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The New Coffee Room

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  3. Roe & Casey overturned.

Roe & Casey overturned.

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  • JollyJ Jolly

    Shall issue vs. May issue.

    jon-nycJ Online
    jon-nycJ Online
    jon-nyc
    wrote on last edited by
    #27

    @Jolly said in Roe & Casey overturned.:

    Shall issue vs. May issue.

    Yep. 43 states are shall issue. Vermont is just a free for all.

    6 states and DC are May issue.

    Only non-witches get due process.

    • Cotton Mather, Salem Massachusetts, 1692
    1 Reply Last reply
    • jon-nycJ jon-nyc

      @LuFins-Dad Honestly i don’t know.

      Yesterdays ruling wasn’t all that broad. It basically extended Heller outside the home. Time place and manner restrictions on weapons are still allowed. You just can put a subjective test on the permitting process (e.g “show me why you need this”).

      Only 6 states are effected in practice.

      Doctor PhibesD Online
      Doctor PhibesD Online
      Doctor Phibes
      wrote on last edited by
      #28

      @jon-nyc said in Roe & Casey overturned.:

      effected

      CALLING MR. LETIFER ON LINE 1 -
      MR. LETIFER!!!!!

      I was only joking

      1 Reply Last reply
      • George KG George K

        Moar insurrection?

        Parkland survivor...

        Screen-Shot-2022-06-24-at-9.jpg

        LuFins DadL Offline
        LuFins DadL Offline
        LuFins Dad
        wrote on last edited by
        #29

        @George-K said in Roe & Casey overturned.:

        Moar insurrection?

        Parkland survivor...

        Screen-Shot-2022-06-24-at-9.jpg

        This makes me curious. What are the mortality rates from abortion? I mean per 1000?

        The Brad

        1 Reply Last reply
        • JollyJ Jolly

          BTW, nothing about abortion has changed in New York.

          LuFins DadL Offline
          LuFins DadL Offline
          LuFins Dad
          wrote on last edited by
          #30

          @Jolly said in Roe & Casey overturned.:

          BTW, nothing about abortion has changed in New York.

          Nothing has changed in any state. That’s where the ridiculousness of this comes through.

          By the way, this is all in regard to a state law that restricts abortion at 15 weeks. France restricts abortion at 12 weeks…

          The Brad

          George KG jon-nycJ 2 Replies Last reply
          • LuFins DadL LuFins Dad

            @Jolly said in Roe & Casey overturned.:

            BTW, nothing about abortion has changed in New York.

            Nothing has changed in any state. That’s where the ridiculousness of this comes through.

            By the way, this is all in regard to a state law that restricts abortion at 15 weeks. France restricts abortion at 12 weeks…

            George KG Offline
            George KG Offline
            George K
            wrote on last edited by George K
            #31

            @LuFins-Dad said in Roe & Casey overturned.:

            a state law that restricts abortion at 15 weeks

            Yeah, I commented on that back when the leak occurred.

            Justin Castreaux tweeted about this today, while ignoring the fact that 4 provinces/territories prohibit abortion after 12 weeks.

            However, overturning Roe opens the door for individual states to make laws that are far, far more restrictive.

            I believe Missouri now has such a law.

            "Now look here, you Baltic gas passer... " - Mik, 6/14/08

            The saying, "Lite is just one damn thing after another," is a gross understatement. The damn things overlap.

            taiwan_girlT 1 Reply Last reply
            • markM Offline
              markM Offline
              mark
              wrote on last edited by
              #32

              WI state law criminalizes doctors who perform abortions, making it a felony to destroy the life of an unborn child from the time of conception until its birth. It creates an exception for when two doctors agree that the mother’s life is in jeopardy but does not include carveouts for instances of rape or incest.

              LuFins DadL 1 Reply Last reply
              • markM mark

                WI state law criminalizes doctors who perform abortions, making it a felony to destroy the life of an unborn child from the time of conception until its birth. It creates an exception for when two doctors agree that the mother’s life is in jeopardy but does not include carveouts for instances of rape or incest.

