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Are there any lessons the Dems should learn from it?
“Cry havoc and let slip the DOGE of war!”
Those who cheered as J-6 American prisoners were locked in solitary for 18 months without trial, now suddenly fight tooth and nail for foreign terrorists’ "due process". — Buck Sexton
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I am sure that each side does a post election review. "What could have done better? WHere was our message wrong?"
The problem is that whatever worked previously may not work in the future.
Harris and Trump are at the right place at the right time. If, for example, Presdient Trump was running against President Reagan in the primary, do you think he would have won? Probably not.
I thought that when President Trump lost in 2020, that would be the end of his style of politics I obviously was quite wrong. I still dont think that it has long lasting power within the Republic party - it is so much tied into him.
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Havent really thought about that, but if assume it is true, then maybe the lessons are somewhat of a "one off".
From the Democrat side, they have to look at why a nationalistic populist won.
From the Republic side if President Trump loses, then they have to look and do the reverse. Nationalistic populism is not a winning formula (at least right now).
I think ultimately, it will come down to how the general public (the middle voter) feels which side has allowed the extremes the party to set the message.
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It seems like the Dems are really missing charismatic leadership. Say what you like about Obama, but he inspired people. iMHO he would have easily beaten Trump in both 2016 and 2020.
Trump has charisma too of course. I think likeability is probably more important than policy for large numbers of people, particularly those who aren’t on the wings. 2016 Biden was more likeable than Trump.
Maybe Dems should go on a charisma training course. I’m sure that would sort it out.
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It seems like the Dems are really missing charismatic leadership. Say what you like about Obama, but he inspired people. iMHO he would have easily beaten Trump in both 2016 and 2020.
Trump has charisma too of course. I think likeability is probably more important than policy for large numbers of people, particularly those who aren’t on the wings. 2016 Biden was more likeable than Trump.
Maybe Dems should go on a charisma training course. I’m sure that would sort it out.
@Doctor-Phibes said in If Trump is elected...:
It seems like the Dems are really missing charismatic leadership. Say what you like about Obama, but he inspired people. iMHO he would have easily beaten Trump in both 2016 and 2020.
Trump has charisma too of course. I think likeability is probably more important than policy for large numbers of people, particularly those who aren’t on the wings. 2016 Biden was more likeable than Trump.
Maybe Dems should go on a charisma training course. I’m sure that would sort it out.
The Dems have electable people. They just can't get through the process.
And I would say the primary process, but have the Dems had an open process since 2008?
“Cry havoc and let slip the DOGE of war!”
Those who cheered as J-6 American prisoners were locked in solitary for 18 months without trial, now suddenly fight tooth and nail for foreign terrorists’ "due process". — Buck Sexton
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@Doctor-Phibes said in If Trump is elected...:
It seems like the Dems are really missing charismatic leadership. Say what you like about Obama, but he inspired people. iMHO he would have easily beaten Trump in both 2016 and 2020.
Trump has charisma too of course. I think likeability is probably more important than policy for large numbers of people, particularly those who aren’t on the wings. 2016 Biden was more likeable than Trump.
Maybe Dems should go on a charisma training course. I’m sure that would sort it out.
The Dems have electable people. They just can't get through the process.
And I would say the primary process, but have the Dems had an open process since 2008?
@Jolly said in If Trump is elected...:
And I would say the primary process, but have the Dems had an open process since 2008?
Nope (with a very long and drawn out popping P sound at the end)
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@Doctor-Phibes said in If Trump is elected...:
It seems like the Dems are really missing charismatic leadership. Say what you like about Obama, but he inspired people. iMHO he would have easily beaten Trump in both 2016 and 2020.
Trump has charisma too of course. I think likeability is probably more important than policy for large numbers of people, particularly those who aren’t on the wings. 2016 Biden was more likeable than Trump.
Maybe Dems should go on a charisma training course. I’m sure that would sort it out.
