Dr. Fauci apparently paid for the creation of covid-19

[Loki]

@jolly said in Dr. Fauci apparently paid for the creation of covid-19:

We, the U.S. taxpayer, put money into the Wuhan lab. Period.

Gain of Function research was going on in the Wuhan lab. Period.

That is an amazing allegation and I won’t dismiss it out of hand. Let’s see if it was a one night riff or something that has legs. I’d love A Glenn Greenwood on the case.

[Renauda]

Taxpayers money went into a foreign research lab on something or another that undoubtedly involved a legitmate US based partner!

Oh, the harumpfing indignation of it all!

It happens all the time the world over.

[Copper]

@doctor-phibes said in Dr. Fauci apparently paid for the creation of covid-19:

I think your bullshit detector might be in need of calibration.

Read it if you dare!

It is pretty straight-forward public information.

NIH paid EcoHealth Alliance

Dr. Fauci is the boss

EcoHealth Alliance paid the Wuhan lab

https://www.npr.org/sections/goatsandsoda/2020/08/29/907237520/group-whose-nih-grant-for-virus-research-was-revoked-just-got-a-new-grant

The National Institutes of Health has awarded a grant worth $7.5 million over five years to EcoHealth Alliance, a U.S.-based nonprofit that hunts emerging viruses. The award comes months after NIH revoked an earlier grant to EcoHealth, a move scientists widely decried as the politically motivated quashing of research vital to preventing the next coronavirus pandemic.

EcoHealth's bat research in China was entirely funded through the $3.7 million NIH grant. A small portion — about $76,000 per year — was used to pay the Wuhan lab for its on-the-ground work.

Funded by NIH

Let's go to the NIH web site and see who is the director?

https://www.niaid.nih.gov/about/director

A familiar face!

https://www.npr.org/sections/goatsandsoda/2020/04/29/847948272/why-the-u-s-government-stopped-funding-a-research-project-on-bats-and-coronaviru

Why The U.S. Government Stopped Funding A Research Project On Bats And Coronaviruses

The U.S. government has suddenly terminated funding for a years-long research project in China that many experts say is vital to preventing the next major coronavirus outbreak.

Nonetheless, at an April 17 news conference, President Trump said he had given instructions to check if any U.S. funding was slated for the Wuhan Institute, and if so, he said, it would immediately be terminated. Days later, on April 24, the National Institutes of Health, or NIH — which was providing the grant for the project — notified EcoHealth Alliance that the money was being canceled, as first reported by Politico.

[Jolly]

@loki said in Dr. Fauci apparently paid for the creation of covid-19:

@jolly said in Dr. Fauci apparently paid for the creation of covid-19:

We, the U.S. taxpayer, put money into the Wuhan lab. Period.

Gain of Function research was going on in the Wuhan lab. Period.

That is an amazing allegation and I won’t dismiss it out of hand. Let’s see if it was a one night riff or something that has legs. I’d love A Glenn Greenwood on the case.

I don't consider it an allegation. AFAIK, those are facts.

[Jolly]

@renauda said in Dr. Fauci apparently paid for the creation of covid-19:

Taxpayers money went into a foreign research lab on something or another that undoubtedly involved a legitmate US based partner!

Oh, the harumpfing indignation of it all!

It happens all the time the world over.

But it doesn't usually generate a world-wide pandemic.

In this case, that is a distinct possibility. Not proven beyond a shadow of a doubt, but a distinct possibility.

I don't think the ultimate goal of this is to eviscerate Fauci, as much as it is to pin the tail on the Chinese donkey...

[Axtremus]

@copper said in Dr. Fauci apparently paid for the creation of covid-19:

It is pretty straight-forward public information.
NIH paid EcoHealth Alliance
Dr. Fauci is the boss
EcoHealth Alliance paid the Wuhan lab

The funding for EcoHealth Alliance/Wuhan lab was re-approved in 2019 under the Trump administration. So, really, it’s Trump’s fault.

[Jolly]

Everything else is.

[taiwan_girl]

@axtremus said in Dr. Fauci apparently paid for the creation of covid-19:

@copper said in Dr. Fauci apparently paid for the creation of covid-19:

It is pretty straight-forward public information.
NIH paid EcoHealth Alliance
Dr. Fauci is the boss
EcoHealth Alliance paid the Wuhan lab

The funding for EcoHealth Alliance/Wuhan lab was re-approved in 2019 under the Trump administration. So, really, it’s Trump’s fault.

No, you move down the line until you come to a Democrat. At that point, you stop and that is the person that gets the blame.

[Loki]

Reading more I feel like the debate over this topic has been had here a while ago. Nevertheless I don’t believe there is any breaking news here.

[Jolly]

@taiwan_girl said in Dr. Fauci apparently paid for the creation of covid-19:

@axtremus said in Dr. Fauci apparently paid for the creation of covid-19:

@copper said in Dr. Fauci apparently paid for the creation of covid-19:

It is pretty straight-forward public information.
NIH paid EcoHealth Alliance
Dr. Fauci is the boss
EcoHealth Alliance paid the Wuhan lab

The funding for EcoHealth Alliance/Wuhan lab was re-approved in 2019 under the Trump administration. So, really, it’s Trump’s fault.

