A Woke Thought Experiment
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wrote on 25 Jun 2021, 03:02 last edited by
See, if you push “Downs Syndrome Kids Lives Matter” people are going to assume it’s a Pro-Life agenda and not legitimate political and societal debate.
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wrote on 25 Jun 2021, 03:24 last edited by
I've seen two Down's syndrome people cast in 'normal' roles recently. One was cast as a grade school lunch room bully, in a role written as if he was a typical brute with an adolescent version of toxic masculinity. No reference or so much as a nod to the Downs syndrome. I can't remember what movie that was, but I recognized the casting intention to 'normalize' people like that. The second one was in a show called Loudermilk, where the guy with Down's plays a wise guy con man.
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See, if you push “Downs Syndrome Kids Lives Matter” people are going to assume it’s a Pro-Life agenda and not legitimate political and societal debate.
wrote on 25 Jun 2021, 03:29 last edited by@lufins-dad said in A Woke Thought Experiment:
See, if you push “Downs Syndrome Kids Lives Matter” people are going to assume it’s a Pro-Life agenda and not legitimate political and societal debate.
No need to further isolate it by saying "kids," though.
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I've seen two Down's syndrome people cast in 'normal' roles recently. One was cast as a grade school lunch room bully, in a role written as if he was a typical brute with an adolescent version of toxic masculinity. No reference or so much as a nod to the Downs syndrome. I can't remember what movie that was, but I recognized the casting intention to 'normalize' people like that. The second one was in a show called Loudermilk, where the guy with Down's plays a wise guy con man.
wrote on 25 Jun 2021, 03:43 last edited by@horace said in A Woke Thought Experiment:
I've seen two Down's syndrome people cast in 'normal' roles recently. One was cast as a grade school lunch room bully, in a role written as if he was a typical brute with an adolescent version of toxic masculinity. No reference or so much as a nod to the Downs syndrome. I can't remember what movie that was, but I recognized the casting intention to 'normalize' people like that. The second one was in a show called Loudermilk, where the guy with Down's plays a wise guy con man.
That just further proves the point, though. Blind actors play blind characters, no problem. Same with deaf actors, actors in wheelchairs, etc., etc. Why make Down's Syndrome actors appear differently? Because we have no idea what the hell we're doing in terms of treating them fairly.
The thing is, we aren't comparing social justice apples to social justice apples. We're comparing a social justice narrative to a social taboo, which I don't think the woke community has had to grapple with.
And anyway, I think taboo wins out. Fear of the unknown > scripted outrage.
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wrote on 25 Jun 2021, 03:52 last edited by
Another fun one:
I was in an Arlington Starbucks a long while back, and a dude with Tourette's was sitting by himself. His primary tick was a racial slur. You could tell he was grappling with himself each time, but the harder he was trying to keep it in, the louder the next one was.
This was about 10 years or so ago. I'd absolutely love to know how he's getting on in public or at work these days. My guess is, he's one SJW-fueled HR complaint away from a discrimination windfall.
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@lufins-dad said in A Woke Thought Experiment:
@aqua-letifer said in A Woke Thought Experiment:
@jon-nyc said in A Woke Thought Experiment:
Nope.
Only ‘black trans lives’ or ‘black muslim lives’ would be allowed there.
But if you say black lives matter more than X, by their own logic, then X isn't important. It means they have no empathy for X whatsoever.
X can't be an empty set.
Palestinian?
Trans Palestinian.
I honestly think disabilities are the way to go.
- It's a virtue-signaling curveball. The wokes haven't had time to round the wagons and craft a narrative about them yet.
- And they never will. You might live in White America, but you've seen Denzel movies, know rap and blues music exists, have seen black athletes, etc. When's the last time you saw anyone with Down's Syndrome in the movies? On Spotify? In a Nike commercial? In a video game?
- Which, ironically, makes the point legitimate. Disabled folks definitely have to put up with a more potent pile of bullshit. If they aren't completely ignored by the media, the job market and just folk on the street, they're the center of a massive public debate about whether they should be having sex. It's kinda fucked up.
I think you could make a case that even wokes couldn't manipulate.
wrote on 25 Jun 2021, 10:57 last edited by@aqua-letifer said in A Woke Thought Experiment:
I honestly think disabilities are the way to go.
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I think you could make a case that even wokes couldn't manipulate.No, the BLM movement stems from disproportionately more black people getting killed by law enforcement. To one-up that demographic subgroup on the BLM metric, you need to identify another demographic subgroup that gets killed even more disproportionately by law enforcement. Even if you argue that it’s just perception, you still need to find another subgroup that is perceived to have been killed by law enforcement more disproportionately than black people have been.
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@aqua-letifer said in A Woke Thought Experiment:
I honestly think disabilities are the way to go.