The Dems have electable people. They just can't get through the process.
And I would say the primary process, but have the Dems had an open process since 2008?
@Jolly said in If Trump is elected...:
The Dems have electable people. They just can't get through the process.
Same with the Republics.
I know you are a President Trump fan, but other than the 2016 election, he (or people he supports) have not done too well.
US House
2016 - lost 6
2018 - lost 40
2020 - gain 13
2022 - gain 8
net loss = 25US Senate
2016 - loss 3
2018 - gain 1
2020 - loss 1
2022 - loss 2
net loss = 5Governors
2016 - gain 2
2018 - loss 6
2020 - 0 change
2022 - loss 1
net loss = 5 -
Take it back to 1960.
“Cry havoc and let slip the DOGE of war!”
Those who cheered as J-6 American prisoners were locked in solitary for 18 months without trial, now suddenly fight tooth and nail for foreign terrorists’ "due process". — Buck Sexton
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@Jolly But that is irrelevant.
President Trump has been the leader of the party since 2016, so if someone is going to judge how his overall leadership has helped/hurt the other national offices, you can only cover his time in office.
A company CEO who is CEO today is not judged on how the ex-CEO did 60 years ago.
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@Jolly But that is irrelevant.
President Trump has been the leader of the party since 2016, so if someone is going to judge how his overall leadership has helped/hurt the other national offices, you can only cover his time in office.
A company CEO who is CEO today is not judged on how the ex-CEO did 60 years ago.
@taiwan_girl said in If Trump is elected...:
@Jolly But that is irrelevant.
President Trump has been the leader of the party since 2016, so if someone is going to judge how his overall leadership has helped/hurt the other national offices, you can only cover his time in office.
A company CEO who is CEO today is not judged on how the ex-CEO did 60 years ago.
I think it relevant.
If you look at the political landscape since 1960, you'll find Republicans outnumbered by Democrats in party affiliation. You'll also find the Democrat machine is more sordid and more effective than the GOP (ask Nixon about Chicago in 1960).
And while both parties pander for votes, some of the Dems are masters at it. There is some argument about LBJ's statement about the 1964 Civil Rights Bill (which has locked in the black vote for a long time)...
"I'll have those niggers voting Democratic for 200 years"
I think he said it. He often referred to the 1957 Civil Rights Bill as "the nigger bill" and he often used the N word in conversation with other politicians in his party. But his pandering worked. Dems have had the black vote and subsequently the urban vote, pretty much locked up for decades.
Any GOP presidential candidate starts with his feet in a hole. Sometimes, they can overcome the Dem machine...Nixon used the Vietnam War and societal unrest in 1968, Reagan the economy in 1980 and W squeaked in on Clinton fatigue and was reelected as a war president.
If not for COVID, I have no doubt DJT would have been elected to a second term on strength of the economy.
But no matter if we look at Nixon, Reagan, 41, 43 or Trump, how often are they working with a split or a Democrat Congress?
Since 1960, the only Republican Presidents to have a GOP House and Senate are George W. Bush and Donald J. Trump.
If Trump wins, the House stays the same and the Senate flips, we are in rare air, indeed.
Now, after the absolute wall of political feces flung at Trump by the Dems...Bogus impeachments, the Russian hoax, the Hunter Biden laptop suppression, the coordination of lawfare by the Biden Administration, the raiding of Mar-a-lago, the lying of the Jan 6 Committee and the election interference of the Just-us Department...If Trump pulls this political trifecta off - especially by being outspent 4:1 - by winning significant portions of the black and hispanic vote, you have just witnessed a small political miracle and one of the greatest comebacks in American political history.
I don't know if that speaks to how good Trump is or how awful the Biden Administration was, but look well, for you may not see anything else like it for a long time.
“Cry havoc and let slip the DOGE of war!”