No, you move down the line until you come to a Democrat. At that point, you stop and that is the person that gets the blame.

Aren't you the same person that was poo-pooing this just a few posts above?

[taiwan_girl]

@jolly said in Dr. Fauci apparently paid for the creation of covid-19:

@taiwan_girl said in Dr. Fauci apparently paid for the creation of covid-19:

@axtremus said in Dr. Fauci apparently paid for the creation of covid-19:

@copper said in Dr. Fauci apparently paid for the creation of covid-19:

It is pretty straight-forward public information.
NIH paid EcoHealth Alliance
Dr. Fauci is the boss
EcoHealth Alliance paid the Wuhan lab

The funding for EcoHealth Alliance/Wuhan lab was re-approved in 2019 under the Trump administration. So, really, it’s Trump’s fault.

No, you move down the line until you come to a Democrat. At that point, you stop and that is the person that gets the blame.

Aren't you the same person that was poo-pooing this just a few posts above?

Yep, I still dont believe it is true. Does the US provide funding for various projects? Yes.

Did the Chinese come to Dr. Fauci and say, "Hey, we are going to develop a biological weapon that we will use on the western world. Can we have some money from you?"

Dr. Fauci "That is a great idea. On behalf of the US, here is a bunch of money"

I have been involved with development projects in different countries, and the source of the project money may be coming from sources such at US and China at the same time. They may know the general scope of the project. When looking for grants and funding, oftentimes, the grant application is written quite broad to appeal to the largest group of funders. For example, "Research to help lower infection rate among villagers in rural Indonesia" So, a lab gets funding from the US and China. Could some of that research be on viruses? Sure. Could a "rouge" sub-group take that research further and for bad means? Sure.

HOWEVER, I AM NOT SAYING THAT IS WHAT HAPPENED IN THIS CASE.

[Jolly]

Don't misconstrue the facts.

Has anybody said Fauci told them to weaponize a virus? No. But we do know the money was sent under his watch and possibly with his direct approval for Gain of Function research.

Do we know the virus was the product of the Wuhan lab? Not definitively. But we are starting to have a clearer picture, pixel by pixel, fact by fact.

[Axtremus]

@jolly said in Dr. Fauci apparently paid for the creation of covid-19:

Don't misconstrue the facts.

Good advise, especially for Tucker Carlson.

[Jolly]

@axtremus said in Dr. Fauci apparently paid for the creation of covid-19:

@jolly said in Dr. Fauci apparently paid for the creation of covid-19:

Don't misconstrue the facts.

Good advise, especially for Tucker Carlson.

Also good advise not to ignore facts when they are presented to you.

[Copper]

@taiwan_girl said in Dr. Fauci apparently paid for the creation of covid-19:

Did the Chinese come to Dr. Fauci and say, "Hey, we are going to develop a biological weapon that we will use on the western world. Can we have some money from you?"

Of course not

Nobody is saying that, not even Tucker

Is he the boss of the organization that funded research in the Wuhan lab?

Yes

Is there something wrong with that? At the time, I don't know. In hindsight, yes obviously developing covid-19 is not a great idea.

Denying the well documented events and relationships is just plain stupid. Dr. Fauci is making a mistake doing that.

He should just tell the straight story.

[taiwan_girl]

@copper said in Dr. Fauci apparently paid for the creation of covid-19:

Is he the boss of the organization that funded research in the Wuhan lab?

The NIH is part of the US Department of Health and Human Services. That was headed by Alex Azar, who was appointed by (GASP!!!) President Trump!!!

[Jolly]

@taiwan_girl said in Dr. Fauci apparently paid for the creation of covid-19:

@copper said in Dr. Fauci apparently paid for the creation of covid-19:

Is he the boss of the organization that funded research in the Wuhan lab?

The NIH is part of the US Department of Health and Human Services. That was headed by Alex Azar, who was appointed by (GASP!!!) President Trump!!!

Thank you for admitting Fauci ok'd the money.

[Copper]

@taiwan_girl said in Dr. Fauci apparently paid for the creation of covid-19:

@copper said in Dr. Fauci apparently paid for the creation of covid-19:

Is he the boss of the organization that funded research in the Wuhan lab?

The NIH is part of the US Department of Health and Human Services. That was headed by Alex Azar, who was appointed by (GASP!!!) President Trump!!!

Mr. Trump doesn’t deny it

Mr. Fauci does

[George K]

@copper said in Dr. Fauci apparently paid for the creation of covid-19:

Mr. Fauci does

Read the penultimate paragraph:

https://www.wsj.com/articles/scientists-demand-answers-on-covid-origins-11621011732?mod=djemBestOfTheWeb
=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=

Dr. Anthony Fauci can keep downplaying the possibility that the pandemic began at a Chinese lab partially funded by a grantee of his government institute. But even Dr. Fauci’s numerous media admirers cannot prevent scientists from asking appropriate questions about the Wuhan Institute of Virology.

