The Ukraine war thread

[Renauda]

@Mik

I would say more like Churchill’s assessment following Al Alamein and two days into Operation Torch:

“The end of the beginning”

Link to video

[Mik]

He's not going to give it up without something where he can claim victory. If we want Russia out of Ukraine and Crimea, it's going to be a long slog. However painful, from an American perspective I think it's worthwhile to do so. Ukrainians may well have a different opinion.

[Renauda]

@Mik

No argument from me. If Ukrainians can continue hold out this winter despite ongoing Russian destruction of their energy infrastructure, they will prevail militarily. As for Russia it wins by losing. To quote Timothy Snyder:

“Russia wins by losing. Russia really needs to lose this war, and to lose it decisively,” he said. “The whole colonial move towards Ukraine is a distraction, a substitute for the internal changes which Russia really has to make.”

[Mik]

The noose tightens?

https://www.msn.com/en-us/news/world/nato-commits-to-future-ukraine-membership-drums-up-aid/ar-AA14G6V8?ocid=msedgntp&cvid=a4a055b4943140d49b455ae1c3d3b4d1

[George K]

[George K]

@darthputin is the best.

[Mik]

What a bizarre conversation.

[George K]

This smells like propaganda, but I wouldn't be surprised if it were true.

[Mik]

I'd be very surprised.

[Renauda]

[George K]

This is in central Russia.

[George K]

Secret modifications: https://english.nv.ua/nation/us-has-modified-himars-to-prevent-ukraine-from-striking-russian-territory-news-50288873.html

“The United States secretly modified the advanced HIMARS rocket launchers it gave Ukraine so they can’t be used to fire long-range missiles into Russia – a precaution the Biden administration says is necessary to reduce the risk of a wider war with Moscow,” WSJ writes.

[Renauda]

No problem. We’ll just modify and improve on readily available old Soviet technology to strike those airbases deep inside Russia:

https://www.defenseone.com/technology/2022/12/explosions-russian-air-bases-may-change-several-nations-calculations/380521/

[Mik]

https://www.msn.com/en-us/news/world/russia-has-no-way-to-win-the-ukraine-war/ar-AA14Zeia?ocid=msedgntp&cvid=f56ba7dd7a7c4ca4adef8ecee61d46f7

[Renauda]

What ever you do, don’t mention the war……

Ahead of the meeting, the Kremlin reportedly urged members of the Human Rights Council “not to upset” Putin with thorny questions about the war in Ukraine, independent news outlet Verstka said.

Members of the body were also reportedly urged to avoid the “toxic” issue of Russian troop deaths in Ukraine.

https://www.themoscowtimes.com/2022/12/07/putin-denies-kremlin-plans-nuclear-first-strike-in-ukraine-a79632

I note though that he is beginning to turn down nuclear rhetoric. Perhaps Chairman Xi had a little phone discussion with him.

[George K]

[Mik]

History shows us it is best not to fuck with the 'stans.

[Jolly]

A small drone with a couple of incendiary grenades can literally be carried anywhere.

There are a lot of targets that can be taken out with just that small nudge.

[George K]

[Mik]

He needs to make up his mind. One day he's backing off, the next he is saber rattling. I think once again he's trying to shake western resolve to arm Ukraine.