Those who cheered as J-6 American prisoners were locked in solitary for 18 months without trial, now suddenly fight tooth and nail for foreign terrorists’ "due process". — Buck Sexton
-
@taiwan_girl said in If Trump is elected...:
@Jolly But that is irrelevant.
President Trump has been the leader of the party since 2016, so if someone is going to judge how his overall leadership has helped/hurt the other national offices, you can only cover his time in office.
A company CEO who is CEO today is not judged on how the ex-CEO did 60 years ago.
I think it relevant.
If you look at the political landscape since 1960, you'll find Republicans outnumbered by Democrats in party affiliation. You'll also find the Democrat machine is more sordid and more effective than the GOP (ask Nixon about Chicago in 1960).
And while both parties pander for votes, some of the Dems are masters at it. There is some argument about LBJ's statement about the 1964 Civil Rights Bill (which has locked in the black vote for a long time)...
"I'll have those niggers voting Democratic for 200 years"
I think he said it. He often referred to the 1957 Civil Rights Bill as "the nigger bill" and he often used the N word in conversation with other politicians in his party. But his pandering worked. Dems have had the black vote and subsequently the urban vote, pretty much locked up for decades.
Any GOP presidential candidate starts with his feet in a hole. Sometimes, they can overcome the Dem machine...Nixon used the Vietnam War and societal unrest in 1968, Reagan the economy in 1980 and W squeaked in on Clinton fatigue and was reelected as a war president.
If not for COVID, I have no doubt DJT would have been elected to a second term on strength of the economy.
But no matter if we look at Nixon, Reagan, 41, 43 or Trump, how often are they working with a split or a Democrat Congress?
Since 1960, the only Republican Presidents to have a GOP House and Senate are George W. Bush and Donald J. Trump.
If Trump wins, the House stays the same and the Senate flips, we are in rare air, indeed.
Now, after the absolute wall of political feces flung at Trump by the Dems...Bogus impeachments, the Russian hoax, the Hunter Biden laptop suppression, the coordination of lawfare by the Biden Administration, the raiding of Mar-a-lago, the lying of the Jan 6 Committee and the election interference of the Just-us Department...If Trump pulls this political trifecta off - especially by being outspent 4:1 - by winning significant portions of the black and hispanic vote, you have just witnessed a small political miracle and one of the greatest comebacks in American political history.
I don't know if that speaks to how good Trump is or how awful the Biden Administration was, but look well, for you may not see anything else like it for a long time.
@Jolly said in If Trump is elected...:
I think it relevant.
I will disagree. It is "cherry picking" to say that the national losses under Trump are due to things out of his control and go back 60 years.
@Jolly said in If Trump is elected...:
If not for COVID, I have no doubt DJT would have been elected to a second term on strength of the economy.
Agree 100%. But.......... Trump was president during that time and the economy was worse at the end of his term when compared to the beginning of his term. If we want to say that he was not at fault for the condition of the economy at the end of his term, then realistically, we have to give President Biden a "pass" on the economy also.
You know my thoughts - Presidents take too much credit and get too much blame on the economy. The economy is going to cycle. By statistics, the economy does better with a split government, regardless of which side is president.
Since 1960, the only Republican Presidents to have a GOP House and Senate are George W. Bush and Donald J. Trump.
Okay, and what was accomplished by President Trump during that time? What happened in the 2018 elections?
Anyway, IMO talk is overblow on both sides that the sky is falling if "my" candidate is not elected.
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@Tom-K said in If Trump is elected...:
Trump may be better than Harris, but he's still a steaming pile of excrement.
This.
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@Jolly said in If Trump is elected...:
Are there any lessons the Dems should learn from it?
Yeah, that women candidates lose to Trump!
@89th said in If Trump is elected...:
@Jolly said in If Trump is elected...:
Are there any lessons the Dems should learn from it?
Yeah, that women candidates lose to Trump!
Yeah, he's beaten almost as many women as Doug Emhoff.
