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The New Coffee Room

  1. TNCR
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  3. More classified docs found...

More classified docs found...

Scheduled Pinned Locked Moved General Discussion
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  • jon-nycJ jon-nyc

    @Jolly said in More classified docs found...:

    I go back to what I said at the beginning of all this horseshit...It's time to let all this go. Trump, Biden, Pence, Obama...They've all done it, as I'm sure multiple executives have done before.

    If it impacts national security, hang them by their thumbs. Otherwise, it's all peanut gallery stuff.

    I think the very opposite - we seem to have slid into a situation whereby cabinet officials and above are forgiven as long as they cooperate once the docs are discovered and no ill intent is indicated.

    Let’s charge and prosecute these two according to the letter of the law, insofar as it’s warranted under the law, and recalibrate what behavior is expected. Let’s also let the national archives do the labor of separating classified from unclassified when presidents pack up and leave, rather than leaving it to whitehouse staff. Or at least let them do it together.

    George KG Offline
    George KG Offline
    George K
    wrote on last edited by George K
    #7

    @jon-nyc said in More classified docs found...:

    as long as they cooperate once the docs are discovered and no ill intent is indicated

    Andy McCarthy has a slightly different take on cooperation:

    The president, you’re to believe, is being fully cooperative.

    The truth of the matter is that, like most criminal suspects as to whom there is already strong evidence of felony offenses, Biden consented to a search knowing that, if he did not, newly appointed special counsel Robert Hur would apply for a judicial warrant from a federal judge. Biden would then have been subject to the same political damage that has dogged former president Donald Trump since the Mar-a-Lago search in August: a judicial finding of probable cause to believe he has committed multiple offenses for which the penal code prescribes prison terms of up to ten years (for each offense).

    This would promptly have been followed by a compulsory search in which the FBI ended up seizing even more incriminating evidence, thus making the case for criminal prosecution even stronger. That, in turn, would put have more pressure on the Justice Department to recommend an indictment (assuming, as I do, that the special counsel must follow longstanding DOJ Office of Legal Counsel guidance that forbids the indictment of a sitting president – i.e., the indictment must await the incumbent’s exit from office, consistent with the Constitution, see art. I, §3, cl.7).

    The president did not consent to an FBI search of his home because he is unconcerned. He consented to it because he knew law enforcement had more than sufficient evidence to compel a search of his home. From his standpoint, with his 2024 reelection hopes now teetering, it was better to pose as a cooperative volunteer than be forced to open his door to federal agents brandishing a judicial warrant.

    ETA: Also intent has nothing to do with the law, despite what former AG Comey told us.

    "Now look here, you Baltic gas passer... " - Mik, 6/14/08

    The saying, "Lite is just one damn thing after another," is a gross understatement. The damn things overlap.

    1 Reply Last reply
    • jon-nycJ jon-nyc

      @Jolly said in More classified docs found...:

      I go back to what I said at the beginning of all this horseshit...It's time to let all this go. Trump, Biden, Pence, Obama...They've all done it, as I'm sure multiple executives have done before.

      If it impacts national security, hang them by their thumbs. Otherwise, it's all peanut gallery stuff.

      I think the very opposite - we seem to have slid into a situation whereby cabinet officials and above are forgiven as long as they cooperate once the docs are discovered and no ill intent is indicated.

      Let’s charge and prosecute these two according to the letter of the law, insofar as it’s warranted under the law, and recalibrate what behavior is expected. Let’s also let the national archives do the labor of separating classified from unclassified when presidents pack up and leave, rather than leaving it to whitehouse staff. Or at least let them do it together.

      MikM Away
      MikM Away
      Mik
      wrote on last edited by
      #8

      @jon-nyc said in More classified docs found...:

      Let’s also let the national archives do the labor of separating classified from unclassified when presidents pack up and leave, rather than leaving it to whitehouse staff. Or at least let them do it together.

      This.

      “I am fond of pigs. Dogs look up to us. Cats look down on us. Pigs treat us as equals.” ~Winston S. Churchill

      1 Reply Last reply
      • jon-nycJ Offline
        jon-nycJ Offline
        jon-nyc
        wrote on last edited by jon-nyc
        #9

        George - did you even read my post? I specifically talk about that as being how the law has been interpreted for sufficiently high status politicians. I’m literally making the point that that’s not what the law is, and that we should return to the letter of the law.

        As often, McCarthy is partially right. Intent matters not when it comes to possession, (though knowledge of the possession does, which could save Biden).

        On the obstruction charges the fat man is facing, cooperation - or it’s lack - is key.

        Only non-witches get due process.

        • Cotton Mather, Salem Massachusetts, 1692
        George KG 1 Reply Last reply
        • jon-nycJ jon-nyc

          George - did you even read my post? I specifically talk about that as being how the law has been interpreted for sufficiently high status politicians. I’m literally making the point that that’s not what the law is, and that we should return to the letter of the law.

          As often, McCarthy is partially right. Intent matters not when it comes to possession, (though knowledge of the possession does, which could save Biden).