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I think you could make a case that even wokes couldn't manipulate.No, the BLM movement stems from disproportionately more black people getting killed by law enforcement. To one-up that demographic subgroup on the BLM metric, you need to identify another demographic subgroup that gets killed even more disproportionately by law enforcement. Even if you argue that it’s just perception, you still need to find another subgroup that is perceived to have been killed by law enforcement more disproportionately than black people have been.
wrote on 25 Jun 2021, 11:11 last edited by@axtremus said in A Woke Thought Experiment:
No, the BLM movement stems from disproportionately more black people getting killed by law enforcement.
Proportionate to what?
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@axtremus said in A Woke Thought Experiment:
No, the BLM movement stems from disproportionately more black people getting killed by law enforcement.
Proportionate to what?
wrote on 25 Jun 2021, 11:47 last edited by@jon-nyc said in A Woke Thought Experiment:
@axtremus said in A Woke Thought Experiment:
No, the BLM movement stems from disproportionately more black people getting killed by law enforcement.
Proportionate to what?
I think this is what Ax is referring to.
https://www.the-sun.com/entertainment/1417426/unarmed-black-people-killed-police-blm/
Of the 765 people killed by police in 2020, 28 percent of them have been black people - despite comprising only 13 percent of the US population.
Which conveniently ignores this
Writing for The Wall Street Journal last year, she asserted that the rate of black suspects shot fatally by the police is “a function of” how often they commit crime. Because they commit the majority of crime, they therefore have the most dealings with the police.
“In 2018, the latest year for which such data have been published, African-Americans made up 53% of known homicide offenders in the U.S. and commit[ed] about 60% of robberies, though they are 13% of the population,” she wrote.
Yet of the 996 fatal police shootings in 2018, only 209, or 21 percent, involved black suspects, meaning, according to Mac Donald, that the share of black suspects shot by the police was in fact “less than what the black crime rate would predict.”
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wrote on 25 Jun 2021, 11:50 last edited by
Here’s another question for Ax, how many more black people died and are crime victims due to all of the actions against police and their quitting???
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@horace said in A Woke Thought Experiment:
I've seen two Down's syndrome people cast in 'normal' roles recently. One was cast as a grade school lunch room bully, in a role written as if he was a typical brute with an adolescent version of toxic masculinity. No reference or so much as a nod to the Downs syndrome. I can't remember what movie that was, but I recognized the casting intention to 'normalize' people like that. The second one was in a show called Loudermilk, where the guy with Down's plays a wise guy con man.
That just further proves the point, though. Blind actors play blind characters, no problem. Same with deaf actors, actors in wheelchairs, etc., etc. Why make Down's Syndrome actors appear differently? Because we have no idea what the hell we're doing in terms of treating them fairly.
The thing is, we aren't comparing social justice apples to social justice apples. We're comparing a social justice narrative to a social taboo, which I don't think the woke community has had to grapple with.
And anyway, I think taboo wins out. Fear of the unknown > scripted outrage.
wrote on 25 Jun 2021, 11:59 last edited by@aqua-letifer said in A Woke Thought Experiment:
@horace said in A Woke Thought Experiment:
I've seen two Down's syndrome people cast in 'normal' roles recently. One was cast as a grade school lunch room bully, in a role written as if he was a typical brute with an adolescent version of toxic masculinity. No reference or so much as a nod to the Downs syndrome. I can't remember what movie that was, but I recognized the casting intention to 'normalize' people like that. The second one was in a show called Loudermilk, where the guy with Down's plays a wise guy con man.
That just further proves the point, though. Blind actors play blind characters, no problem. Same with deaf actors, actors in wheelchairs, etc., etc. Why make Down's Syndrome actors appear differently? Because we have no idea what the hell we're doing in terms of treating them fairly.
The thing is, we aren't comparing social justice apples to social justice apples. We're comparing a social justice narrative to a social taboo, which I don't think the woke community has had to grapple with.
And anyway, I think taboo wins out. Fear of the unknown > scripted outrage.
Here's the problem...BLM has nothing to do with social justice. The movement is inherently racist, because it seeks power; the power of supremacy. They don't want to be the equal of others or receive equal treatment. That's just a smokescreen.
There is nothing more important than them, for they are the top of the heap.
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@aqua-letifer said in A Woke Thought Experiment:
@horace said in A Woke Thought Experiment:
I've seen two Down's syndrome people cast in 'normal' roles recently. One was cast as a grade school lunch room bully, in a role written as if he was a typical brute with an adolescent version of toxic masculinity. No reference or so much as a nod to the Downs syndrome. I can't remember what movie that was, but I recognized the casting intention to 'normalize' people like that. The second one was in a show called Loudermilk, where the guy with Down's plays a wise guy con man.
That just further proves the point, though. Blind actors play blind characters, no problem. Same with deaf actors, actors in wheelchairs, etc., etc. Why make Down's Syndrome actors appear differently? Because we have no idea what the hell we're doing in terms of treating them fairly.
