My next piano??

[jon-nyc]

@George-K said in My next piano??:

And, just realized this is the 6th "piano" I've owned or had constant access to.

1. My parents' Hobart M. Cable
2. My Baldwin Hamilton
3. My Bohemia
4. My second Bohemia (which I still have)
5. My worn-out Kawai
6. This Roland.

Interesting. Mine are:

1. My Dad’s Cable Nelson
2. My dad’s Steinway M
3. My Baldwin Hamilton
4. Rental upright in Mexico City (~1yr)
5. Rental upright in Paris (-1yr)
6. Bosendorfer
7. Clav #1
8. Clav #2

[George K]

@jon-nyc said in My next piano??:

Bosendorfer
Clav #1
Clav #2

I won't comment on your omission of the umlaut in Bösendorfer. However two Clavinovas?

[George K]

Oh, forgot to mention. One thing that I always hated about the Kawai was the fact that, sometimes, if I was playing a bit to "aggressively," I would hit the controls in front of the keyboard. All of a sudden, I'd be playing a totally different instrument.

The Roland's cover's track has a detente in it, which positions the cover over the control panel, but still leaves the keyboard exposed. Little things like that are nice to see.

[LuFins Dad]

@George-K @kluurs a small little detail about the fallboard… If you close it, it turns the power off. Opening it turns the power back on. Be aware that if you close it too then open it quickly, you can catch it in the middle of the cycle and it won’t power back up without closing it again and reopening or using the power button.

[jon-nyc]

@George-K said in My next piano??:

I won't comment on your omission of the umlaut in Bösendorfer. However two Clavinovas?

I got the first one in 2005 and felt like upgrading in 2018.

I gave my old one to Joe Kubera’s grandkids. It was a significant upgrade from their digital.

[George K]

So, I've spent about 4-5 hours with it over the last 2 days.

The "built-in" sounds are not bad, not bad at all. The "Grand piano" is closest to what I have, but there's no question that I'm listening to synthetic piano sounds over speakers. It's not bad, not at all, but it's not "real." If I didn't have a grand in the other room, it would be quite satisfactory.

Putting headphones on improves the experience greatly. But it's still not quite right. Again, it's really "good enough" but not the same.

Enter PIanoteq...

I'm still running in "demo mode" - a couple of black keys are disabled and there's a (resettable) time limit.

Well, that just changes everything. Even through speakers, the sound is much more natural than the built-in sounds. I've only played with a couple of the pianos that PIanoteq offers - the New York and Hamburg Steinways, a Steingraeber, Grotrian and Playel. All of them are quite pleasant. Playing the first movement of the "Pathetique" on a 1797 Broadwood is...interesting.

And, with headphones, it's TOTALLY different.

I'm going to invest in this software - it makes the experience SO much better. Now, I have to decide which two "included" instrument packs I want. I can always add more, of course.

[taiwan_girl]

@George-K Congrats on the new piano!!

[George K]

It's been a week now.

First of all, the Roland plays wonderfully. No question that it feels "different" from my Bohemia, but it's not bad, or worse. Just different. It's an adjustment that takes about 10 seconds.

The "textured" keytops are really a nice (ahem) touch as well. The keys never feel slippery.

The built-in piano sounds are fine, especially the "rag-time" upright. Fun to play.

But, with Pianoteq (which I purchased last night) it's a totally different world. I've spent most of my time playing the Hamburg Steinway D. I can really get it to roar if I want to. As I mentioned, I'm working on the Italian Concerto (Bach is fucking HARD), and using the PIanoteq free harpsichord is revelatory. It's SO much less forgiving than a piano would be.

Tons of fun.

My only quibble with it is that the built-in speakers, though adequate, don't give anything close to the experience of listening with even cheap headphones.

I'd like to add some external speakers. Someone (@89th ?) said that I should repurpose my Klipsch 2.1 media speakers from my computer to the piano, and get something for the computer.

I'd like to spend about $200.

Would a soundbar be a consideration? It would sit behind the music desk, so perhaps not.

Thoughts?

[mark]

I have had

1 GEM Pro2 88 key stage piano with weighted keys circa 1988 ( a favorite of Keith Emerson's)

2 Yamaha upright

3 Yamaha Clavinova

4 Yamaha C2 in oak

5 Estonia 190 satin black

5.5 Estonia L-190 gloss black which was a loaner for 6 months or more while my lyre was being rebuilt and waiting for parts, at Codogan's

5 My Original Estonia 190 (for a couple of months)

6 A brand new replacement Estonia L-190 in satin black. I was allowed to pick from 3 of them when Cordogan's decided to replace my original one because I was such a little bitch about the lyre creaking during my Chopin. lol
It was a couple of years between models and I ended up with the new Laul-Estonia redesign

@jon-nyc said in My next piano??:

@George-K said in My next piano??:

And, just realized this is the 6th "piano" I've owned or had constant access to.