          On the obstruction charges the fat man is facing, cooperation - or it’s lack - is key.

          George KG Offline
          George KG Offline
          George K
          wrote on last edited by
          #10

          @jon-nyc said in More classified docs found...:

          George - did you even read my post? I specifically talk about that as being how the law has been interpreted for sufficiently high status politicians. I’m literally making the point that that’s not what the law is, and that we should return to the letter of the law.

          Yes, I did., and though I didn't respond to that point, I wholeheartedly agree. I assume @Jolly does as well. My bad for contrasting the ideas of McCarthy with what you said.

          As often, McCarthy is partially right. Intent matters not when it comes to possession, (though knowledge of the possession does, which could save Biden).

          On the obstruction charges the fat man is facing, cooperation - or it’s lack - is key.

          If by lack of cooperation, you mean obstruction, then, perhaps. That will be interesting.

          "Now look here, you Baltic gas passer... " - Mik, 6/14/08

          The saying, "Lite is just one damn thing after another," is a gross understatement. The damn things overlap.

          1 Reply Last reply
          • jon-nycJ jon-nyc

            @Jolly said in More classified docs found...:

            I go back to what I said at the beginning of all this horseshit...It's time to let all this go. Trump, Biden, Pence, Obama...They've all done it, as I'm sure multiple executives have done before.

            If it impacts national security, hang them by their thumbs. Otherwise, it's all peanut gallery stuff.

            I think the very opposite - we seem to have slid into a situation whereby cabinet officials and above are forgiven as long as they cooperate once the docs are discovered and no ill intent is indicated.

            Let’s charge and prosecute these two according to the letter of the law, insofar as it’s warranted under the law, and recalibrate what behavior is expected. Let’s also let the national archives do the labor of separating classified from unclassified when presidents pack up and leave, rather than leaving it to whitehouse staff. Or at least let them do it together.

            AxtremusA Away
            AxtremusA Away
            Axtremus
            wrote on last edited by
            #11

            @jon-nyc said in More classified docs found...:

            I think the very opposite - we seem to have slid into a situation whereby cabinet officials and above are forgiven as long as they cooperate once the docs are discovered and no ill intent is indicated.

            Let’s charge and prosecute these two according to the letter of the law, insofar as it’s warranted under the law, and recalibrate what behavior is expected. Let’s also let the national archives do the labor of separating classified from unclassified when presidents pack up and leave, rather than leaving it to whitehouse staff. Or at least let them do it together.

            +1

            1 Reply Last reply
            • George KG Offline
              George KG Offline
              George K
              wrote on last edited by
              #12

              Jon, did you even read my post? You commented in it, LOL.

              Screenshot 2023-01-24 at 12.47.13 PM.png

              "Now look here, you Baltic gas passer... " - Mik, 6/14/08

              The saying, "Lite is just one damn thing after another," is a gross understatement. The damn things overlap.

              jon-nycJ 1 Reply Last reply
              • George KG George K

                Jon, did you even read my post? You commented in it, LOL.

                Screenshot 2023-01-24 at 12.47.13 PM.png

                jon-nycJ Offline
                jon-nycJ Offline
                jon-nyc
                wrote on last edited by
                #13

                @George-K

                I did not! I thought this was an old thread and it opened to a lower post.

                Only non-witches get due process.

                • Cotton Mather, Salem Massachusetts, 1692
                George KG 1 Reply Last reply
                • jon-nycJ jon-nyc

                  @George-K

                  I did not! I thought this was an old thread and it opened to a lower post.

                  George KG Offline
                  George KG Offline
                  George K
                  wrote on last edited by
                  #14

                  @jon-nyc said in More classified docs found...:

                  @George-K

                  I did not! I thought this was an old thread and it opened to a lower post.

                  LOL!

                  "Now look here, you Baltic gas passer... " - Mik, 6/14/08

                  The saying, "Lite is just one damn thing after another," is a gross understatement. The damn things overlap.

                  1 Reply Last reply
                  • George KG Offline
                    George KG Offline
                    George K
                    wrote on last edited by
                    #15

                    FnROcAmagAUgp5u.jpeg

                    "Now look here, you Baltic gas passer... " - Mik, 6/14/08

                    The saying, "Lite is just one damn thing after another," is a gross understatement. The damn things overlap.

                    1 Reply Last reply
                    • AxtremusA Away
                      AxtremusA Away
                      Axtremus
                      wrote on last edited by
                      #16

                      https://www.cnn.com/2023/01/27/politics/mike-pence-classified-documents/index.html

                      Pence: "Mistakes were made. And I take full responsibility."

                      1 Reply Last reply
                      • MikM Away
                        MikM Away
                        Mik
                        wrote on last edited by Mik
                        #17

                        We’re making a huge circus from a process error that is easily corrected.

                        “I am fond of pigs. Dogs look up to us. Cats look down on us. Pigs treat us as equals.” ~Winston S. Churchill

                        1 Reply Last reply
                        • JollyJ Offline
                          JollyJ Offline
                          Jolly
                          wrote on last edited by
                          #18

                          Because Trump.

