RIP, Colin Powell

[89th]

@jolly you should know I’m not a fan of Biden. Generally speaking I vote for conservative candidates although I keep an objective eye, regardless of a candidate’s declared party.

[xenon]

Am I just getting older, or is the bar for acceptable candidates getting much lower?

I just don't understand how... 3 years out from a Presidential election, Trump is seen as a desirable candidate by a significant portion of the electorate.

Feels like we should be able to do better out of 350M people...

The guy is a dumpster fire of a human - and his political positions are vanilla, if a bit crude (cut taxes, incentivize domestic industry, subsidize strategic industries, enforce border laws... that's like 90% of it).

He's not some magical policy unicorn that we should sacrifice all human norms to get access to.

I really don't see the appeal besides the desire to watch Trump throw feces at the libs.

[89th]

@xenon Have you watched the movie Idiocracy? It was a (pretty dumb) comedy, but is turning into a prediction.

[Catseye3]

@xenon said in RIP, Colin Powell:

I just don't understand how... 3 years out from a Presidential election, Trump is seen as a desirable candidate by a significant portion of the electorate.

Some snips from https://thehill.com/homenews/campaign/573036-poll-biden-trump-statistically-tied-in-favorability on a September CAPS/Harris poll:

"President Biden and former President Trump are statistically tied when it comes to their favorability among U.S. voters, according to a new Harvard CAPS/Harris Poll survey shared exclusively with The Hill on Monday.

"The findings are a remarkable shift for Biden, who repeatedly outperformed Trump’s favorability numbers throughout the early months of his presidency.

"But multiple crises, including a surge in new COVID-19 infections in recent months and the chaotic withdrawal of U.S. troops from Afghanistan, have bruised public perceptions of Biden.

" . . . Biden saw his biggest drops in approval on his handling of foreign affairs and his administration’s efforts to combat terrorism. In both matters, his approval dropped 13 points since July."
^ ^ ^ ^ ^ ^ ^ ^ ^ ^ ^ ^ ^ ^ ^ ^

So it may be that Biden has dropped down to Trump, rather than support growing for Trump. At least, according to this article.

And it may also be that Americans are saying a pox on both of them, and only time will tell whether that perception shifts.

It may be that Biden will hand off the presidency to Trump like a football, the way he's going.

[Mik]

I would not vote for him again. If the GOP runs Trump again it means they have no principles whatsoever except winning.

And his statement on Powell's death is unsurprisingly boorish. Enough already.

What he has shown us though is that his policies were for the most part on point. We need to keep that.

[Jolly]

Between Trump and Biden, I'd vote for Trump.

Political parties have all the principles of Al Davis at a Raiders game.

[Doctor Phibes]

@jolly said in RIP, Colin Powell:

Between Trump and Biden, I'd vote for Trump.

Yeah, but your current choice isn't between Trump and Biden, it's between Trump and a bunch of other Republicans. Do you seriously think that Donald Trump is the best that the GOP has to offer?

[Catseye3]

@doctor-phibes That brings up a question that's been bugging me for some time now. Why has it been Trump/Biden, Trump/Biden, Trump/Biden? Is there seriously no one else in the whole political class that the parties can float?

Seriously???

If there's a rational explanation for this, I'd accept it. But what am I missing?

ETA later: I am an idiot. (Shut up.) It's the parties who control the nominations, and the parties will not permit split loyalties, fearing to dilute their chances of a W. It's been shown that candidates who go their own way don't succeed. We learned that with Perot. He came close enough to leaving a mark, and I think that scared the parties.

Trump started out on his own, but that didn't last long. After hanging back to see if Trump could garner viability, like the true bravos they are, the Republicans adopted him joyfully.

Trump's excellent salesmanship skillz trounced Perot like the Saints trounced the Packers recently.

(Translation for you poor benighted souls who see not the wonderfulness that is football: Trump had the skill to beat poor Perot like a big bass drum.)

So, nobody will gain a foothold without party support -- no matter how excellent they would be.