1. My parents' Hobart M. Cable
2. My Baldwin Hamilton
3. My Bohemia
4. My second Bohemia (which I still have)
5. My worn-out Kawai
6. This Roland.

Interesting. Mine are:

1. My Dad’s Cable Nelson
2. My dad’s Steinway M
3. My Baldwin Hamilton
4. Rental upright in Mexico City (~1yr)
5. Rental upright in Paris (-1yr)
6. Bosendorfer
7. Clav #1
8. Clav #2

[mark]

Oh, congrats on the new piano George!

[George K]

@George-K said in My next piano??:

I'd like to add some external speakers. Someone (@89th ?) said that I should repurpose my Klipsch 2.1 media speakers from my computer to the piano, and get something for the computer.
I'd like to spend about $200.
Would a soundbar be a consideration? It would sit behind the music desk, so perhaps not.
Thoughts?

Bump???

@mark? @kluurs?

Suggestions?

[LuFins Dad]

Behringer is supposed to make a very nice keyboard speaker.

[George K]

@LuFins-Dad said in My next piano??:

Behringer is supposed to make a very nice keyboard speaker.

Thanks!

It looks like they only speakers that are single (not stereo) units. Would that matter for me?

[mark]

@George-K said in My next piano??:

@George-K said in My next piano??:

I'd like to add some external speakers. Someone (@89th ?) said that I should repurpose my Klipsch 2.1 media speakers from my computer to the piano, and get something for the computer.
I'd like to spend about $200.
Would a soundbar be a consideration? It would sit behind the music desk, so perhaps not.
Thoughts?

Bump???

@mark? @kluurs?

Suggestions?

Do they need to be powered speakers?

I know these are a bit above the $200 budget but, ($200? come on man! your ears deserve better! lol)

https://www.klipsch.com/products/the-fives-powered-speakers

If not powered, then maybe these which are real close to your budget.

https://www.klipsch.com/products/kd-51m-bookshelf-speakers

but these would be better.

https://paducahhometheater.com/collections/klipsch-reference/products/klipsch-rp-600m-ii

[George K]

@mark yeah, powered. I don't want an amp cluttering up the top of the piano.

Thanks for the suggestions - I'll look into them.

Gonna head off to Amazon's Showroom Best Buy in the next few days and check out some options.

[mark]

@George-K A pair of powered studio monitors would work.

Yamaha makes a nice pair.

YAMAHA HS8 Studio Monitor, Black, 8 Inch https://a.co/d/7C4wWHs

[George K]

So I went to Best Buy to see if I could audition some speakers. I was absolutely amazed at the selection they had.

3 models of Logitech 2.1 speakers.

Three.

Nothing else.

Last time I looked there, they had a nice selection of various brands, but today, nothing.

Whatever happened to shopping for audio equipment where you can actually hear the equipment?

Oh and @mark! That Yamaha speaker is $398 - for one.

[mark]

@George-K said in My next piano??:

So I went to Best Buy to see if I could audition some speakers. I was absolutely amazed at the selection they had.

3 models of Logitech 2.1 speakers.

Three.

Nothing else.

Last time I looked there, they had a nice selection of various brands, but today, nothing.

Whatever happened to shopping for audio equipment where you can actually hear the equipment?

Oh and @mark! That Yamaha speaker is $398 - for one.

Yes but they sound amazing.

[George K]

So...an update.

I love the Roland. I don't make much use of any of the features it has built-in except the "volume" control. I would say that I use it with headphones about 50% of the time, and the volume turned down the rest of the time.

Playing it using Mrs. George's 2012 MacBook Air running Pianoteq. Most of the time, I use the Hamburg Steinway D plug-in, and on occasion I switch the the Steingraeber, just for yuks. It's interesting how you "get used" to a sound and when you switch it, the difference is jarring. Not bad, by any means - it's just as good - but "different."

In terms of use, I'd say I play it about 80% of the time and it's great for learning something (currently 1st movement of Pathetique is about 90% there, "Italian Concerto" about 70%).

But, make no mistake, it's not a real piano. When I play my grand, I have to adjust the way I play, because it seems less forgiving - that's not a bad thing, I just have to pay more attention to what I'm doing. As @kluurs has said, if you want the feel of a "real piano," you're going to have to spend a LOT more money - and perhaps sacrifice your sense of aesthetic.

I love the thing, and I have zero regrets purchasing it.

Oh, the Kawai? It went to the recycling center...

[kluurs]

I was just thinking some similar things last night though I play about 98% using headphones. I find working on problem spots a lot easier knowing I'm not making my housemate insane hearing the same few measures a dozen (or more) times. The action on the real piano requires some modification of my technique, demonstrating to me that my efforts to rise from a poor piano player to a mediocre one remain but a dream. Still, some kindly inclined folks might feel I've safely moved up from being a godawful piano player. I suspect this as no one recently has asked me why I haven't considered giving it up altogether.