Could a European army go it alone?

[Renauda]

In the words the first Secretary General of NATO, Lord Ismay, the alliance was created to “keep the Soviet Union out, the Americans in, and the Germans down”.

I have reservations about the viability and credibility of an exclusive EU alternative.

[Jolly]

But, faced with a common enemy, three or four nations could be very effective.

The UK+Poland+Germany+one (or more of the Scandinavians) could be formidable.

[89th]

Trump also called his wife Melania "Mercedes" by accident, and told Michigan voters to vote on November 27th, "a very important date". So important he got the month wrong. This is just in the last day or two. Poor guy is losing it, albeit a tad slower than Biden.

[Mik]

[Jolly]

@89th said in Could a European army go it alone?:

Trump also called his wife Melania "Mercedes" by accident, and told Michigan voters to vote on November 27th, "a very important date". So important he got the month wrong. This is just in the last day or two. Poor guy is losing it, albeit a tad slower than Biden.

He's older. But he's not senile.

[Mik]

His schedule would kill any of us.

[xenon]

@Jolly said in Could a European army go it alone?:

@89th said in Could a European army go it alone?:

Trump also called his wife Melania "Mercedes" by accident, and told Michigan voters to vote on November 27th, "a very important date". So important he got the month wrong. This is just in the last day or two. Poor guy is losing it, albeit a tad slower than Biden.

He's older. But he's not senile.

Relative to now - Joe Biden looks like a spring chicken in his 2020 campaign kick-off:

Link to video

[89th]

It's like the anti-Biden commercials are making themselves.

Honestly, the GOP should just run ads showing then and now, with both visuals of what Joe was like and what he is now, as well as what prices were like, and what they are now.

Just run versions of that ad over and over, it's literally the only campaign thing the GOP would have to spend money on.

[Renauda]

@Jolly said in Could a European army go it alone?:

But, faced with a common enemy, three or four nations could be very effective.

The UK+Poland+Germany+one (or more of the Scandinavians) could be formidable.

Yes, up to a point. As have been the Ukrainians the past two years. At least until recently.

I notice you didn’t include France. Any particular reason other than Napoleon has been dead for over 200 years?

[Doctor Phibes]

@Renauda said in Could a European army go it alone?:

I notice you didn’t include France. Any particular reason other than Napoleon has been dead for over 200 years?

My assumption was that the Brits, Poles and Germans would be invading France.

[Renauda]

Of course. Jolly did refer to a “common enemy”. But historically Poland, or at least the Poles, were always allies of France. They still regard Napoleon as a liberator.

[Jolly]

@Renauda said in Could a European army go it alone?:

@Jolly said in Could a European army go it alone?:

But, faced with a common enemy, three or four nations could be very effective.

The UK+Poland+Germany+one (or more of the Scandinavians) could be formidable.

Yes, up to a point. As have been the Ukrainians the past two years. At least until recently.

I notice you didn’t include France. Any particular reason other than Napoleon has been dead for over 200 years?

I'm not overly impressed with some of the French leadership and they don't tend to use a lot of the same equipment as other Western European nations, complicating logistics.

[Renauda]

@Jolly

…. they don't tend to use a lot of the same equipment as other Western European nations, complicating logistics

I see your point. The last thing I would want is a fighting vehicle made by either Peugeot or Renault in winter war conditions in be it Eastern Europe or the north.

[Mik]

The last thing I would want is a Renault or a Peugeot as a summer vacation rental car. My dad and my brother both had Renaults. Awful cars.

[Renauda]

@Mik

There is a reason neither exist up here.

They do not work at all reliably in temperatures much below freezing and if they do happen to work in subzero weather, they are un-drivable on snow or ice.

[Jolly]

France does have a tracked SAM vehicle that supposed to be pretty good. They do produce the Storm Shadow that Britain fields as well. And they still make the Exocet.

But I don't think their tank uses the same ammo as NATO. I don't have a clue about their bullpups.

[Renauda]

Standing joke among British and Canadian forces from the Cold War was the definition of a long range French nuclear weapon:

Any nuclear tipped or nuclear armed ordinance under French control that landed on German territory.