                LuFins DadL Offline
                LuFins DadL Offline
                LuFins Dad
                wrote on last edited by LuFins Dad
                #33

                @mark said in Roe & Casey overturned.:

                WI state law criminalizes doctors who perform abortions, making it a felony to destroy the life of an unborn child from the time of conception until its birth. It creates an exception for when two doctors agree that the mother’s life is in jeopardy but does not include carveouts for instances of rape or incest.

                Instances of Rape and Incest are a bit of a strawman as they represent under 1% of abortions.

                Florida actually tracks … https://ahca.myflorida.com/MCHQ/Central_Services/Training_Support/docs/TrimesterByReason_2018.pdf

                The Brad

                jon-nycJ CopperC 2 Replies Last reply
                • LuFins DadL LuFins Dad

                  @mark said in Roe & Casey overturned.:

                  WI state law criminalizes doctors who perform abortions, making it a felony to destroy the life of an unborn child from the time of conception until its birth. It creates an exception for when two doctors agree that the mother’s life is in jeopardy but does not include carveouts for instances of rape or incest.

                  Instances of Rape and Incest are a bit of a strawman as they represent under 1% of abortions.

                  Florida actually tracks … https://ahca.myflorida.com/MCHQ/Central_Services/Training_Support/docs/TrimesterByReason_2018.pdf

                  jon-nycJ Online
                  jon-nycJ Online
                  jon-nyc
                  wrote on last edited by jon-nyc
                  #34

                  @LuFins-Dad how does that make it a straw man? Everyone realizes they are small in number. Nobody thinks it’s a big loophole letting thousands of abortions in.

                  It’s just the thought of forcing some 13 year old to carry a rapists baby to term that most people find abhorrent.

                  If anything the rarity makes it that much less excusable to not have a carve out.

                  Only non-witches get due process.

                  • Cotton Mather, Salem Massachusetts, 1692
                  1 Reply Last reply
                  • LuFins DadL LuFins Dad

                    @mark said in Roe & Casey overturned.:

                    WI state law criminalizes doctors who perform abortions, making it a felony to destroy the life of an unborn child from the time of conception until its birth. It creates an exception for when two doctors agree that the mother’s life is in jeopardy but does not include carveouts for instances of rape or incest.

                    Instances of Rape and Incest are a bit of a strawman as they represent under 1% of abortions.

                    Florida actually tracks … https://ahca.myflorida.com/MCHQ/Central_Services/Training_Support/docs/TrimesterByReason_2018.pdf

                    CopperC Offline
                    CopperC Offline
                    Copper
                    wrote on last edited by Copper
                    #35

                    @LuFins-Dad said in Roe & Casey overturned.:

                    Instances of Rape and Incest are a bit of a strawman as they represent under 1% of abortions.

                    If there was an exception for incest and rape, that would grow from 1% to 99% rapidly.

                    1 Reply Last reply
                    • George KG George K

                      "Peacefully protest..."

                      George KG Offline
                      George KG Offline
                      George K
                      wrote on last edited by
                      #36

                      @George-K said in Roe & Casey overturned.:

                      "Peacefully protest..."

                      "Now look here, you Baltic gas passer... " - Mik, 6/14/08

                      The saying, "Lite is just one damn thing after another," is a gross understatement. The damn things overlap.

                      1 Reply Last reply
                      • George KG Offline
                        George KG Offline
                        George K
                        wrote on last edited by
                        #37

                        https://www.wsj.com/articles/where-abortion-is-legal-and-where-it-loses-protections-without-roe-v-wade-11656080346?mod=djemalertNEWS

                        Screen Shot 2022-06-24 at 5.03.39 PM.png

                        "Now look here, you Baltic gas passer... " - Mik, 6/14/08

                        The saying, "Lite is just one damn thing after another," is a gross understatement. The damn things overlap.