“Top researchers are calling for a real investigation into the origin of covid-19” is the headline on a story in MIT Technology Review by Rowan Jacobsen. He writes:

A year ago, the idea that the covid-19 pandemic could have been caused by a laboratory accident was denounced as a conspiracy theory by the world’s leading journals, scientists, and news organizations.

But the origin of the virus that has killed millions remains a mystery, and the chance that it came from a lab has become the theory that cannot be put to rest.

Now, in a letter in the journal Science, 18 prominent biologists—including the world’s foremost coronavirus researcher—are lending their weight to calls for a new investigation of all possible origins of the virus, and calling on China’s laboratories and agencies to “open their records” to independent analysis.

The scientists want a real investigation because official inquiries to date have largely assumed that Covid’s origins are zoonotic, i.e., the virus moved from animals to humans. The new letter published in Science reads in part:

In May 2020, the World Health Assembly requested that the World Health Organization (WHO) director-general work closely with partners to determine the origins of SARS-CoV-2. In November, the Terms of Reference for a China–WHO joint study were released. The information, data, and samples for the study’s first phase were collected and summarized by the Chinese half of the team; the rest of the team built on this analysis. Although there were no findings in clear support of either a natural spillover or a lab accident, the team assessed a zoonotic spillover from an intermediate host as “likely to very likely,” and a laboratory incident as “extremely unlikely”. Furthermore, the two theories were not given balanced consideration. Only 4 of the 313 pages of the report and its annexes addressed the possibility of a laboratory accident...

We must take hypotheses about both natural and laboratory spillovers seriously until we have sufficient data. A proper investigation should be transparent, objective, data-driven, inclusive of broad expertise, subject to independent oversight, and responsibly managed to minimize the impact of conflicts of interest. Public health agencies and research laboratories alike need to open their records to the public. Investigators should document the veracity and provenance of data from which analyses are conducted and conclusions drawn, so that analyses are reproducible by independent experts.

The renowned scientists signing the letter include the University of North Carolina’s Ralph Baric, Harvard’s Marc Lipsitch, Yale’s Akiko Iwasaki, and Stanford’s David Relman. The MIT Technology Review account from Mr. Jacobsen notes:

Several of those signing the letter, including Lipsitch and Relman, have in the past called for greater scrutiny of “gain of function” research, in which viruses are genetically modified to make them more infectious or virulent. Experiments to engineer pathogens were also ongoing at the Wuhan Institute of Virology, China’s leading center for studying bat viruses similar to SARS-CoV-2. Some see the fact that covid-19 first appeared in the same city in which the lab is located as circumstantial evidence that a laboratory accident could be to blame.

The Journal’s Amy Dockser Marcus and Betsy McKay report:

“I wanted this to be addressed to my fellow colleagues, the working scientists, and use a venue they respect and see as a place for scientists to talk about science and the importance of science,” said Dr. Relman said of the debate over the pandemic’s origin. “Our message here is wherever the data takes us, thou shalt go, and only go to the degree that the data allow.”

James Gorman and Carl Zimmer add in the New York Times:

Michael Worobey, an evolutionary biologist at the University of Arizona, said he signed the new letter because “the recent W.H.O. report on the origins of the virus, and its discussion, spurred several of us to get in touch with each other and talk about our shared desire for dispassionate investigation of the origins of the virus.”

...Another signer, Sarah E. Cobey, an epidemiologist and evolutionary biologist at the University of Chicago, said, “I think it is more likely than not that SARS-CoV-2 emerged from an animal reservoir rather than a lab.”
But “lab accidents do happen and can have disastrous consequences,” she added. “I am concerned about the short- and long-term consequences of failing to evaluate the possibility of laboratory escape in a rigorous way. It would be a troublesome precedent.”

Among both scientists and non-scientists, a substantial number of people regard as troublesome the whole idea of gain-of-function research. Engineering deadly monsters to learn how to defeat them in case they ever occur naturally may seem like the stuff of science fiction, or at least intellectual hubris.

Yet over the years a number of prominent U.S. government scientists have advocated for the creation of such demons of our own design. In 2011 Dr. Fauci co-authored an op-ed in the Washington Post:

Working carefully with influenza viruses they have engineered in isolated biocontainment laboratories, scientists in Europe and the United States have identified several mechanisms by which the virus might evolve to transmit efficiently in the ferret, the best animal model for human influenza infection. This research has allowed identification of genetic pathways by which such a virus could better adapt to transmission among people. This laboratory virus does not exist in nature. There is, however, considerable concern that such a virus could evolve naturally. We cannot predict whether it or something similar will arise naturally, nor when or where it might appear.

Given these uncertainties, important information and insights can come from generating a potentially dangerous virus in the laboratory... The scientists, journal editors and funding agencies involved are working together to ensure that access to specific information that could be used to create dangerous pathogens is limited to those with an established and legitimate need to know.

The Wuhan Institute of Virology received some funding from Dr. Fauci’s National Institute of Allergy and Infectious Diseases via a U.S. group called EcoHealth Alliance. Now the Fauci institute is answering a question about whether the Wuhan lab did any gain-of-function research by saying, “It is impossible for us to be aware of nor can we account for all of their activities.”

The whole world has a legitimate need to know what happened in that laboratory.