                          “Cry havoc and let slip the DOGE of war!”

                          Those who cheered as J-6 American prisoners were locked in solitary for 18 months without trial, now suddenly fight tooth and nail for foreign terrorists’ "due process". — Buck Sexton

                          RenaudaR 1 Reply Last reply
                          • JollyJ Jolly

                            Because Trump.

                            RenaudaR Offline
                            RenaudaR Offline
                            Renauda
                            wrote on last edited by Renauda
                            #19

                            @Jolly

                            Because Trump.

                            Good call and I wholly agree. Because Trump, unlike his former VP and the current POTUS, refuses all accountability in the matter.

                            Elbows up!

                            George KG CopperC 2 Replies Last reply
                            • RenaudaR Renauda

                              @Jolly

                              Because Trump.

                              Good call and I wholly agree. Because Trump, unlike his former VP and the current POTUS, refuses all accountability in the matter.

                              George KG Offline
                              George KG Offline
                              George K
                              wrote on last edited by
                              #20

                              @Renauda and to amplify that a bit.

                              To say that you "I accept responsibility," is not the same as saying "I did it."

                              I doubt VP Pence was hoarding files in his underwear as he left the Naval Observatory.

                              "Now look here, you Baltic gas passer... " - Mik, 6/14/08

                              The saying, "Lite is just one damn thing after another," is a gross understatement. The damn things overlap.

                              1 Reply Last reply
                              • RenaudaR Renauda

                                @Jolly

                                Because Trump.

                                Good call and I wholly agree. Because Trump, unlike his former VP and the current POTUS, refuses all accountability in the matter.

                                CopperC Offline
                                CopperC Offline
                                Copper
                                wrote on last edited by
                                #21

                                @Renauda said in More classified docs found...:

                                Because Trump, unlike his former VP and the current POTUS, refuses all accountability in the matter.

                                Except when he said "I did it".

                                That sounds like accountability to me.

                                But don't worry about that.

                                Since it is Mr. Trump you can make up whatever you want and it becomes true, just like magic.

                                RenaudaR 1 Reply Last reply
                                • CopperC Copper

                                  @Renauda said in More classified docs found...:

                                  Because Trump, unlike his former VP and the current POTUS, refuses all accountability in the matter.

                                  Except when he said "I did it".

                                  That sounds like accountability to me.

                                  But don't worry about that.

                                  Since it is Mr. Trump you can make up whatever you want and it becomes true, just like magic.

                                  RenaudaR Offline
                                  RenaudaR Offline
                                  Renauda
                                  wrote on last edited by Renauda
                                  #22

                                  @Copper

                                  Except when he said "I did it".
                                  That sounds like accountability to me.

                                  See Dr. George’s post above.

                                  Elbows up!

                                  CopperC 1 Reply Last reply
                                  • RenaudaR Renauda

                                    @Copper

                                    Except when he said "I did it".
                                    That sounds like accountability to me.

                                    See Dr. George’s post above.

                                    CopperC Offline
                                    CopperC Offline
                                    Copper
                                    wrote on last edited by
                                    #23

                                    @Renauda said in More classified docs found...:

                                    @Copper

                                    Except when he said "I did it".
                                    That sounds like accountability to me.

                                    See Dr. George’s post above.

                                    That doesn't sound like "refuses all accountability" either, does it?

                                    But we know that once you make up a Trump story, it becomes truth.

                                    RenaudaR 1 Reply Last reply
                                    • CopperC Copper

                                      @Renauda said in More classified docs found...:

                                      @Copper

                                      Except when he said "I did it".
                                      That sounds like accountability to me.

                                      See Dr. George’s post above.

                                      That doesn't sound like "refuses all accountability" either, does it?

                                      But we know that once you make up a Trump story, it becomes truth.

                                      RenaudaR Offline
                                      RenaudaR Offline
                                      Renauda
                                      wrote on last edited by Renauda
                                      #24

                                      @Copper

                                      Since it is Mr. Trump you can make up whatever you want and it becomes true, just like magic.

                                      Or

                                      But we know that once you make up a Trump story, it becomes truth.

                                      Can I?

                                      How’s this one:

                                      Trump is a one term, one time President of the United States.

                                      Elbows up!

                                      1 Reply Last reply
                                      • CopperC Offline
                                        CopperC Offline
                                        Copper
                                        wrote on last edited by
                                        #25

                                        Yes, a great accomplishment. So many have failed where he succeeded.

                                        RenaudaR 1 Reply Last reply
                                        • CopperC Copper

                                          Yes, a great accomplishment. So many have failed where he succeeded.

                                          RenaudaR Offline
                                          RenaudaR Offline
                                          Renauda
                                          wrote on last edited by Renauda
                                          #26

                                          @Copper said in More classified docs found...:

                                          Yes, a great accomplishment. So many have failed where he succeeded.

                                          A hole in one, no less.

                                          Soon beatification and sainthood.

                                          Count on it. Even take to the bank.

                                          Elbows up!

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