                        1 Reply Last reply
                        • MikM Offline
                          MikM Offline
                          Mik
                          wrote on last edited by
                          #38

                          https://www.msn.com/en-us/news/politics/congressional-black-caucus-calls-for-national-emergency-after-scotus-decision/ar-AAYQ80e?ocid=msedgntp&cvid=7c2842ca7997492ca6d5c818696f6f15

                          “I am fond of pigs. Dogs look up to us. Cats look down on us. Pigs treat us as equals.” ~Winston S. Churchill

                          1 Reply Last reply
                          • George KG Offline
                            George KG Offline
                            George K
                            wrote on last edited by George K
                            #39

                            Screen Shot 2022-06-24 at 7.07.46 PM.png

                            "Now look here, you Baltic gas passer... " - Mik, 6/14/08

                            The saying, "Lite is just one damn thing after another," is a gross understatement. The damn things overlap.

                            1 Reply Last reply
                            • MikM Offline
                              MikM Offline
                              Mik
                              wrote on last edited by
                              #40

                              The Bee rules.

                              “I am fond of pigs. Dogs look up to us. Cats look down on us. Pigs treat us as equals.” ~Winston S. Churchill

                              1 Reply Last reply
                              • Catseye3C Offline
                                Catseye3C Offline
                                Catseye3
                                wrote on last edited by
                                #41

                                Sign of the Times: For a split second, I thought that header was real.

                                That is a beautiful building though, isn't it?

                                Success is measured by your discipline and inner peace. – Mike Ditka

                                1 Reply Last reply
                                • taiwan_girlT Offline
                                  taiwan_girlT Offline
                                  taiwan_girl
                                  wrote on last edited by
                                  #42

                                  I wonder (and even predict) that at some point in the future (maybe 10, maybe 20, years,etc) there will be new Supreme Court judges. Another lawsuit will be brought and this will probably be reversed.

                                  JollyJ 1 Reply Last reply
                                  • LuFins DadL LuFins Dad

                                    @Jolly said in Roe & Casey overturned.:

                                    BTW, nothing about abortion has changed in New York.

                                    Nothing has changed in any state. That’s where the ridiculousness of this comes through.

                                    By the way, this is all in regard to a state law that restricts abortion at 15 weeks. France restricts abortion at 12 weeks…

                                    jon-nycJ Online
                                    jon-nycJ Online
                                    jon-nyc
                                    wrote on last edited by jon-nyc
                                    #43

                                    @LuFins-Dad said in Roe & Casey overturned.:

                                    @Jolly said in Roe & Casey overturned.:

                                    BTW, nothing about abortion has changed in New York.

                                    Nothing has changed in any state. That’s where the ridiculousness of this comes through.

                                    I think that’s not true - several states have trigger laws that were designed to change policy immediately upon a potential overturn of Roe.

                                    Only non-witches get due process.

                                    • Cotton Mather, Salem Massachusetts, 1692
                                    LuFins DadL 1 Reply Last reply
                                    • taiwan_girlT taiwan_girl

                                      I wonder (and even predict) that at some point in the future (maybe 10, maybe 20, years,etc) there will be new Supreme Court judges. Another lawsuit will be brought and this will probably be reversed.

                                      JollyJ Offline
                                      JollyJ Offline
                                      Jolly
                                      wrote on last edited by
                                      #44

                                      @taiwan_girl said in Roe & Casey overturned.:

                                      I wonder (and even predict) that at some point in the future (maybe 10, maybe 20, years,etc) there will be new Supreme Court judges. Another lawsuit will be brought and this will probably be reversed.

                                      FDR.

                                      “Cry havoc and let slip the DOGE of war!”

                                      Those who cheered as J-6 American prisoners were locked in solitary for 18 months without trial, now suddenly fight tooth and nail for foreign terrorists’ "due process". — Buck Sexton

                                      1 Reply Last reply
                                      • jon-nycJ jon-nyc

                                        @LuFins-Dad said in Roe & Casey overturned.:

                                        @Jolly said in Roe & Casey overturned.:

                                        BTW, nothing about abortion has changed in New York.