That's the true shame of it.

[Jolly]

@doctor-phibes said in RIP, Colin Powell:

@jolly said in RIP, Colin Powell:

Between Trump and Biden, I'd vote for Trump.

Yeah, but your current choice isn't between Trump and Biden, it's between Trump and a bunch of other Republicans. Do you seriously think that Donald Trump is the best that the GOP has to offer?

Nope, but I think he still has enough support that he can win enough primaries for the nomination and then you're down to an A/B choice.

[Klaus]

I'm not a fan of Biden. My hope for the US is that the GOP finds a new candidate for the next election and wins. A principled and serious candidate who tries to unite and not divide. Conservative but not tea party.

[jon-nyc]

That would be great but we’ll probably never see such a thing again in our lifetime.

[Copper]

If such a thing happens I'd expect the person to come from outside the world of politics, a movie star or athlete maybe

[Klaus]

@jon-nyc said in RIP, Colin Powell:

That would be great but we’ll probably never see such a thing again in our lifetime.

Why not?

[Doctor Phibes]

@copper said in RIP, Colin Powell:

If such a thing happens I'd expect the person to come from outside the world of politics, a movie star or athlete maybe

Caitlyn Jenner springs to mind, as does the feeling that we get the politicians we deserve.

[Copper]

Caitlyn Jenner

Rule #4


[LuFins Dad]

@jon-nyc said in RIP, Colin Powell:

That would be great but we’ll probably never see such a thing again in our lifetime.

Yep. At least until the war.

[Jolly]

Or maybe after.

[jon-nyc]

@klaus said in RIP, Colin Powell:

@jon-nyc said in RIP, Colin Powell:

That would be great but we’ll probably never see such a thing again in our lifetime.

Why not?

Short, nearly tautological response is “that’s not what GOP voters want”.

[LuFins Dad]

@89th said in RIP, Colin Powell:

@jolly said in RIP, Colin Powell:

@klaus said in RIP, Colin Powell:

You'd rather saw off a feat of yours than saying anything even remotely critical of Trump, don't you Jolly?

Nah, but the street flows both ways. Nobody criticized Powell for taking a shot at Trump. No, people ballyhooed the statement.

Was Trump being an ass? Yeppers. Was he being vindictive. Yep.

But until coverage is meted out fairly, it doesn't bother me tremendously. And as my grocery bill climbs, as I pay more at the pump and as we receive more mandates from Washington Central Planning, I find myself missing ol' DJT more and more.

Warts and all.

LOL you think he could've controlled any of that?

Actually, I think Trump would have improved things quite a bit. Gas prices would definitely be better as we would be drilling a lot more of our own. He definitely would have ended the unemployment benefits sooner, which would have lessened the labor shortage by at least a degree or two. He would have reached out to the California Ports well before this point to increase efficiency and also worked on temporary easing of the union restrictions in California. If that hadn’t worked he would have worked at getting ships to go to other ports.

Don’t forget that his administration accomplished amazing things at getting manufacturers and retailers to to serve the public in incredible ways during the early days of the pandemic. The testing mechanism, the hundreds of thousands of ventilators built, Operation Warp Speed… How much of that is accomplished as quickly as it was under a Biden Administration?

No, Trump’s problems were always what he said, not what he did.

The really sad and scary part of all of this, in my opinion? I don’t think a Republican can win on a national level anymore without breaking the rules like Trump did. If Trump had acted like we all would have wanted him to act, we would be in Hilary’s second term right now.

[89th]

@klaus said in RIP, Colin Powell:

I'm not a fan of Biden. My hope for the US is that the GOP finds a new candidate for the next election and wins. A principled and serious candidate who tries to unite and not divide. Conservative but not tea party.

Agreed. Kasich was a good example of this in 2016. The problem is the primary process rewards candidates like Trump when its so fragmented or crowded on the stage. As @Jolly said, I very much could see Trump winning the next primary round because of this very dynamic.