The thing is, we aren't comparing social justice apples to social justice apples. We're comparing a social justice narrative to a social taboo, which I don't think the woke community has had to grapple with.
And anyway, I think taboo wins out. Fear of the unknown > scripted outrage.
Here's the problem...BLM has nothing to do with social justice. The movement is inherently racist, because it seeks power; the power of supremacy. They don't want to be the equal of others or receive equal treatment. That's just a smokescreen.
There is nothing more important than them, for they are the top of the heap.
wrote on 25 Jun 2021, 12:13 last edited by Aqua Letifer@jolly said in A Woke Thought Experiment:
Here's the problem...BLM has nothing to do with social justice. The movement is inherently racist, because it seeks power; the power of supremacy. They don't want to be the equal of others or receive equal treatment. That's just a smokescreen.
There is nothing more important than them, for they are the top of the heap.Right, but you can't go around saying that shit. I think there's a way to call that out by making it obvious what their position actually is.
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wrote on 25 Jun 2021, 12:16 last edited by
I'm to the point in life, I pretty much say whatever.
Hell to be young.
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wrote on 25 Jun 2021, 15:20 last edited by
What percent of people killed by police were criminals?
What percent of criminals killed by police were of color?
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wrote on 25 Jun 2021, 15:34 last edited by
Best thread in quite a while. Bravo, Aqua.
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@jon-nyc said in A Woke Thought Experiment:
@axtremus said in A Woke Thought Experiment:
No, the BLM movement stems from disproportionately more black people getting killed by law enforcement.
Proportionate to what?
I think this is what Ax is referring to.
https://www.the-sun.com/entertainment/1417426/unarmed-black-people-killed-police-blm/
Of the 765 people killed by police in 2020, 28 percent of them have been black people - despite comprising only 13 percent of the US population.
Which conveniently ignores this
Writing for The Wall Street Journal last year, she asserted that the rate of black suspects shot fatally by the police is “a function of” how often they commit crime. Because they commit the majority of crime, they therefore have the most dealings with the police.
“In 2018, the latest year for which such data have been published, African-Americans made up 53% of known homicide offenders in the U.S. and commit[ed] about 60% of robberies, though they are 13% of the population,” she wrote.
Yet of the 996 fatal police shootings in 2018, only 209, or 21 percent, involved black suspects, meaning, according to Mac Donald, that the share of black suspects shot by the police was in fact “less than what the black crime rate would predict.”
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wrote on 25 Jun 2021, 18:07 last edited by
@jon-nyc said in A Woke Thought Experiment:
That was my point.
Sovereign is he who sets the null hypothesis.
Hypothesis is a funny word for an ever-changing position that is exactly as quantifiable as it needs to be at any moment, to support pop cultural messaging around a pre-ordained conclusion that "everybody who doesn't vote left is racist".
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wrote on 25 Jun 2021, 18:13 last edited by
In this case the null hypothesis I'm referring to has been pretty stable - that police interactions should be expected to be proportional to population percentages not weighted by levels of criminality. Same hypothesis is getting traction with school discipline too.
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In this case the null hypothesis I'm referring to has been pretty stable - that police interactions should be expected to be proportional to population percentages not weighted by levels of criminality. Same hypothesis is getting traction with school discipline too.
wrote on 25 Jun 2021, 18:19 last edited by@jon-nyc said in A Woke Thought Experiment:
In this case the null hypothesis I'm referring to has been pretty stable - that police interactions should be expected to be proportional to population percentages not weighted by levels of criminality. Same hypothesis is getting traction with school discipline too.
Sure, equal outcomes for all groups will be a safely stable goal, which will indicate the necessity for progressive politics for the lifetimes of everybody alive today, and long thereafter.
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wrote on 25 Jun 2021, 18:35 last edited by
"BLACK LIVES CAN'T MATTER UNTIL HALF LIVES MATTER."
Radioactive, baby!
"BLACK LIVES CAN'T MATTER UNTIL FLETCH LIVES MATTERS."
I saw that thing sitting in Blockbuster so many times, and I never, ever borrowed it.
Go ahead, cancel my subscription.
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"BLACK LIVES CAN'T MATTER UNTIL HALF LIVES MATTER."
Radioactive, baby!
"BLACK LIVES CAN'T MATTER UNTIL FLETCH LIVES MATTERS."
I saw that thing sitting in Blockbuster so many times, and I never, ever borrowed it.
Go ahead, cancel my subscription.
wrote on 25 Jun 2021, 18:40 last edited by@doctor-phibes said in A Woke Thought Experiment:
"BLACK LIVES CAN'T MATTER UNTIL HALF LIVES MATTER."
Make it black half-lives.
Then we can apply Zeno's paradox and declare progress impossible.