                                        Nothing has changed in any state. That’s where the ridiculousness of this comes through.

                                        I think that’s not true - several states have trigger laws that were designed to change policy immediately upon a potential overturn of Roe.

                                        LuFins DadL Offline
                                        LuFins DadL Offline
                                        LuFins Dad
                                        wrote on last edited by
                                        #45

                                        @jon-nyc said in Roe & Casey overturned.:

                                        @LuFins-Dad said in Roe & Casey overturned.:

                                        @Jolly said in Roe & Casey overturned.:

                                        BTW, nothing about abortion has changed in New York.

                                        Nothing has changed in any state. That’s where the ridiculousness of this comes through.

                                        I think that’s not true - several states have trigger laws that were designed to change policy immediately upon a potential overturn of Roe.

                                        But generally those trigger laws are generally well supported in the states where they will take effect. The will of the people and all that…

                                        The Brad

                                        1 Reply Last reply
                                        • George KG Offline
                                          George KG Offline
                                          George K
                                          wrote on last edited by
                                          #46

                                          McCarthy: Roe was never law.

                                          It was never law at all. The very able lawyers who have defended Roe over the decades have eschewed arguments rooted in the Constitution. Roe has been defended as precedent: The decision commanded deference because it happened, not because it was compelling — or even coherent. It could never be justified on its own terms as linear, logical, legitimately rooted law.

                                          Progressives have thus made a talisman of stare decisis, the doctrine of respect for precedent. They would have you believe, at least when it’s a precedent they like, that stare decisis is Latin for “don’t you dare touch this settled law.” Like the rest of the Roe bag of tricks, that’s laughable as a legal argument — we’ve all noticed that Dred Scott, Plessy v. Ferguson, Korematsu, and other precedents in the Court’s lowlight reel were reversed by the Court. More to the point, though, stare decisis has never been a mandate to uphold precedent; it is a multipart test to assess which precedents should be retained.

                                          It’s a test that Roe was particularly ill-suited to survive.

                                          We haven’t been under Roe for, now, 30 years. The ruling was so unstable and indefensible that, in Casey (1992), a reluctant, razor-thin majority of the Court could save it only by gutting its rickety foundation while maintaining its bottom-line holding — again, in the manner of “because I say so” diktat, not legal reasoning.

                                          And what did Casey replace Roe with? A newfangled “undue burden” test — essentially asking: Does a regulation so burden resort to the abortion “right” as to render it illusory? Notice, however, that it is the nature of such a test to invite regulation and therefore to invite constant streams of challenges.

                                          If we could keep abortion out of it for a moment, then, and think of this as a straight, legal stare decisis question, you had a ruling that was so galactically wrong that it had to be completely overhauled in less than 20 years. A ruling that was so unstable that it was subject to constant regulatory and legal challenge, and thus could not reasonably be relied on. And that’s just the legal landscape, before you ever get to the court of public opinion — the cultural and political arena in which Roe/Casey was never broadly accepted and was always the target of passionate dissent by much of the country.

                                          Roe was not law and could never be defended as such. It has thus been defended by extortion, by the mob. It still is: The Court’s opinion was not even published before the “Night of Rage” planning was under way. The Left tried to prevent the ruling from issuing by an unprecedented leak of a draft opinion, patently intended to intimidate the justices — just as the Left destroyed the judicial-confirmation process over abortion with the intent of intimidating justices. In the weeks since the leak, we have had illegal protests against which a leftist administration has refused to enforce the laws (Roe having corrupted the Justice Department the same way it corrupted the law), and finally the attempted murder of Justice Kavanaugh — an utterly predictable event incited (to borrow the Left’s promiscuous use of that word) by the likes of the Senate’s Democratic Party leader.

                                          "Now look here, you Baltic gas passer... " - Mik, 6/14/08

                                          The saying, "Lite is just one damn thing after another," is a gross understatement. The damn things overlap.

                                          CopperC 1 Reply Last reply
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